On the flip side I remember when some fans tried to argue it was the worst trade in the history of the franchise.
- HawkintheD

It is though

Panarin continues to break scoring records at Columbus and is one of the top wingers in the league and we traded him for a 3rd liner.

It is though

Panarin continues to break scoring records at Columbus and is one of the top wingers in the league and we traded him for a 3rd liner.
- SimpleJack

LOL@scoring records in Columbus.

It is though

Panarin continues to break scoring records at Columbus and is one of the top wingers in the league and we traded him for a 3rd liner.
- SimpleJack

Not even close

Esposito, Stanfield, Hodge for
Martin, Marotte, Jack Norris

Not even close

Esposito, Stanfield, Hodge for
Martin, Marotte, Jack Norris
- LAHawk

Esposito DID break scoring records!

Esposito DID break scoring records!
- paulr

That trade gave the Bruins 2 cups, all because Espo didn't get along with Billy Reay.

I fully expect Sikura to be resigned and make the team out of camp next fall. Agree, his compete level is one of the best on the team already. The things that can help him elevate his game are within his control (i.e. gaining strength) and a summer of working out and being hungry to prove he can score in the NHL will be good for him.

I know there are varying perspectives of him on these boards, but IMO, he is one of the starters in next year's top 9. If the team expects to be more competitive, then you start with players who compete whistle to whistle. And youngsters like Sikura and Caggiula compete.
- AEL_Fox

I hope Colliton entertains the idea of using Sikura on the PK next season. He has shown that he's very good getting his stick on the puck and disrupting plays, and he's good at controlling the puck in tight areas. His lateral quickness seems to be adequate for such a role. If he's able to do well as a PK'er, maybe he finds a role as more of a defensive winger that can contribute some depth scoring rather than offensive winger that can contribute a little defense.

It is though

Panarin continues to break scoring records at Columbus and is one of the top wingers in the league and we traded him for a 3rd liner.
- SimpleJack

Yeah ... Jack ... I think it's time to back away from that argument. Did the Hawks get the worst side of that trade? Many, including me, at least in retrospect, would agree the Hawks would have been better off keeping Panarin. But, it's not a terrible trade by any fair measurement and it's certainly not the worst Hawks trade ever.

That trade gave the Bruins 2 cups, all because Espo didn't get along with Billy Reay.
- LAHawk

I'm old enough to remember. Which leads to the question who is the greatest player of all time? I say Bobby Orr hands down.

I'm old enough to remember. Which leads to the question who is the greatest player of all time? I say Bobby Orr hands down.
- paulr

I agree Orr over Gretzky because Orr revolutionized the way defenseman played the game from basically not joining the rush and staying at the points to what a modern day defenseman is thought of today. Gretzky could think the game at a whole different level, but he did not revolutionize what a centerman does.

I remember the 20 games that Orr played with the Hawks on one leg, that was a sad sight to see.

I agree Orr over Gretzky because Orr revolutionized the way defenseman played the game from basically not joining the rush and staying at the points to what a modern day defenseman is thought of today. Gretzky could think the game at a whole different level, but he did not revolutionize what a centerman does.

I remember the 20 games that Orr played with the Hawks on one leg, that was a sad sight to see.
- LAHawk

Orr not only played offensively at a very high level but he was solid defensively.

My favorite Orr Highlight was him killing a penalty, I'm going to say against the North Stars. The Bruins won the draw in the North Stars zone. Orr skated it back behind his net then took it all the way into the Stars zone. He skated it back to his own end then back to the Stars zone again where he was slashed on the hand and lost his glove. He skated it back to his end and back again and as he passed his glove bent over and pciked it up and put it back on all the while in control of the puck. I have never seen anyone play at a level beyond everyone else. It was like the proverbial men against boys.

I heard an analogy about the Orr against Gretzky debate and I think it fits. Clone Orr and Gretzky 20 times each, give team Orr and team Gretzky comparable goalies and play a 7 game series. It would be no contest because Orr could have stopped Gretzky, Gretzky could never have stopped Orr.

