Hence he got 100K less a year.
- corduroy

WOW yeah he’s so much cheaper whewwwe

You honestly don't think he can play on any teams third pair? That's laughable. Ask Detroit, Edmonton, or Chicago if they agree.
- ClaudeFather

I didnt say he couldn't. I just dont think he should. He can play on our 3rd pair but the results aren't pretty

I didnt say he couldn't. I just dont think he should. He can play on our 3rd pair but the results aren't pretty
- bulet13

He does because he can, therefore he should. Stop this nonsense.

He does because he can, therefore he should. Stop this nonsense.
- ClaudeFather

That's a nonesense argument you just made. Just because someone does doesn't mean they should

Just like the other poster, you seem to be tied to the technicality of the word legitimate rather than the idea of what I was trying to convey, which is I dont believe that Hagg deserves a full time roster spot on an NHL team. If you're nitpicking about the word I used, then fine I will concede that maybe legitimate was not the best word to use. But you're arguing only on semantics. Sub useful or beneficial or good for legitimate if that makes you feel better
- bulet13

Tied to the technicality? Seriously? LMAO!

Nitpicking on the word used? Seriously? Semantics? Seriously?

How can you not understand the difference of "I don't think that Haag is a good player" , which is an OPINION. Versus Haag is a legitimate NHL player, which is a FACT! That's not semantics. How can you not understand the distinct difference there? Between fact and opinion.

Tied to the technicality? Seriously? LMAO!

Nitpicking on the word used? Seriously? Semantics? Seriously?

How can you not understand the difference of "I don't think that Haag is a good player" , which is an OPINION. Versus Haag is a legitimate NHL player, which is a FACT! That's not semantics. How can you not understand the distinct difference there? Between fact and opinion.
- MJL

You are using games played as a proxy for legitimate
I am using ability

If you want me to say "By definition of having played xxx games in the league, Hagg is a legitimate NHL defenseman" then fine, I will say that if it will end this argument. That was not the point i was trying to make and I think you and everyone else knows that, bad choice of words notwithstanding. By your definition he is a "legitimate" defenseman. We can put this silly argument to rest

But I do not believe he possess NHL level skills, as of the past two years. I know he is young and can still improve. But he has shown me nothing to warrant me wanting him to play regular minutes for the hockey team I cheer for. I have nothing against Hagg and in glad he has carved out a career for himself. I just wish it was for another team

You are using games played as a proxy for legitimate
I am using ability


- bulet13

Either way, you're wrong. He made it to the NHL. He is under contract to play in the NHL with an NHL team. You don't make it to the NHL without having the ability to play in the NHL. Simple fact.

If you want me to say "By definition of having played xxx games in the league, Hagg is a legitimate NHL defenseman" then fine, I will say that if it will end this argument. That was not the point i was trying to make and I think you and everyone else knows that, bad choice of words notwithstanding. By your definition he is a "legitimate" defenseman. We can put this silly argument to rest


- bulet13

By anyone's definition he is a legitimate NHL player. That's what the facts say. It's not a silly argument. It was meant to make a point. One I made quite effectively.

But I do not believe he possess NHL level skills, as of the past two years. I know he is young and can still improve. But he has shown me nothing to warrant me wanting him to play regular minutes for the hockey team I cheer for. I have nothing against Hagg and in glad he has carved out a career for himself. I just wish it was for another team
- bulet13

Again, a player does not make it to the NHL if he doesn't have NHL level skills. No opinion can change that.

Here is where I'll end it. You have an opinion on Haag. That's your right. Just as others had an opinion on Hayes. This should've ended with my initial reply to you and making a simple point.

Lee is also older and had a worse season on a better team while getting top pp minutes
- Richieattack18

Lee had a 40 goal, 62 point season prior to this season. Andras Lee is easily more gifted offensive then Kevin Hayes.

How good is Robert Hagg? a 5/6 guy? He's not top four. He is a bottom pairing player that I hope either gets better the next couple seasons or is phased out due to others' play. I don't see a high ceiling.
- ClaudeFather

I think Robert Hagg is a guy who plays every night. His abilities heading into his third season are still undecided. What I do know is, he’s one of our more physical guys, which is an area we lack in and he had a much improved season from his rookie year.

Is he strictly a third pair guy, I don’t know. Is he a first pair compliment to the legit number one like Chris Therrien or Brayden Coburn, I don’t think we know the answer to this yet. What I do know is, he’s solid in his own end and Hagg isn’t Brandon Manning.

Lee had a 40 goal, 62 point season prior to this season. Andras Lee is easily more gifted offensive then Kevin Hayes.
- SuperSchennBros

That was when he played with Tavares and Tavares got him fed. Didn't look good without him last season and the stats speak for themselves.

