We are finally gonna get Staal!!!

Im gonna go out on a limb and say Toronto is not on his list.
- Rinosaur

I get ya bud.


But it’s a completely different organization now. Phil could rewrite the narrative if he was in mix for the first few years of the upcoming Leafs Dynasty.

I'd rather get a guy like Rask and bury him on the 4th line than have Johnson hold down his d partner and the forwards on the ice. If you have the ability to dump a really bad dman, you take it.

Rask is only 26. Still time to turn it around into a decent player. not sure too much about his game, but I'd take him and roll the dice compared to Johnson where you know what you will get and it isnt good.

If there is a deal on the table that involves Kessel for Subban, I'd rather pursue that deal and see what happens. I'd rather get the best player available than a combo or two or three players.
- SuperHenderson13

Absolutely. He’s one year removed from a 31 point season which wasn’t good by his standards. Is he a top 6 player for his future NHL career? Not likely. Is he capable of putting up 3rd line numbers while not weighing anybody down (especially our top players, as Rino eluded to). To take Rask’s most recent season as gospel at his age is pretty ridiculous. He is 100% an upgrade over JJ. Remember when Sam Gagner was done? And then he was an outstanding fit in Columbus.. It could happen to Rask. Taking Rask for JJ is an absolute improvement

From Sean Teirney @chartinghockey

The NHL trade machine has the Kessel-Johnson for Zucker-Rask trade as dead even.

https://t.co/Uv559Sw0Mp https://t.co/XyPNHibhxN

Kessel's PP GAR drives almost all of his positive value. Aside from that, he was replacement level. https://t.co/4NywfYBMGo

I get ya bud.


But it’s a completely different organization now. Phil could rewrite the narrative if he was in mix for the first few years of the upcoming Leafs Dynasty.
- Byfuglien Ate Me

While your proposed trade is a financial wash, aren't you guys going to have to shed some money regardless to make room for Marner and sign a replacement for Gardiner?

Ok, fire JR.

From Sean Teirney @chartinghockey

The NHL trade machine has the Kessel-Johnson for Zucker-Rask trade as dead even.

https://t.co/Uv559Sw0Mp https://t.co/XyPNHibhxN

Kessel's PP GAR drives almost all of his positive value. Aside from that, he was replacement level. https://t.co/4NywfYBMGo
- Tojo.

I still think MN adds something of decent value to the deal. Maybe we swap first rounders, maybe we swap second rounders. Something

Putting all personal bias aside and including everything we know about Dumba and Kessel. Is Kessel really worth more than Dumba? Like, how many players are there with his abilities at his age locked up at $6MM

I don't know why the Wild or Pittsburgh would make this trade? Kessel is a player you trade for when youre on the cusp of being a contender not when you've started a tear down like the Wild have. As for the Pens, Kessel is a player that has contributed greatly to two cups. He's still an elite scorer and the Pens window is still open. They proved a few years back that they didn't need an elite defense to win the cup.

Love Phil, but replacing his PP presence is not impossible. He's a great player who is a member of the most ridiculous PP depth chart in the league. It'd be pretty hard not to have elite numbers on that PP if you have decent offensive skills and a pulse. He can't one-time passes sent through the box by 87 and 71, and his ability to blow it past goaltenders took a significant step back this season. Whether it was coming off the left half-wall on the PP, or flying down the right wing at 5v5, the amount of goals scored in that laughable, sniper fashion were certainly lacking this season. He had a great season, and I think he was our best player against the Isles. However those two shooting scenarios are a massive part of his game.

The lack of right handed shooters does hurt, so it would have to be addressed. To debunk RW's claim though, I think PK Subban would be just as good, if not better in that role on the Pens PP. If no one comparable were added, I would put Letang in Phil's spot and Shultz up top.

Person above me is right ^^

ToJo: you’ve reminded us how much better Geno is away from Phil. Can you remind us what he looks like with and without JJ? Help everyone else put it into perspective

Thanks in advance if ya getter done

People are talking Zucker, but I wonder if the deal is more about a D-man coming back to the Pens as the core of the trade (with other parts here and there).

