Wasn't talking about buyouts, Doesn't mean they're not bad contracts that no other team would touch without a sweetner

Bad teams don't have buyout problems, They suck already so they can afford to sit and wait for the bad contracts to run out
- RoloTahmasee

So is Jumbo Joe a bad contract? 750K less than Zajac but only put up 5 more points on a stacked team. Is Zajac so piss poor that he would put up 46 points on a good team or is it fair to say he’d be in the 50’s with higher quality teammates making his pay commensurate with his level of play?

So is Jumbo Joe a bad contract? 750K less than Zajac but only put up 5 more points on a stacked team. Is Zajac so piss poor that he would put up 46 points on a good team or is it fair to say he’d be in the 50’s with higher quality teammates making his pay commensurate with his level of play?
- WSCTeton17

Less money, More points and only had a 1 year deal instead of Zajac who had this past year and 2 more?

That a serious question?

Term counts too you know, it's not just the one year cap hit. Might want to take a look at Zajac's last 7 years of production

Zajac had similar production to Silfverberg, Kapanen, Miller, Saad, Tyler Johnson, and wasn’t far behind Anders Lee. Silfy just signed for $500K less, Lee is about to get $7MM, Miller makes North of 5, Saad makes 6. Sure there’s a lot more to hockey than mere production. Is Saad a bad contract?

Obviously they paid Zajac hoping for 60 points. The team around him is brutal, that 100% needs to be a factor otherwise you’re being ignorant. With Hall out his most common linemates were Coleman, Noesen, Wood, Anderson, Agostino... lol. So his QoT sucks. Dobbersports has his O zone starts at 36% this season and if I’m reading this correctly he literally had the hardest QoC. All things considered I would agree with this Dobbersports post from March stating he had a pretty darn good season when all factors are considered

“Zajac is garbage” but if we missed out in free agency people would be saying “yeah, he’d put up 55-60 playing with Sid or Geno.” QoT is a factor that should be considered when judging a player

I know Rino really liked Ennis. If Ennis came in and got a good chunk of time in our top 6 / middle 6 it’s entirely possible that he could’ve hit 40 points this last season and been a great signing

Less money, More points and only had a 1 year deal instead of Zajac who had this past year and 2 more?

That a serious question?

Term counts too you know, it's not just the one year cap hit. Might want to take a look at Zajac's last 7 years of production
- RoloTahmasee

I have but you don’t buyout contracts based off what players did 2 and 3 years ago. Hell, if that’s the case then Soderberg and his 49 point middle 6 season is junk

I have but you don’t buyout contracts based off what players did 2 and 3 years ago. Hell, if that’s the case then Soderberg and his 49 point middle 6 season is junk
- WSCTeton17

Zajac hasn't had a "decent" season in 7 years, and "decent" was his ceiling....

He's made almost 6 million per since forever. That's an atrocious contract

Every team has one contract that isn't ideal, but I think the better question is which of the teams with a bad albatross made it deep in the playoffs if they made it at all.
- Rinosaur

Carolina is still paying Alexander Semin and Scott Darling.

Jumbo’s most common linemates down the stretch: Gus, Labanc, Sorensen lol. His D obviously include Burns and Karlsson - Norris trophy candidates. Started 55% in the O zone. It’s a night and day difference as far as offensive output in concerned. Jumbo’s QoT is vastly superior. He did great in the role he was given but his QoC is more middle of the pack. Meier, Couture, Hertl, and Pavelski player harder minutes
https://frozenpool.dobber....com/players/joe-thornton

I’ve just told you the junk he’s been playing with. Are you going to sit there and tell me that if he plays with Labanc and Gus or Guentzel and Rust or whoever that he’s not going to improve on his 46 points? I would say that would be in the minority of assumptions

Who’s the bad contract on NJD? Schneider? He had 10 quality starts in his last 17 appearances playing in front of an awful D core on a team with zero stars (Hall was hurt). He’s now the starting goalie for USA at the Worlds and btw they’ve won 5 straight and he’s sporting a .924sv% (league average this year was .910 I just read on Sportsnet)
- WSCTeton17

Travis Zajac
Kyle Palmieri
Andy Greene

I’ve just told you the junk he’s been playing with. Are you going to sit there and tell me that if he plays with Labanc and Gus or Guentzel and Rust or whoever that he’s not going to improve on his 46 points? I would say that would be in the minority of assumptions
- WSCTeton17

So, he needs to be propped up by better players?

Doesn't sound like he's worth 6 million - Why did the Devils pay him that?

So, he needs to be propped up by better players?

Doesn't sound like he's worth 6 million - Why did the Devils pay him that?
- RoloTahmasee

5.75 and I already said it’s because they’d hoped he would be a 60 point guy which he hasn’t been. Doesn’t mean he wasn’t worth his value. I didn’t say his entire contract was worthy, I said he didn’t have a bad year for his cap hit given his situation and that he is most certainly not a buyout candidate

Hard to find a worse contract than PERRY’s and SEABROOK’s. Reminds me of Scott Gomez’ contract a few years ago..

Hard to find a worse contract than PERRY’s and SEABROOK’s. Reminds me of Scott Gomez’ contract a few years ago..
- Barnaby36

You mean like Shea Weber and Carey Price?

