I’m talking about negative impact on the ice. JJ makes the team worse when in the ice. The aforementioned players, aside from Allen, do not make their team worse on the ice.

It’s just simple like that. Does that player make your team worse on the ice? JJ, yes.
- Rinosaur

If we're going to go that route, I will argue that every team (even Colorado) has multiples players who makes the team worse when on the ice than when some of their peers are on the ice.

I don't disagree with anything you said here. It was a bad idea when it was signed, and it hasn't looked any better since. It was a flat-out bad signing with no signs that it would ever work out.

That said, looking at the cap based on hit/term, most teams have at least one player on a similar deal who is not living up to what his hit/term say he should be.
- jmatchett383

I agree but I think the point most on here are stuck on (myself included) is that the only way this team can rid themselves of JMFJ weighing everyone on the ice down is by him being moved anywhere, and for almost any cost...mostly this is due to Ruth being oblivious to JMFJ inability to "hockey" and HCMS being a mouse and continuing to give JMFJ copious amounts of ice team to continually drag down his teammates and the teams chances at winning.

Most other teams who have an albatross contract like JMFJ are either benched, or sheltered significantly by competent coaches and or put in the AHL by competent management.

So...TL/DL most on here are griping that the JMFJ contract is so bad that they need to extricate themselves from it to ensure he doesn't continue to drag the team down.

name one player on the avs with a bad contract :-)
- avsgrinder

Colin Wilson

Carl Soderberg

Nikita Zadorov in about a month

At that point it becomes a question of whether not said bad player is being given a large role. Like the Flyers have scratched and sent down Andy Mac on multiple occasions. Yes, in the grand scheme of hints $3.25 mil in dead cap is manageable, but it’s a whole different problem when Johnson is being paired with our only other non-Letang offensive defenseman and completely neutering his transition game. Johnson’s a much bigger on-ice issue than he is a cap issue, which is why I’m basically at a get rid of Johnson at all costs position.
- Victoro311

^^^This

Bad contracts matter a lot less when they don’t appear on the ice. Jake Allen hasn’t been playing and thus hasn’t been sucking.
- Za Warudo

Well, not exactly correct. Since the Blues turnaround in January, Allen played in 10 out of 33 games. His save percentage average across those games is above .92. In the backup role he was getting it done.

Colin Wilson

Carl Soderberg

Nikita Zadorov in about a month
- Za Warudo

wilson is an UFA, so we have $0 invested in him. if he’s re-signed it’ll be fine by me, he was a monster in the playoffs and one of the reasons we got as far as we did.

soderberg put up 49 points and played all 82 games without injury; never played on the top line, mostly spent time on the third line, occasionally thrown up on the 2nd when Bednar was mixing things up. kinda went invisible in the playoffs but was absolutely crucial and clutch in the final push to help us leapfrog 3 other teams to make it. $4.75mil isn’t by any means a bad price to pay for a big, physical player like him on a roster filled with mostly smaller, fast, skilled guys. UFA after next season. again, do i need to mention avs have 2nd most cap space in the league? pretty sure his 4.75 isn’t hurting anything.

zadorov “in a month” is pure speculation. completely irrelevant to list him based on your assumption Sakic will overpay to keep him.


...and for the person who said Ian Cole, he was fine during the regular season - nothing super impressive but not a liability, either. and in the playoffs he was an absolute BEAST, by far one of our best defenders. he was brought in because of his SC experience with the pens and to mentor our otherwise super young d corps. he’s done exactly that and more.

wilson is an UFA, so we have $0 invested in him. if he’s re-signed it’ll be fine by me, he was a monster in the playoffs and one of the reasons we got as far as we did.

soderberg put up 49 points and played all 82 games without injury; never played on the top line, mostly spent time on the third line, occasionally thrown up on the 2nd when Bednar was mixing things up. kinda went invisible in the playoffs but was absolutely crucial and clutch in the final push to help us leapfrog 3 other teams to make it. $4.75mil isn’t by any means a bad price to pay for a big, physical player like him on a roster filled with mostly smaller, fast, skilled guys. UFA after next season. again, do i need to mention avs have 2nd most cap space in the league? pretty sure his 4.75 isn’t hurting anything.

zadorov “in a month” is pure speculation. completely irrelevant to list him based on your assumption Sakic will overpay to keep him.