I still think MN adds something of decent value to the deal. Maybe we swap first rounders, maybe we swap second rounders. Something

Putting all personal bias aside and including everything we know about Dumba and Kessel. Is Kessel really worth more than Dumba? Like, how many players are there with his abilities at his age locked up at $6MM
- WSCTeton17

Zucker/Rask/2nd RP for Kessel/Jacko

I'd rather get a guy like Rask and bury him on the 4th line than have Johnson hold down his d partner and the forwards on the ice. If you have the ability to dump a really bad dman, you take it.

Rask is only 26. Still time to turn it around into a decent player. not sure too much about his game, but I'd take him and roll the dice compared to Johnson where you know what you will get and it isnt good.

If there is a deal on the table that involves Kessel for Subban, I'd rather pursue that deal and see what happens. I'd rather get the best player available than a combo or two or three players.
- SuperHenderson13

Absolutely. I’d rather trade for PK Subban. And Nashville needs a guy like Phil. Good match.

Person above me is right ^^

ToJo: you’ve reminded us how much better Geno is away from Phil. Can you remind us what he looks like with and without JJ? Help everyone else put it into perspective

Thanks in advance if ya getter done
- WSCTeton17

Malkin w/ JJ (without JJ)

CF: 47.8 (51.5) SF 46 (51.3). GF 45.7 (50.9). xGF 47.5 (54.8) SCF 51.2 (56). HDCF 45.4 (56.7)

Absolutely. I’d rather trade for PK Subban. And Nashville needs a guy like Phil. Good match.
- Barnaby36

Agree, but we don't know if either Pittsburgh or Nashville do

Take it for what it's worth, but TIOPS says Nash, LA and Zona are all on Phil's list.

Malkin w/ JJ (without JJ)

CF: 47.8 (51.5) SF 46 (51.3). GF 45.7 (50.9). xGF 47.5 (54.8) SCF 51.2 (56). HDCF 45.4 (56.7)
- Tojo.

GIVE US OUR MALKIN BACK

Nice work btw. Whatever I’m paying you, double it

GIVE US OUR MALKIN BACK

Nice work btw. Whatever I’m paying you, double it
- WSCTeton17

Highgarden it is.

GIVE US OUR MALKIN BACK

Nice work btw. Whatever I’m paying you, double it
- WSCTeton17

LOL it's naturalstattrick.com very easy.

Agree, but we don't know if either Pittsburgh or Nashville do
- Tojo.

Doesn't Nash need to clear space to re-sign players? I thought I read they were trying to clear cap for some reason.

Not sure why everyone acts like Kessel is impossible to replace....yes he's very good, but he's also apparently a Dbag to the staff.

You can find a better fit for Malkin and the PP.

Highgarden it is.
- Victoro311

Sir Bron of the Blackwater

He’s right up there with Tormund and The Hound

Is it Phil that has hit his shelf life with the Pens.....or is it JR?

Is it Phil that has hit his shelf life with the Pens.....or is it JR?
- Za Warudo

When you say Rutherford you mean him and his whole coaching staff right? Apparently Phil likes insubordination.

When you say Rutherford you mean him and his whole coaching staff right? Apparently Phil likes insubordination.
- Barnaby36

I’m stating a binary choice. Who’s the more significant problem? Also, whose skillset is more replaceable?

I’m stating a binary choice. Who’s the more significant problem? Also, whose skillset is more replaceable?
- Za Warudo

According to Tojo’s figures, Kessel and JJ are part of the problem. They’re both dragging down Geno. If Kessel is also being a problem on the bench, in the locker room, other areas off the ice.. if these rumors are true then it seems pretty clear who the problem is

We don’t need the #1 power play in the league to win the cup. We need a group of players playing within the same system. Let’s get Malkin a new LW, lose the baggage that is JJ, and see where this takes off