Yohe believes Jack Johnson is good
- Za Warudo

They weren’t discussing JJ much. Just Jim and Sullivan’s complete distaste for Phil and how they believe he has a very big negative impact on the team, especially Malkin.

What it’s really all about, and has always been all about, is playing in the shadow of Crosby. 87 is very good at playing hockey - one of the best ever. But he’s also always been a soft, whining, dirty, diving darling of the league. That’s not a leadership model everyone can thrive under.

What it’s really all about, and has always been all about, is playing in the shadow of Crosby. 87 is very good at playing hockey - one of the best ever. But he’s also always been a soft, whining, dirty, diving darling of the league. That’s not a leadership model everyone can thrive under.
- Bromancer

Dude,

Sid hasn't been ANY of these things for YEARS now. He's been the absolute best, quiet, solid leader since oh, probably 2013. He barely even argues a call any more, and basically skates away from everything. You haven't been paying much attention.

What’s the much needed asset that outweighs a 2C? A 1C? Oh.. we have two of those? Hmm... so we’re gonna trade away our 2C that’s good enough to be a 1C for... an inferior 2C because we created the need for a 2C by trading away our elite 2C. Smart.
- j.boyd919

There's just NO way for you to know what 71 could return, as you are just speculating like everyone else. I mean, sheesh dude, look what JR got for Brassard and what's his face...the other C...

Or maybe you're just collecting hockey cards.

What it’s really all about, and has always been all about, is playing in the shadow of Crosby. 87 is very good at playing hockey - one of the best ever. But he’s also always been a soft, whining, dirty, diving darling of the league. That’s not a leadership model everyone can thrive under.
- Bromancer

Talking about a bitter guy...just an idiotic comment from a low lifer

They weren’t discussing JJ much. Just Jim and Sullivan’s complete distaste for Phil and how they believe he has a very big negative impact on the team, especially Malkin.
- Grinder47

We've been through this before in the Neal's days..

Just to clarify from yesterday:

The Oilers won 4 Stanley Cups with Wayne Gretzky.
Then, Gretzky was traded (essentially sold) and 2 years later, Edmonton won another Cup.
Clearly, this means it was a smart hockey move for Edmonton to trade Gretzky because they were able to win a Stanley Cup without him.

Since the Penguins were able to win a Stanley Cup without Letang, it is imperative that we trade him immediately.

And yes, I just compared Kris Letang to Wayne Gretzky.

What it’s really all about, and has always been all about, is playing in the shadow of Crosby. 87 is very good at playing hockey - one of the best ever. But he’s also always been a soft, whining, dirty, diving darling of the league. That’s not a leadership model everyone can thrive under.
- Bromancer

So basically, you haven't watched him play since 2013?

As a Flyers fan first and foremost, I absolutely HATED the type of player he was. However, after Chara and Boston erased his mind in 2013, he's been a very different player. He's not Mark Messier or Jean Beliveau, but he's a far cry from how he was when he entered the league.

However, this will always be a thing

So basically, you haven't watched him play since 2013?

As a Flyers fan first and foremost, I absolutely HATED the type of player he was. However, after Chara and Boston erased his mind in 2013, he's been a very different player. He's not Mark Messier or Jean Beliveau, but he's a far cry from how he was when he entered the league.

However, this will always be a thing

- jmatchett383

That ref shoulda got 20 games for high knuckling (fingering, maybe?).

Hornquist is tradeable but you are nuts if you think he's a salary dump. He is the only damn guy on the team who has a net front presence.

If they get a really good offer I'm sure they will take it, but I don't think they are itching to move him.
- MacPatty

That part is the accurate part.

I feel like that’s a fair opinion, but I also feel like he could still put up 55-60 points again next year playing with Forsberg and Malkin while adding the net front presence they need on their PP1 on a good Preds team. Thoughts?
- WSCTeton17

My thoughts is sure, he could definitely bounce back, but his age puts the odds firmly in favor of him being cooked so I’d rather move on now before he’s a legitimately bad contract. As far as your trade proposal: it’s definitely not a disaster from an on ice product point of view since Subban is really (frank)ing good but I don’t think we get better and it’s a ton of moving parts. I’d much rather pass.

