JR deserves a ton of credit for getting those two cup wins. I'll never agree he "lucked" into anything. He correctly identified the missing ingredients and added them on the fly.......and won those 2 cups. That would have never happened under Shero.

I think one of the biggest problems with this team is the coach and GM seem to have completely different ideas on the types of players they want. I'm not sure I've seen anything like it before.

It's probably better they went out like that.......at least nobody can have delusions of "just not getting puck luck" or something. That was a slaying of a coach, players and GM.

RW keep up the good work. I continue as a lifetime Pens fan to be amazed at what this fan base is capable of. Many are still whining about the decision to move on from Fleury. A sizeable number of fans remarked at Game 3 on Sunday "We wouldnt be in this mess if we still had Flower" it is truly unreal. There is far more in play here than poor goaltending.
You see the same every time you point out the numbers that say JJ is bad for this team. So many Pens fans dont want to hear that one of their players is weak or bad, or that one of their executives is hurting the team. Instead, they crucify the messenger.

This team has problems, but one thing it did show is that --unfortunately--you were right. It is up to GM JR to fix them, but he is the man who created many of the problems to begin with. So let me get this straight: you win 2 Stanley Cups with 1 plan (and some puck luck) then decide "nope this didnt work, we wont get pushed around again" and start selling off assets to acquire the big physical goons your speed approach basically rendered obsolete? And we want this guy to Fix the problems he created? YIKES! And how much did the loss of Botterill hurt this front office?
We are fortunate to have won 5 Cups. We have every right to question whether we should have 1-2 more as long as you appreciate the ones you have an realize how lucky this fan base has been.
- Amanion

I will never understand how a GM could take something that worked (speed) and do a complete 180 degree turn in 2-3 years. It was obvious that the Isles were the faster team and not by just a little bit. They were the first to every puck, their forecheck was ... well ... a forecheck. Pens looked and played slow, small, and non-physical (the opposite of physical). They couldn't separate any Isles player from the puck and most of the offensive rushes were a "one-and-done". Maybe the Pens were supposed to have been #tankingforhughes but then they accidentally made the playoffs??

This is what makes ZERO sense to me... Everyone is blaming Rutherford... Hes made some terrible moves no doubt. That would make total sense if we lost to a team with an equal to or better overall roster. Say... Tampa or the caps. But is the isles roster better at forward? Defence? Goalie? Id say a hard NO on all 3. The isles straight up dummied the pens in all matchups. We had the better roster and they got outplayed.

This is what makes ZERO sense to me... Everyone is blaming Rutherford... Hes made some terrible moves no doubt. That would make total sense if we lost to a team with an equal to or better overall roster. Say... Tampa or the caps. But is the isles roster better at forward? Defence? Goalie? Id say a hard NO on all 3. The isles straight up dummied the pens in all matchups. We had the better roster and they got outplayed.
- pens4life-66

Your penguins have some better players .. but they didn't have the heart the Islanders and their coach did in this series.. The Isles were not even picked to finish better than 27th their capt and franchise player bolted to the leafs... it is an us against them mentality that the team has... and truth be told... the penguins did not look intimidating ..infact this is the match up the islanders and the fans wanted...
Some thing was not clicking for the pens this year.. they looked mortal and behaved as such!

This is what makes ZERO sense to me... Everyone is blaming Rutherford... Hes made some terrible moves no doubt. That would make total sense if we lost to a team with an equal to or better overall roster. Say... Tampa or the caps. But is the isles roster better at forward? Defence? Goalie? Id say a hard NO on all 3. The isles straight up dummied the pens in all matchups. We had the better roster and they got outplayed.
- pens4life-66

Islanders actually have a better D group than Pittsburgh; as for goalies since the 2nd half of the season, Lehner is much much much better than Murray. But yeah, the Pens have a better offense.

This is what makes ZERO sense to me... Everyone is blaming Rutherford... Hes made some terrible moves no doubt. That would make total sense if we lost to a team with an equal to or better overall roster. Say... Tampa or the caps. But is the isles roster better at forward? Defence? Goalie? Id say a hard NO on all 3. The isles straight up dummied the pens in all matchups. We had the better roster and they got outplayed.
- pens4life-66

I dunno, Lehner looked huge in net. The Isles were just very committed defensively. They frustrated the Pens almost like the Bruins did in the 2013 Playoffs. You remember how we got swept there, don't you? Especially Games 3-4. The Bruins were clogging up every passing lane, forechecking and backchecking better, clogging up the neutral zone, feeding off the turnovers with speed. The Isles did the same thing. They just outplayed us.