...and for the person who said Ian Cole, he was fine during the regular season - nothing super impressive but not a liability, either. and in the playoffs he was an absolute BEAST, by far one of our best defenders. he was brought in because of his SC experience with the pens and to mentor our otherwise super young d corps. he’s done exactly that and more.
- avsgrinder

I was joking about Cole. He’s sorely missed on our blue line. Your other thoughts make way too much sense. You should come by more often

wilson is an UFA, so we have $0 invested in him. if he’s re-signed it’ll be fine by me, he was a monster in the playoffs and one of the reasons we got as far as we did.

soderberg put up 49 points and played all 82 games without injury; never played on the top line, mostly spent time on the third line, occasionally thrown up on the 2nd when Bednar was mixing things up. kinda went invisible in the playoffs but was absolutely crucial and clutch in the final push to help us leapfrog 3 other teams to make it. $4.75mil isn’t by any means a bad price to pay for a big, physical player like him on a roster filled with mostly smaller, fast, skilled guys. UFA after next season. again, do i need to mention avs have 2nd most cap space in the league? pretty sure his 4.75 isn’t hurting anything.

zadorov “in a month” is pure speculation. completely irrelevant to list him based on your assumption Sakic will overpay to keep him.


...and for the person who said Ian Cole, he was fine during the regular season - nothing super impressive but not a liability, either. and in the playoffs he was an absolute BEAST, by far one of our best defenders. he was brought in because of his SC experience with the pens and to mentor our otherwise super young d corps. he’s done exactly that and more.
- avsgrinder

Soderberg had one good, PDO driven season on an otherwise laughably bad contract.

Zadorov is straight trash and should be sold to a dinosaur GM at the earliest opportunity (Hello Phil Kessel trade?)

Tyson Jost sucks too but that isn’t really relevant to the original conversation, just wanted to poi t it out.

You’ve got two years of Makar ELC. Don’t waste them on overpays.

IMHO, the best options for how to handle JJ, in order, are:


1. Look to trade him (alone) with no money retained for a lower cap hit/term player(s)
2. Buy him out
3. Look to trade him (alone) with money retained for a lower cap hit/term player(s)
4. Look to trade him, plus players/picks (not a 1st or second) for relief.
5. Demote him to the AHL.

However, what WILL happen is he will make the roster as one of your 7D, likely a top-6.
- jmatchett383

IF they are planning on buying him out, they should definitely be looking to trade him with money retained first. I’d think (and hope) that a team might actually trade for Johnson at a $2 mil salary.

IF they are planning on buying him out, they should definitely be looking to trade him with money retained first. I’d think (and hope) that a team might actually trade for Johnson at a $2 mil salary.
- drummer829

Another option would be to bury him in WBS and hope for compliance buyouts in the 2020 offseason. I assume that those will happen, even without a lockout, as multiple teams will want to flush bad constructs without consequence.

IF they are planning on buying him out, they should definitely be looking to trade him with money retained first. I’d think (and hope) that a team might actually trade for Johnson at a $2 mil salary.
- drummer829

Well, if a team was dumb to enough to give Brandon Manning a multi-year deal at $2.25M per, and another team was dumb enough to trade for him, I guess you may be right.

This is all bs. Rutherford could pull off a trade that makes everyone wonder how he pulled it off just the same. Pens could win a cup with Johnson playing every single game too. I’d rather not have him on the Pens but making this big of a deal about him isn’t called for really. Fancy stats don’t tell the entire story. Especially in the playoffs.

This is all bs. Rutherford could pull off a trade that makes everyone wonder how he pulled it off just the same. Pens could win a cup with Johnson playing every single game too. I’d rather not have him on the Pens but making this big of a deal about him isn’t called for really. Fancy stats don’t tell the entire story. Especially in the playoffs.
- Grinder47

I’ll agree. But the eye test doesn’t favor JJ either. Teams that succeed with guys like him on the roster usually do so playing the guy like 9 minutes a night, not 19.

I’m all for players changing and adapting but it doesn’t appear JJ is going to. Just like how we’d all like Maatta to get faster

I’ll agree. But the eye test doesn’t favor JJ either. Teams that succeed with guys like him on the roster usually do so playing the guy like 9 minutes a night, not 19.

