I understand that Q basically by all accounts was fantasy.

Just sucks I suppose. Do Hayes and Niskanen really move the needle at all, after all the talk of upgrading and all that?

Whatevs. If it’s the Niskanen that can rebound a bit that’s great. If he continues on a decline it’s a disturbing move.
- flyer_nutter

I have 0 issue with AV as the headcoach and look at him as a substantial upgrade in that position.

Hayes, if he signs, and Niskanen will be disappointing to me if that is all they do but I think they will do more.

Can Niskanen be a calming defensive presence on the ice? Because that's what is needed. Too often the other teams pace and good passing gets our defensive pair and the on ice forwards running around in a tizzy.
- shekkie

Nah, he's not a good shot/chance suppressor anymore. He used to be, but it's fallen off over the past couple of seasons.

I think the upgrade will be in transition, where he's probably a better fit than Gudas in AV's system.

Defensively tho... Gudas was better all around, and Gudas wasn't even that great in his own end.

And that's fine. I just don't think trading Ghost right now is a good idea, unless someone's going to overpay (and they won't).
- jmatchett383

Just hypothetically.

Would you do Gostisbehere to Montral for Domi.

Nah, he's not a good shot/chance suppressor anymore. He used to be, but it's fallen off over the past couple of seasons.

I think the upgrade will be in transition, where he's probably a better fit than Gudas in AV's system.

Defensively tho... Gudas was better all around, and Gudas wasn't even that great in his own end.
- Tomahawk

Other than the physical aspects there isn't any facet of the game where Gudas is better than Niskanen is. Play Gudas in the same situations and matchups that Niskanen saw and see what happens. Always comparing apples and oranges.

That's fair, maybe people should stop saying great trade though. Let's see him play after his dogsh!t season.
- ClaudeFather

I (personally) haven't said it's a great trade. I just think that Gudas was very overrated last year (although he was better than the year before).

I haven't seen Niskanen play much last year, but he looked good while I watched him a lot in their Cup year 2 seasons ago, so I can't say how he looked. However, many times, after a short summer and extra hockey, players have bad years (look at Washington as a whole).

Again, the money retained is odd, but I think it's a lateral move at worst.

I am ok with the trade in a vacuum. But the Flyers retaining salary when they are taking back a player who a bigger cap hit and one extra year makes absolutely no sense to me.

That is $1,005,000

So basically Niskanen is costing us 6.75.......
- MBFlyerfan

THE retention is very odd to me as well. Trying to make sense of it and can’t ...guess they liked him that much to make that move.

Maybe price is other dman is sky high ?

Not a big fan of this castration, I mean trade.

Just hypothetically.

Would you do Gostisbehere to Montral for Domi.
- J35Bacher

I've only watched the kid play a handful of times, I know he had a breakout year but I wouldn't be able to comment.

Caps just got more physical and harder to play against. We got a 25 point minus defenseman for nearly 7 mil on this years cap counting the retained cash

Fletchered
- Just5

Nonsense. Flyers win all the trades.

I didn't like you guys anyway

Amazing people are trying to spin this as a good move.
- ClaudeFather

He used to be one of the better 200-ft dmen in the league, so I can understand how that reputation has stuck in people's minds.

He's a stop-gap tho. They don't need him to make a huge difference.

I (personally) haven't said it's a great trade. I just think that Gudas was very overrated last year (although he was better than the year before).

I haven't seen Niskanen play much last year, but he looked good while I watched him a lot in their Cup year 2 seasons ago, so I can't say how he looked. However, many times, after a short summer and extra hockey, players have bad years (look at Washington as a whole).

Again, the money retained is odd, but I think it's a lateral move at worst.
- jmatchett383

They traded physicality for more skill.

I can be talked into liking or disliking this one. Depends on how he plays and fits with the others on the team.

Just kind of feels like you swapped a RAV4 for a Honda CRV.

Will miss the beard and snarl. Gudas wasn’t the problem on this club imo. See what happens. A very Vanilla team, just lost one of the few guys with some intensity.

Just hypothetically.

Would you do Gostisbehere to Montral for Domi.
- J35Bacher

I don't know, but I think it's a fair trade.

Let me ask this: if we were fresh off of 2017/2018 Ghost (13-52-65), would you trade him for present-day Domi? I wouldn't.

I can be talked into liking or disliking this one. Depends on how he plays and fits with the others on the team.

Just kind of feels like you swapped a RAV4 for a Honda CRV.

Will miss the beard and snarl. Gudas wasn’t the problem on this club imo. See what happens.
- flyer_nutter

The Flyers gained a veteran RH two way defenseman who can play higher in the lineup than Gudas can without giving up a piece of the future. They can absorb the cap increase for this year and next. It's a nice trade.

Niskanen will surely appreciate the shorter seasons upcoming.

He used to be one of the better 200-ft dmen in the league, so I can understand how that reputation has stuck in people's minds.

He's a stop-gap tho. They don't need him to make a huge difference.
- Tomahawk

That's how I feel. I'd stick him with Morin/Myers, let them do the heavy lifting and let him transition the puck.

Nah, he's not a good shot/chance suppressor anymore. He used to be, but it's fallen off over the past couple of seasons.

I think the upgrade will be in transition, where he's probably a better fit than Gudas in AV's system.

Defensively tho... Gudas was better all around, and Gudas wasn't even that great in his own end.
- Tomahawk

Niskanen will bounce back. He’s 32. Just hitting his stride

Niskanen will surely appreciate the shorter seasons upcoming.
- Just5

Why are you you?

They traded physicality for more skill.
- J35Bacher

and less suspensions....

well, looks like Ghost is returning. Could be wrong, but I find it hard to believe they would trade 2 of the top 6 this summer.

He used to be one of the better 200-ft dmen in the league, so I can understand how that reputation has stuck in people's minds.

He's a stop-gap tho. They don't need him to make a huge difference.
- Tomahawk

There weren't any better options in FA and the price in trades was maybe just too much. Fletcher said he wanted a top 4 vet and he got one at the cost of Gudas.

It's a two year stop gap to help the younger defense we have. It's kind of like the Filppula trade. Filppula was bounced down the lineup when patrick was playing better.

What is wrong with you people? When did Gudas become Pronger? Niskanen’s contract is only 2 more years. We gave up a career 3rd pairing defenseman that had a decent year last year, decent meaning he didn't take a poop ton of penalties and suspensions, for a multi cup winner defenseman that can show ghost, Provy, and Myers how to play a solid 2 way game.

Even if Niskanen is declining it’s only 2 seasons. This was a huge win at best, and a lateral move at worst.

Niskanen will bounce back. He’s 32. Just hitting his stride
- PhillySportsGuy

Since we're looking at numbers, the Flyers should've traded for Brooks Orpik instead of Niskanen. He had a better Corsi, better GF%. Better Expected GF%.