Islanders actually have a better D group than Pittsburgh; as for goalies since the 2nd half of the season, Lehner is much much much better than Murray. But yeah, the Pens have a better offense.
- Habsody

This is what makes ZERO sense to me... Everyone is blaming Rutherford... Hes made some terrible moves no doubt. That would make total sense if we lost to a team with an equal to or better overall roster. Say... Tampa or the caps. But is the isles roster better at forward? Defence? Goalie? Id say a hard NO on all 3. The isles straight up dummied the pens in all matchups. We had the better roster and they got outplayed.
- pens4life-66

Islanders had the edge in goal on paper definately. It was Murrays end of year hot streak that had some viewing it as a wash.

Islanders actually have a better D group than Pittsburgh; as for goalies since the 2nd half of the season, Lehner is much much much better than Murray. But yeah, the Pens have a better offense.
- Habsody

Lehner definitely outplayed Murray, wasnt tested as much, but outplayed him none the less. Murray let in some very untimely goals that were savable.

I dunno, Lehner looked huge in net. The Isles were just very committed defensively. They frustrated the Pens almost like the Bruins did in the 2013 Playoffs. You remember how we got swept there, don't you? Especially Games 3-4. The Bruins were clogging up every passing lane, forechecking and backchecking better, clogging up the neutral zone, feeding off the turnovers with speed. The Isles did the same thing. They just outplayed us.
- chimpira

They did. For the most part they battled harder, were hungrier. They were also much more responsible with the puck.

Islanders actually have a better D group than Pittsburgh; as for goalies since the 2nd half of the season, Lehner is much much much better than Murray. But yeah, the Pens have a better offense.
- Habsody

So it would have been a good trade in a win now team for just these playoffs to trade Letang, Dumolin, Schultz, Peterrson, Gudbranson, Johnson for Boychuk, Leddy, pelech, pulock, toews, mayfield!??? Not many blogs ago it was stated the isles D wasnt good and pens would torch them. There is many blogs and stats that show Murray was a top goalie from the 2nd half as well. Should Rutherford have upgraded and went for a better starter then Murray? Questionable at best.

So it would have been a good trade in a win now team for just these playoffs to trade Letang, Dumolin, Schultz, Peterrson, Gudbranson, Johnson for Boychuk, Leddy, pelech, pulock, toews, mayfield!??? Not many blogs ago it was stated the isles D wasnt good and pens would torch them. There is many blogs and stats that show Murray was a top goalie from the 2nd half as well. Should Rutherford have upgraded and went for a better starter then Murray? Questionable at best.
- pens4life-66

So... what out there was better than Murray?

Just because the Islanders goalie had a better year... does not mean Murray was bad.

Calm your tits man.

So... what out there was better than Murray?

Just because the Islanders goalie had a better year... does not mean Murray was bad.

Calm your tits man.
- Guile

EXACTLY what Im saying! hahaha read brotha, read!

EXACTLY what Im saying! hahaha read brotha, read!
- pens4life-66

Stopped reading halfway through... got bored

I will never understand how a GM could take something that worked (speed) and do a complete 180 degree turn in 2-3 years. It was obvious that the Isles were the faster team and not by just a little bit. They were the first to every puck, their forecheck was ... well ... a forecheck. Pens looked and played slow, small, and non-physical (the opposite of physical). They couldn't separate any Isles player from the puck and most of the offensive rushes were a "one-and-done". Maybe the Pens were supposed to have been #tankingforhughes but then they accidentally made the playoffs??
- chimpira

Maybe because the rest of the league caught up to the fast Penguins, like 2 years ago? I don't agree with all of GMJR's moves, but there are only so many faster guys out there... and then there's the cap.

Maybe because the rest of the league caught up to the fast Penguins, like 2 years ago? I don't agree with all of GMJR's moves, but there are only so many faster guys out there... and then there's the cap.
- Cousinskrid

If that theory holds true, then what's the explanation for signing Jack Johnson to a 5-year contract. How was he allowed to do that? That is a painful handcuff to deal with for many years to come. Did he see something in him (while being scratched) that none of the other 30 teams did? Mind-boggling. Same with Maatta's contract at $4M/year. Completely unwarranted.