I’m all for players changing and adapting but it doesn’t appear JJ is going to. Just like how we’d all like Maatta to get faster
- WSCTeton17

I wanted to give the guy every benefit of the doubt.....especially with the intense reaction to his signing. Unfortunately, the anger was pretty much justified. He's pretty terrible.

I wanted to give the guy every benefit of the doubt.....especially with the intense reaction to his signing. Unfortunately, the anger was pretty much justified. He's pretty terrible.
- madmike71

“The anger” lol. You’re describing it like it’s a part of yourself you keep at bay, like a young Bruce Banner

“The anger” lol. You’re describing it like it’s a part of yourself you keep at bay, like a young Bruce Banner
- WSCTeton17

Did you read this board after they signed JJ?

Did you read this board after they signed JJ?
- madmike71

Dude, give him a chance. It’s one season. It takes time to get used to a new system.

Fancy stats don’t tell the entire story. Especially in the playoffs.
- Grinder47

Jack Johnson might be bad in the CORSI HOCKEY LEAGUE, but in the NHL he’s doing great!

This is all bs. Rutherford could pull off a trade that makes everyone wonder how he pulled it off just the same. Pens could win a cup with Johnson playing every single game too. I’d rather not have him on the Pens but making this big of a deal about him isn’t called for really. Fancy stats don’t tell the entire story. Especially in the playoffs.
- Grinder47

He actually has already done that with the Scuderi for Daley trade hahahaha.

JJ actually is that big of a deal. Dude is dogpoop and makes the Pens worse. He's legit one of the worst dmen in the league. Whatever "story" you want to look at.. he sucks, plain as day. Fancy stats, traditional stats, no stats... the dude is garbage and makes the Pens suck. With JJ on the ice the pens are a below average hockey team. Without JJ on the ice, the Pens are a top 5 team in the league.

Did you read this board after they signed JJ?
- madmike71

This board and Twitter. The defense of him and GMJR on Twitter was SO STRONG. People just absolutely turning a blind eye. All of the hockey guys just returned from vacations so they’ve been stopping in to see me at the bank. Some of them follow everything and love the free agent frenzy and stuff

Who’s the bad contract on NJD? Schneider? He had 10 quality starts in his last 17 appearances playing in front of an awful D core on a team with zero stars (Hall was hurt). He’s now the starting goalie for USA at the Worlds and btw they’ve won 5 straight and he’s sporting a .924sv% (league average this year was .910 I just read on Sportsnet)
- WSCTeton17

Zajac, Andy Greene, Lets not forget, Schneider couldn't stop a beach ball for long stretches this year

Plenty of bad money in Jersey, no one pays attention to it because that team sucks

Congrats, you win. You found 1 team without a bad contract.
- jmatchett383

They got 1.5 million of Brooks Oprik buyout money left

oh, and they got hardly anyone signed for next season - 12 players under contract

Zajac, Andy Greene, Lets not forget, Schneider couldn't stop a beach ball for long stretches this year

Plenty of bad money in Jersey, no one pays attention to it because that team sucks
- RoloTahmasee

Zajac? 46 points on a lowly team is not buyout worthy. Schneider had 10 quality starts his last 17 games and is the starter for team USA.. Greene? He has one year at $5MM on a team well below the cap floor that is rebuilding. Buying him out with an incredibly weak D market in a non sexy hockey market would make the team instantly worse. None of these contracts at this point are buyout worthy

Saying that NJD have awful contracts worthy of buyouts is like saying the Coyotes should buyout Goose, Stepan, Galchenyuk, etc. It wouldn’t make any sense

Zajac? 46 points on a lowly team is not buyout worthy. Schneider had 10 quality starts his last 17 games and is the starter for team USA.. Greene? He has one year at $5MM on a team well below the cap floor that is rebuilding. Buying him out with an incredibly weak D market in a non sexy hockey market would make the team instantly worse. None of these contracts at this point are buyout worthy
- WSCTeton17

Wasn't talking about buyouts, Doesn't mean they're not bad contracts that no other team would touch without a sweetner

Bad teams don't have buyout problems, They suck already so they can afford to sit and wait for the bad contracts to run out