See I see the foolishness in a guy like Marleau at that age. Also the Nylander deal is tough.
- J35Bacher

Hayes is not nearly as old but a player like Hayes is the Flyers "Marleau". When all is said and done and the Flyers hopefully get to where they need to get, in all likelihood Hayes is a player they're not going to need with a significant cap hit.

Not really.

The Nylander deal is the one that hurts. And Marleau making alsmot 6.5 is a little tough for his age.

You pay guys like Tavares and Matthews. Nylander making almost 7 million hurts.
- J35Bacher

So when TK and Patrick break out and we have to pay them (and Provy should be fun this summer too) where will we be if we start bringing in over priced FAs? And that is what all FAs are...very few are signed at their value against the cap...RFA is a different game now...the guys are not taking bridge deals and they are demanding to get paid and take them out to FA...the agents and players got smart...teams have to stay patient and smart, especially with the number of young players the flyers might need to sign in the upcoming years...

So when TK and Patrick break out and we have to pay them (and Provy should be fun this summer too) where will we be if we start bringing in over priced FAs? And that is what all FAs are...very few are signed at their value against the cap...RFA is a different game now...the guys are not taking bridge deals and they are demanding to get paid and take them out to FA...the agents and players got smart...teams have to stay patient and smart, especially with the number of young players the flyers might need to sign in the upcoming years...
- JW98FlyerFan

Our RFA's, if all are signed, is going to be about 20 million this summer imo.

Hayes is not nearly as old but a player like Hayes is the Flyers "Marleau". When all is said and done and the Flyers hopefully get to where they need to get, in all likelihood Hayes is a player they're not going to need with a significant cap hit.
- MJL

So Hayes will be that guy but you were totally ok with Simmonds playing into his 30's? Voracek and Giroux continuing to be impactful into their 30's?

Our RFA's, if all are signed, is going to be about 20 million this summer imo.
- MBFlyerfan

That is probably a good guess and because the well was dry for so long our RFA groups will be in 2s and 3s per year and you can't sign all those guys if you are stuff with some bloated contracts and trying to keep the compete window open.

Keeping the pipeline of ELC talent is very important, especially once your team develops and the younger players become better and all need more expensive deals. One less first round pick and prospect gone is potentially less coming to your team. Also you have players like Frost and others. Let's say Patrick breaks out and Frost is a player, now along with Couturier, you have your 3 centers. Now lets say due to your good young players now having bigger cap hits, you're up against the Cap and with some declining older players. Maybe you're not quite good enough and need to fill a spot at another position. You now have less flexibility to fill the need that actually presented itself once your team was truly in that spot of true contention. Yea, you could try and trade some players like O'Reilly but that can come with other issues.

I want to emphasize that I don't think anyone who thinks they should try and win now is wrong per se. I just don't think it's the right time or the right way to go about it. Again, everything could break your way but I'd rather have the chance to have everything break my way over a 7-8 year period versus a 2-3 year period.
- MJL

If we are waiting until Frost and Farabee come into their own we may as well trade Jake and JVR now. There's no right way, just waiting and waitng for guys on ELC is not the right way. Could be a way but idk if the timing will be right for Philly.

Our RFA's, if all are signed, is going to be about 20 million this summer imo.
- MBFlyerfan

That's this Summer. What if Patrick breaks out and Lindblom has a strong season. Then Hart follows, etc. The cap space the Flyers have should be reserved for those players.

That's this Summer. What if Patrick breaks out and Lindblom has a strong season. Then Hart follows, etc. The cap space the Flyers have should be reserved for those players.
- MJL

Why not trade Jake and JVR and maybe even G then? What if Frost and Farabee break out?

So Hayes will be that guy but you were totally ok with Simmonds playing into his 30's? Voracek and Giroux continuing to be impactful into their 30's?
- J35Bacher

G has proved the last 2 years he can do it and he is 31 and Jake is still going strong and one of the best pure playmakers we have...

G has proved the last 2 years he can do it and he is 31 and Jake is still going strong and one of the best pure playmakers we have...
- JW98FlyerFan

Trading Giroux is off the table obviously but a smart hockey trade of a player like Voracek similar to the Carter and Richards trades is not a bad idea if they could find the right deal.

G has proved the last 2 years he can do it and he is 31 and Jake is still going strong and one of the best pure playmakers we have...
- JW98FlyerFan

But we are waiting another 2-3 years.

We aren't ready yet.

By kind of kicking the can down the road there really isn't a right time.

But we are waiting another 2-3 years.

We aren't ready yet.

By kind of kicking the can down the road there really isn't a right time.
- J35Bacher

Personally, I think Giroux has at least 5 really strong years left if he can stay relatively healthy.

Why not trade Jake and JVR and maybe even G then? What if Frost and Farabee break out?
- ClaudeFather

I am sure management is playing with all of those ideas, but they also have to keep people in the seats...so there is a balance they have to play with that doesn't just have to do with the team that is one the ice...The window to blow it up was 3 to 5 years ago...that ship has sailed...