Lee had a 40 goal, 62 point season prior to this season. Andras Lee is easily more gifted offensive then Kevin Hayes.
- SuperSchennBros

We went through this last month. You can stats that say Hayes is better O side, you can make the case Lee is, what is true is that are very close

That was when he played with Tavares and Tavares got him fed. Didn't look good without him last season and the stats speak for themselves.
- Richieattack18

I mean he was still only 2 goals shy of 30. I wouldnt say he looked bad. You also have to consider the change in style for the team as well. Isles were a much more discipline team this season committing to defense.

Either way, you're wrong. He made it to the NHL. He is under contract to play in the NHL with an NHL team. You don't make it to the NHL without having the ability to play in the NHL. Simple fact.



By anyone's definition he is a legitimate NHL player. That's what the facts say. It's not a silly argument. It was meant to make a point. One I made quite effectively.



Again, a player does not make it to the NHL if he doesn't have NHL level skills. No opinion can change that.

Here is where I'll end it. You have an opinion on Haag. That's your right. Just as others had an opinion on Hayes. This should've ended with my initial reply to you and making a simple point.
- MJL

I was never arguing the other guys view of Hayes as not being a 1c. In fact I mentioned many times I dont see Hagg as a 1c. He was arguing that by playing on a teams first line he was a first line caliber player. So I'm not sure why you keep bringing that argument up since its completely different from this one

I disagree with his evaluation of Hayes as a 3c, but that wasn't the argument.

I was never arguing the other guys view of Hayes as not being a 1c. In fact I mentioned many times I dont see Hagg as a 1c. He was arguing that by playing on a teams first line he was a first line caliber player. So I'm not sure why you keep bringing that argument up since its completely different from this one

I disagree with his evaluation of Hayes as a 3c, but that wasn't the argument.
- bulet13

You're mistaken in what I'm bringing up and what I'm not bringing up. It has nothing to do with any of that.

You're mistaken in what I'm bringing up and what I'm not bringing up. It has nothing to do with any of that.
- MJL

Alright this argument has reached the end of its lifecycle. Onto the next one

*shakes hand*

Alright this argument has reached the end of its lifecycle. Onto the next one

*shakes hand*
- bulet13

Buys you an online beer.

I wonder why its taking a while to sign TK. I feel like has is pretty straightforward. Do you think the two sides are just debating whether to do a bridge deal or long term?

I wonder why its taking a while to sign TK. I feel like has is pretty straightforward. Do you think the two sides are just debating whether to do a bridge deal or long term?
- bulet13

I almost see it as they for certain want to lock Provy long term and would like to do the same to TK but need to make sure they can lock up Provy long term and will lock up TK with a bridge if they don’t think they can fit them both in long term.

Or...more then likely

They just need to take care of Laughton first because of hearing. Now they are banging away at it.

Buys you an online beer.

- MJL

Glad you guys made up.

Now.. how does this online beer thing work?

Oh I forgot you don’t pay people based on their most recent year. That’s why simmonds got 10mil. Oh wait... 😂
- Richieattack18

So nice of you to gloss over the fact you use "xx Liner" in your post.

As I said, If something supports an argument it is good, when it does not it is bad

I almost see it as they for certain want to lock Provy long term and would like to do the same to TK but need to make sure they can lock up Provy long term and will lock up TK with a bridge if they don’t think they can fit them both in long term.

Or...more then likely

They just need to take care of Laughton first because of hearing. Now they are banging away at it.
- peesinwind

Laughton is already signed.

I didnt say he couldn't. I just dont think he should. He can play on our 3rd pair but the results aren't pretty
- bulet13

So there are Defensive "pairs" but no forward lines?

Makes sense

WOW yeah he’s so much cheaper whewwwe
- Richieattack18

Yeah. Lee and Hayes are two different players but I see them having similar value.

Not sure the value is better or worse. Lee’s doesn’t end until he is 35 (did I count that right?) without looking up his birthdate. Any who, he is older. Think the value of both signings is the going market. Think they will both help make their teams better for many years.

I can say I’m sure that I’m looking at this with orange colored glasses. That is just who I am. But if I’m telling the truth I just like Hayes because AV and Fletcher wanted him for a reason and they do know what they are getting. So I’m positive about it.

Yeah. Lee and Hayes are two different players but I see them having similar value.

Not sure the value is better or worse. Lee’s doesn’t end until he is 35 (did I count that right?) without looking up his birthdate. Any who, he is older. Think the value of both signings is the going market. Think they will both help make their teams better for many years.

I can say I’m sure that I’m looking at this with orange colored glasses. That is just who I am. But if I’m telling the truth I just like Hayes because AV and Fletcher wanted him for a reason and they do know what they are getting. So I’m positive about it.
- peesinwind

In my opinion, Lee is the better goal scorer but Hayes is the better all around player.

Laughton is already signed.
- MJL

Yeah sorry. Wasn’t clear enough. Like they didn’t make Head way before but now since he is signed have put some focus on it.