My thoughts is sure, he could definitely bounce back, but his age puts the odds firmly in favor of him being cooked so I’d rather move on now before he’s a legitimately bad contract. As far as your trade proposal: it’s definitely not a disaster from an on ice product point of view since Subban is really (frank)ing good but I don’t think we get better and it’s a ton of moving parts. I’d much rather pass.
- Victoro311

That trade was awful. NSH downgrades to Maatta and Horny from Subban and Granlund while taking JJs contract just to upgrade Johansen to Malkin.

Take out JJ and maybe it makes sense.

Hornquist is tradeable but you are nuts if you think he's a salary dump. He is the only damn guy on the team who has a net front presence.

If they get a really good offer I'm sure they will take it, but I don't think they are itching to move him.
- MacPatty

I’m glad not everyone has gone psycho about his value. Obviously it’s not at its peak but it’s not 0 or negative. I disagree on the NFP (net front presence). Jake does, Rust does, Bjugstad does, and Simon does (he had a great screen for one of our playoff goals). Blueger maybe has a knack for it too, I don’t recall. Also, just because we have a guy who’s good in front doesn’t mean other teams need him (but as I said other teams definitely do, especially NSH)

That trade was awful. NSH downgrades to Maatta and Horny from Subban and Granlund while taking JJs contract just to upgrade Johansen to Malkin.

Take out JJ and maybe it makes sense.
- Feds91Stammer

I forgot it included JJ to be honest. I read the comment last night in passing while at a bar watching the Sixers game.

Yes, I had a drink on a week night. Roast me.

I’m glad not everyone has gone psycho about his value. Obviously it’s not at its peak but it’s not 0 or negative. I disagree on the NFP (net front presence). Jake does, Rust does, Bjugstad does, and Simon does (he had a great screen for one of our playoff goals). Blueger maybe has a knack for it too, I don’t recall. Also, just because we have a guy who’s good in front doesn’t mean other teams need him (but as I said other teams definitely do, especially NSH)
- WSCTeton17

Why exactly does NSH need a 32 year old with 4 years on his contract that doesn't produce a ton at 5v5?

I’m glad not everyone has gone psycho about his value. Obviously it’s not at its peak but it’s not 0 or negative. I disagree on the NFP (net front presence). Jake does, Rust does, Bjugstad does, and Simon does (he had a great screen for one of our playoff goals). Blueger maybe has a knack for it too, I don’t recall. Also, just because we have a guy who’s good in front doesn’t mean other teams need him (but as I said other teams definitely do, especially NSH)
- WSCTeton17

Yes. Hornqvist’s style is incredibly valuable on the PP and the percentages with Hornqvist on vs Hornqvist off back it up. But what he does at even strength is immensely overrated. You don’t need to have a guy out there humping the goalie to be effective in tight as a unit. Hornqvist isn’t the reason any particular line isn’t being kept to the perimeter, and a line is perfectly capable of playing perimeter hockey with Hornqvist on it.

Yes. Hornqvist’s style is incredibly valuable on the PP and the percentages with Hornqvist on vs Hornqvist off back it up. But what he does at even strength is immensely overrated. You don’t need to have a guy out there humping the goalie to be effective in tight as a unit. Hornqvist isn’t the reason any particular line isn’t being kept to the perimeter, and a line is perfectly capable of playing perimeter hockey with Hornqvist on it.
- Victoro311

My thoughts is sure, he could definitely bounce back, but his age puts the odds firmly in favor of him being cooked so I’d rather move on now before he’s a legitimately bad contract. As far as your trade proposal: it’s definitely not a disaster from an on ice product point of view since Subban is really (frank)ing good but I don’t think we get better and it’s a ton of moving parts. I’d much rather pass.
- Victoro311

Your opinion on the trade is fair. To me it’s a bit of addition by subtraction. To me, RyJo is younger and is a better 2-way player than Geno, I believe Granlund can absolutely bounce back and be a huge threat on PP2, and obviously Subban would be a huge get and would change our team dynamic PLUS we ditch JJ which we all agree adds a lot of value