Mark Potash
‏@MarkPotash

Corey Crawford on being in a tough spot to make the playoffs:

"It's still fun to play the game. We're lucky to have the building full. We could be in Florida or something with 7,000 fans in the crowd. So we're pretty lucky to still have a full building to see us play hockey."


With the season they have had...it comes down to this...

I hope Colliton entertains the idea of using Sikura on the PK next season. He has shown that he's very good getting his stick on the puck and disrupting plays, and he's good at controlling the puck in tight areas. His lateral quickness seems to be adequate for such a role. If he's able to do well as a PK'er, maybe he finds a role as more of a defensive winger that can contribute some depth scoring rather than offensive winger that can contribute a little defense.
- EbonyRaptor

Good thought. Somewhat reminiscent of Schmaltz but way better at it, Sikura has a knack for generating takeaways. Sikura is good at engaging in a puck battle and either coming away with it or at least getting it to a teammate. And the size of who he is battling with doesn't deter him. He is the smallest of the combatants 95% of the time.

Orr not only played offensively at a very high level but he was solid defensively.

My favorite Orr Highlight was him killing a penalty, I'm going to say against the North Stars. The Bruins won the draw in the North Stars zone. Orr skated it back behind his net then took it all the way into the Stars zone. He skated it back to his own end then back to the Stars zone again where he was slashed on the hand and lost his glove. He skated it back to his end and back again and as he passed his glove bent over and pciked it up and put it back on all the while in control of the puck. I have never seen anyone play at a level beyond everyone else. It was like the proverbial men against boys.

I heard an analogy about the Orr against Gretzky debate and I think it fits. Clone Orr and Gretzky 20 times each, give team Orr and team Gretzky comparable goalies and play a 7 game series. It would be no contest because Orr could have stopped Gretzky, Gretzky could never have stopped Orr.
- paulr

Orr was the first I saw that used the spinarama, the forward would come out to block his shot, next thing you knew he spun and the forward was left looking for his jock.

Dylan Sikura back where he belongs in the AHL, finally.

I agree Orr over Gretzky because Orr revolutionized the way defenseman played the game from basically not joining the rush and staying at the points to what a modern day defenseman is thought of today. Gretzky could think the game at a whole different level, but he did not revolutionize what a centerman does.

I remember the 20 games that Orr played with the Hawks on one leg, that was a sad sight to see.
- LAHawk

I was able to see him in one game during that time. He'd only be out for the power play. When he got the puck, no one from the opposing team would get within 15 feet of him because they didn't want to be the guy who ended Orr's career.

Good thought. Somewhat reminiscent of Schmaltz but way better at it, Sikura has a knack for generating takeaways. Sikura is good at engaging in a puck battle and either coming away with it or at least getting it to a teammate. And the size of who he is battling with doesn't deter him. He is the smallest of the combatants 95% of the time.
- AEL_Fox

Is he ready to block shots? I think to be good on the PK you need to be willing to sacrifice your body occasionally. I do not see too much of an inclination in that regard from Schmaltz, Sikura, TT. Maybe because they are small guys. But Kruger is small and still blocks shots.

Lets have Sikura focus on improving at forward, before we start playing him on the PK.

Defense and Goaltending. Hawks won Cups based on either strong D or outstanding Goaltending (or both). 2010 team was deep defensively and got just enough goaltending from Niemi to win. Crawford should have won the Conn Smythe in 2013, and in 2015 you had 4 d-men play their asses off and Crawford being very good. Bruins and Kings won cups with outstanding Goaltending and good to great D. Pens and Caps got good to great goaltending to offset average D.

The Hawks need to really look closely at the Organization's defensive depth and potential and make a determination not just for next season but long term. Currently you have three young defensemen that you need to make a decision on. Forsling and Koekkoek are both RFA's, and Dahlstrom you just extended for minimal money. Dahlstrom is a 7th D with still the potential to improve and move up and can be used in a 3rd pairing without killing you. KoekKoek is the oldest of the 3 and a prior 1st round pick. He probably still possesses the highest upside, but most likely needs a regular spot, at least on the 3rd pair, to be able to settle in. Forsling at 22 is hard to give up on potential wise, but the eye test tells you that even after 120 NHL games, he still makes very poor reads, has bad gap control and takes awful angles to pucks. If the strength of his game is on the offensive side, he still has not shown that either.