They got 1.5 million of Brooks Oprik buyout money left

oh, and they got hardly anyone signed for next season - 12 players under contract
- RoloTahmasee

what does the fact they have 12 players signed for next season have to do with bad contracts? isn’t that the topic in question?

the players they do have signed are the core guys (except for RFA Rantanen, but see my comments below for more on that): Mackinnon, Landeskog, Barrie (Sakic is looking to re-sign him this summer instead of waiting til next year when he’ll hit potential UFA status; if talks don’t go well then he’ll likely be put on the trade block), Erik Johnson, Grubauer, Makar, etc.

hate to sound like a broken record, but they have the 2nd most cap space in the league to work with. A few of their RFA’s are going to be re-signed for sure but at not much - if anything - of a pay increase. Rantanen is the exception, i’m thinking he’ll be paid somewhere between $8 and $9 mil at a shorter term, maybe 3-5 years (the general consensus from the avs fanbase is that based on who his agent is and the potential for another lockout in 3 years will lead to giving him a bridge deal instead of locking him down for 7-8 years, but we’ll see).


fact is, the team is in amazing shape cap-wise. it won’t cost a lot to keep whichever RFA’s they want around, Rantanen will get paid big but we have the money to give him whatever he wants, and sakic has been adamant about being aggressive in going after one or two free agent forwards in the offseason (hayes, skinner, panarin - however unlikely that one may be - and several others).

insofar as the orpik buyout, let’s not forget we landed a franchise goalie for $3.3 mil in that deal, so the extra $1.5 for orpik ultimately evens things out since we were paying Varlamov almost $6mil a year.

I was joking about Cole. He’s sorely missed on our blue line. Your other thoughts make way too much sense. You should come by more often
- WSCTeton17

lol, i didn’t pick up on the now-obvious sarcasm of your initial post. glad we see eye-to-eye on Cole. he was a stud for the pens during your back-to-back SC runs, and though he’s a the oldest guy on the avs roster he brings in a lot that we need in the short term. having a solid defensive defender enabled guys like barrie and girard to really jump up into the rush more than they were able to before.

i don’t see the team re-signing him when his contract is up, but for now - especially seeing how his performance picked up in the playoffs, which isn’t anything new for him as i’m sure you know well - he was a great pickup at reasonable cost.

thanks for your kind words. i’ll come by more often.

I’ll agree. But the eye test doesn’t favor JJ either. Teams that succeed with guys like him on the roster usually do so playing the guy like 9 minutes a night, not 19.

I’m all for players changing and adapting but it doesn’t appear JJ is going to. Just like how we’d all like Maatta to get faster
- WSCTeton17

Mario played with 5 defenders that in today’s puss y hockey society “couldn’t get him the puck”. Geno Sid Kessel Letang should of all been better regardless of who they played with.

Hard to find a worse contract than PERRY’s and SEABROOK’s. Reminds me of Scott Gomez’ contract a few years ago..
- Barnaby36

At the time Perry's contract was only maybe a bit of an overpay. He was a PPG player, fan favorite and scored 40 goals the year he signed the contract. It's a history lesson when looking at signing really good players to long deals in their late 20's. Injuries and wear and tear can make a great player just decent.

Jack Johnson might be bad in the CORSI HOCKEY LEAGUE, but in the NHL he’s doing great!
- Za Warudo

I think I lost some brain cells reading that.

Mario played with 5 defenders that in today’s puss y hockey society “couldn’t get him the puck”. Geno Sid Kessel Letang should of all been better regardless of who they played with.
- Grinder47

Haha, why can't Geno and Sid be more like Mario. In actuality, it's not Geno and Sid I'm worried about being anchored by JJ, it's the guys like Schultz. Schultz is a solid player in his own right, but everyone knows he isn't the dominant player when he steps on the ice. Those are the kind of guys to get tripped up I think with a bad partner.

So...Johnson is our new Scuderi?

Mario played with 5 defenders that in today’s puss y hockey society “couldn’t get him the puck”. Geno Sid Kessel Letang should of all been better regardless of who they played with.
- Grinder47

They should of, huh?

I'd argue that the rest of the NHL, including defensive and forechecking schemes, are much more advanced today than they were in 1991. Whenever the offensive/defensive side of the game changes to favor one, the opposition will change to counter it.

They should of, huh?

I'd argue that the rest of the NHL, including defensive and forechecking schemes, are much more advanced today than they were in 1991. Whenever the offensive/defensive side of the game changes to favor one, the opposition will change to counter it.
- jmatchett383

It’s a completely different league today.

Mario played with 5 defenders that in today’s puss y hockey society “couldn’t get him the puck”. Geno Sid Kessel Letang should of all been better regardless of who they played with.
- Grinder47

They definitely could’ve been better but they were going up against an actual TEAM. In all three zones they work together as a unit. Our breakout has been awful for a long time. Often times our winger has to stop to move the puck ahead to the far side winger who’s alone because the center was so low and the weak side D was so tired from defending that he wouldn’t join the rush. It was so bad... back then teams weren’t as good defensively and the goaltending was often questionable

lol, i didn’t pick up on the now-obvious sarcasm of your initial post. glad we see eye-to-eye on Cole. he was a stud for the pens during your back-to-back SC runs, and though he’s a the oldest guy on the avs roster he brings in a lot that we need in the short term. having a solid defensive defender enabled guys like barrie and girard to really jump up into the rush more than they were able to before.

i don’t see the team re-signing him when his contract is up, but for now - especially seeing how his performance picked up in the playoffs, which isn’t anything new for him as i’m sure you know well - he was a great pickup at reasonable cost.

thanks for your kind words. i’ll come by more often.
- avsgrinder

Hard not to agree. You’ve got so many good young players and so many bargain contracts it’s hard to say what your D core will look like in a few years. After all, Makar or Barrie could turn into Trouba and maybe you show him the door and keep a guy like Cole in the fold for another year or two. I was so questionable of Salic his first year, maybe a couple I don’t remember but he’s been awesome. He won the Bednar bid, got some value contracts and is just running away with some of these trades