Trading Giroux is off the table obviously but a smart hockey trade of a player like Voracek similar to the Carter and Richards trades is not a bad idea if they could find the right deal.
- MJL

That's the one i feel needs to be looked at as it clears some cap and the right deal can fill needs just like the Carter and Richards deals without taking away from the long term plan

Personally, I think Giroux has at least 5 really strong years left if he can stay relatively healthy.
- MJL

I can see it with Giroux on the wing and maybe he starts to get less PK time.

Voracek and van Reimsdyk would be pieces I wouldn't be against in a good hockey deal.

He's got the blow covered.
- PLindbergh31

Thanks for clearing that up for everyone.

The entire 2C 'need' is self-inflicted.

Giroux, Couturier, Patrick... 1, 2, 3.
- Tomahawk

Giroux is better on the wing, Giroux prefers playing the wing, Giroux is a year older.

No.

A player at or approaching the end of his prime that's game is patterned off of being a diminutive but elite skill player doesn't need the wear and tear responsibilities of center.
- Lip_Out

Great, this story again.

Smaller centers have no problem staying in the middle and producing well into their 30's. See: Crosby, Sakic, Pavelski, Saku Koivu, Plekanec, Andrew Cassels, Marc Savard, Datsyuk, Zetterberg, etc.

The trick is to start lightening their load defensively, especially on the PK. The Flyers are still a team that spends too much time in their own zone, so G will be seeing wear and tear no matter if he's at C or LW. Dzone coverage is fluid... the days of the C doing all the heavy lifting are over.

And G lined up at C over 1164 times this past season and 1088 times the season before. It's not like he's strictly doing winger stuff only.

That proposed move also fixes one problem and creates another, who's your first line left-winger? JVR? At even strength? No thanks.
- Lip_Out

I agree you want to keep JVR on a soft matchup at ES.

TK and Lindblom are LW options, tho. Laughton can play wing on a checking line. Don't forget Rubstov. And Farabee has an outside shot at making the team.

Giroux and Couturier play fantastic together 5on5. It's not the move to shift Giroux back.
- Lip_Out

They do.

But they're also the two biggest 'makes their linemates better' types on the team. Stacking them up means you're gonna have more trouble getting L2-L3 to go.

It's not a permanent problem either, since Morgan Frost isn't too far away. Once he cracks the lineup, you can move G back to LW if you want, w/o being hamstrung w/ somebody like Hayes at 6x6, 7x7, or whatever.

Lindblom just scored 17 playing all over the lineup this year.

Consistent top 9 minutes, 2nd PP he should reach 20
- J35Bacher

Lindblom played more than half of his 5 on 5 minutes with Voracek.

http://www.naturalstattri...te=y&v=t&playerid=8478067

I really think trading Ghost will be a huge mistake. If we trade him for Kadri, I'm concerned Fletch will then throw money at Gardiner to fill the hole that Ghost left, but Gardner is not nearly as good
- bulet13

I wouldn't worry about that. He's going to be throwing a lot of money at Provorov and Sanheim, and won't want to do with another expensive LHD.

I agree with everything you’re saying. I was all in on JvR until Simmonds had a down season. Ghost didn’t play to his expectations. Provorov didn’t show up until the second half of the season. Until we had to go through eight goaltenders. I felt like all we needed to add and we should at least make the playoffs.

Agree or disagree, the window is closing on Giroux. I’m not so sure the duo of Couturier and Hayes is as dynamic as some of the very best in the NHL. Crosby/Malkin, Thornton/Couture, Matthews/Tavares. I would like to see improvement and more impactful players brought in, to go with the young core group of Patrick, Konency, Provorov, Sanheim and Hart. That’s just me though.
- SuperSchennBros

Soon to be 40 year old Joe Thornton isn't even a little bit dynamic.

Stop with this “they aren’t ready” crap. No one knows when any team or young player is ready. There isn’t some magic wand. Anyone with decent talent can win in this league, just got to get into the tournament. Two years ago Ghost and Provy were ready and now they aren’t. TK has scored over 20 goals twice already, but somehow he isn’t ready. If Sanheim regresses is he “not ready”? Players have up years and down years. You supplement the players you have with good players when the opportunity arises (trades, draft, FA).

Debate which player that is all you want, but at some point you’ve got to start getting better as a team and they finally appear they are going to get that help from management to supplement the great young players Hexy provided.

That's this Summer. What if Patrick breaks out and Lindblom has a strong season. Then Hart follows, etc. The cap space the Flyers have should be reserved for those players.
- MJL

And what if they don’t? Then you are very likely headed for another poop season with more and more empty seats.

You obviously need to have an eye on the future, but you can’t neglect the here and now bc a guy MIGHT break out. These men are smart, they will figure it out when that happens.

These men are smart, they will figure it out when that happens.
- Flyers1218

Look up Chuck Fletcher's history of figuring it out w/ the Minnesota Wild.

Thanks for clearing that up for everyone.
- Hulk Stroganoff