On 72: assuming your thoughts are the same as mgmt - which is completely valid and I definitely don’t disagree, it’s also about what other GMs around the league believe. Are they all going to believe he’s cooked? I don’t think so especially when the market dries up. That’s why I’ll go ahead and say that Feds opinion of him is ridiculous, so much so that it looks like Trolling

I’m glad not everyone has gone psycho about his value. Obviously it’s not at its peak but it’s not 0 or negative. I disagree on the NFP (net front presence). Jake does, Rust does, Bjugstad does, and Simon does (he had a great screen for one of our playoff goals). Blueger maybe has a knack for it too, I don’t recall. Also, just because we have a guy who’s good in front doesn’t mean other teams need him (but as I said other teams definitely do, especially NSH)
- WSCTeton17

Why exactly does NSH need a 32 year old with 4 years on his contract that doesn't produce a ton at 5v5?
- Feds91Stammer

Nashville could just resign Simmonds, who will probably come much cheaper than Horny after his last 2 seasons. He was looking to cash in on a 4+ year, $5+M annual contract. Right now, I can't see anyone paying him more than $2.5M for more than 3 years, max. Definitely less than Horny, at least.

If I were him, I'd sign a one-year "prove it" deal and bet on myself having a bounce back year.

Your opinion on the trade is fair. To me it’s a bit of addition by subtraction. To me, RyJo is younger and is a better 2-way player than Geno, I believe Granlund can absolutely bounce back and be a huge threat on PP2, and obviously Subban would be a huge get and would change our team dynamic PLUS we ditch JJ which we all agree adds a lot of value

On 72: assuming your thoughts are the same as mgmt - which is completely valid and I definitely don’t disagree, it’s also about what other GMs around the league believe. Are they all going to believe he’s cooked? I don’t think so especially when the market dries up. That’s why I’ll go ahead and say that Feds opinion of him is ridiculous, so much so that it looks like Trolling
- WSCTeton17

I think RyJo is pretty overrated which is why I’m cold on the trade. But you included Johnson which I didn’t realize so that probably swings it in our favor. I’d still go back to the whole Geno shouldn’t be traded period for non-hockey reasons argument I’ve been making but I guess this would be a scenario where if he were traded we wouldn’t necessarily be worse.

That trade was awful. NSH downgrades to Maatta and Horny from Subban and Granlund while taking JJs contract just to upgrade Johansen to Malkin.

Take out JJ and maybe it makes sense.
- Feds91Stammer

“Just to upgrade from RyJo to Malkin.” Lol. Well stupid me for throwing in Hornqvist, I forgot he brought negative value to the transaction. My bad dude

Everyone’s talking down on Granlund as if he played as bad as 72 and won’t recover. Clearly he’s not the fixation of the trade. I’ve said it before that Granlund would only be moving out if Poile felt that he wasn’t part of their plan moving forward - which makes sense. But I think your issue is more with me than my comments. I will expect a laughing emoji in response

Good article by A Gretz

https://www.pensburgh.com...tanley-cup-jim-rutherford

"Why is a four-game sampling in one playoff series more important than a decade’s worth of high-level play and sustained dominance?"

Trade Malkin for a good young Dman, not quite Subban level + picks and ready prospects and good top 9 F. Go sign Duchene in FA.

Trade Malkin for a good young Dman, not quite Subban level + picks and ready prospects and good top 9 F. Go sign Duchene in FA.
- sammy87

You mean the guy who might not make it to July 1 and not be available? It’s always really dumb to count on free agency to fill a gap that you created by trading someone away.

Trade Malkin for a good young Dman, not quite Subban level + picks and ready prospects and good top 9 F. Go sign Duchene in FA.
- sammy87

Who are the dman, prospects, and top 9F you had in mind?

Also, due to the ever-increasing cap, Dcchene may actually end up costing more than Malkin on the cap.

Edit: Malking is making $9.5M, though it was $8.5M. Still, the difference in cap hit won't be all that severe.