I would be looking at the coach if this were my team. He had zero answer for the guy that has out coached him for the second straight year with a completely different team and style. I couldn't believe in the last 5 minutes of that game last night watching the Pens still try and carry the puck into the zone instead of dump it and get it. They did that a handful of times last night and got some pressure.. And don't say the players determine that. He's on the bench for more than sending out lines.

The difference I see in the Pens from previous years is the lack of an identity. They are a group of guys not a team. That starts with the coach in my opinion..

If that theory holds true, then what's the explanation for signing Jack Johnson to a 5-year contract. How was he allowed to do that? That is a painful handcuff to deal with for many years to come. Did he see something in him (while being scratched) that none of the other 30 teams did? Mind-boggling. Same with Maatta's contract at $4M/year. Completely unwarranted.
- chimpira

I don't know, most people were pretty happy with Maatta when he signed, though some didn't like the length. One person even calling him a top-pair defenseman.

https://www.hockeybuzz.co...?thread_id=133380&page=15

I don't know, most people were pretty happy with Maatta when he signed, though some didn't like the length. One person even calling him a top-pair defenseman.

https://www.hockeybuzz.co...?thread_id=133380&page=15
- jmatchett383

[nervously searches for own username in 2016 posts ... ]

I don't know, most people were pretty happy with Maatta when he signed, though some didn't like the length. One person even calling him a top-pair defenseman.

https://www.hockeybuzz.co...?thread_id=133380&page=15
- jmatchett383

Lol reading old comments is always entertaining.

I don't know, most people were pretty happy with Maatta when he signed, though some didn't like the length. One person even calling him a top-pair defenseman.

https://www.hockeybuzz.co...?thread_id=133380&page=15
- jmatchett383

Yeah he looked like a stud his 1st yera then had cancer and double shoulder surgery and never really came back so understandable. Still think hes better than JJ or Gubs.

I don't know, most people were pretty happy with Maatta when he signed, though some didn't like the length. One person even calling him a top-pair defenseman.

https://www.hockeybuzz.co...?thread_id=133380&page=15
- jmatchett383

I still think Maatta is a good top 4 defenseman, he just keeps being saddled with ass partners. The two and a half seasons where he played with Niskanen, Letang, and Schultz were all great. This season and the season he played with Daley were ass.

This is what makes ZERO sense to me... Everyone is blaming Rutherford... Hes made some terrible moves no doubt. That would make total sense if we lost to a team with an equal to or better overall roster. Say... Tampa or the caps. But is the isles roster better at forward? Defence? Goalie? Id say a hard NO on all 3. The isles straight up dummied the pens in all matchups. We had the better roster and they got outplayed.
- pens4life-66

These two teams were pretty even overall. They split the season series and final record was very close.

My suggestion was to relieve Rutherford of his GM duties, let him stay on as VP. Let the new GM (Bill Guerin?) work closer with Sullivan. JR can then veto or agree to whatever trades or moves come before him.

Bottom line, we need to get younger, both on and off the ice.

I would be looking at the coach if this were my team. He had zero answer for the guy that has out coached him for the second straight year with a completely different team and style. I couldn't believe in the last 5 minutes of that game last night watching the Pens still try and carry the puck into the zone instead of dump it and get it. They did that a handful of times last night and got some pressure.. And don't say the players determine that. He's on the bench for more than sending out lines.

The difference I see in the Pens from previous years is the lack of an identity. They are a group of guys not a team. That starts with the coach in my opinion..
- Isles_KoolAid

Last year could have went either way, the Pens were a goal post away from a game seven. Not to mention they were an exhausted team last year.

I don't know, most people were pretty happy with Maatta when he signed, though some didn't like the length. One person even calling him a top-pair defenseman.

https://www.hockeybuzz.co...?thread_id=133380&page=15
- jmatchett383

Hmmm... Gonna have to argue with your analysis of that point. He referred to Maatta as being in the top pairing, not a top pair Dman. And his statement was true, he had spent a lot of time with Letang before the time of the signing.