At this point IMO, you let Forsling walk, you have Dahlstrom as an insurance policy of a player you know can be a responsible NHL D-man and if you can sign KoekKoek to a contract similar to Dahlstrom you have 2 who don't hurt your cap at all and can be used in Rockford if one of the other young d-men step up and can play.
- TheTrob

Your analysis is logical and practical. For whatever reasons, though, the last 30 gp or so Forsling plays nearly always and one of the othet two sit. I am guessing that the biggest reason for that is due to the being in love concept of how to take advantage of Forslings' skillset..This was their thinking at the beginning of last season and may have been influenced by Samuelson

Make no mistake it is all on Bowman now who tells Colliton to play Forsling. There probably is wiggle toom for Colliton to overrule and heakthy scratch him. But he has to be atrocious. Reality is that Forsling has been up and down with his play. Overall you do hit the nail on the head.

I have mentioned what wiz told me about Forsling. I still believe that is probably going to "play" out. Wiz said that maybe they give him until xmas to improve.

Improve to what extent. Don't know. Until xmas eh? Oh maybe the time frame shrinks if one or more prospects turn heads..And i do not say that even should Forsling blossom after leaving Chicago, we do not have a Lou Brock situation whereas the baseball Cubs outfielder went on to be come a star for the hated enemy the st Louis Cardinals.

Forsling top selling point: not his shot (which is very good) rather ability to make proper good reads and make a play at speed. Wiz explained he is best on team in this facet....[and] This is what the league wants its puck movers to be capable to produce. The example wiz gives is how I Cole role changed for Penguins. Was a #5 dman on Cup winner. Solid enough. Later (next season) asked to handle puck make play at speed. The former first rounder could not comply. Was healthy scratch often. Landed in Colorado.

I agree Orr over Gretzky because Orr revolutionized the way defenseman played the game from basically not joining the rush and staying at the points to what a modern day defenseman is thought of today. Gretzky could think the game at a whole different level, but he did not revolutionize what a centerman does.

I remember the 20 games that Orr played with the Hawks on one leg, that was a sad sight to see.
- LAHawk

On ice, you can debate as you wish. There is no doubt that the NHL is what it is today because of Wayne Gretzky. From his scoring prowess to his move to LA and all that followed. No one has done more for hockey on and off of the ice for than Wayne Gretzky.

Winnipeg is a Big, Heavy, Fast, skilled team. You really have to wonder why they don't dominate the way Tampa does. For all their size and skill they tend to get into streaks where they play incredibly sloppy and/or stupid. They are not a great Defensive team and give up a TON of shots. Hellebuyck has a decent save pct, but his GAA is high because of the number of shots against.
- TheTrob

Coaching. Only one top dman in Morrisey. Post esrlier by Rick i totally concur

@Dylan Sikura

I hope Colliton entertains the idea of using Sikura on the PK next season. He has shown that he's very good getting his stick on the puck and disrupting plays, and he's good at controlling the puck in tight areas. His lateral quickness seems to be adequate for such a role. If he's able to do well as a PK'er, maybe he finds a role as more of a defensive winger that can contribute some depth scoring rather than offensive winger that can contribute a little defense.
- EbonyRaptor

I like this train of thought. His progress lately has been good and he may get that opportunity next year or the year after. I think the Hawks need more PK depth at forward. Top PK forwards for the Hawks this year in terms of total minutes were

Toews
Saad
Kruger
Kampf
AA

Next were Caggiula and Johnson each playing about 20 minutes PK time in somewhat shorter # of games.

The PK was brutal. One area that Schmaltz did pretty well at in his time here was the PK. Strome hasn't really played the PK, but the Hawks could use a couple more solid PK options. Even with his bounce back, I think it would be good if they could lean on Toews less for the PK faceoffs, especially with all the pressure to produce offensively.

Saad was pretty solid on the PK this year, something that folks love to overlook when doing the inevitable trade comparison. I'm not saying it is everything, but it adds value. While AA was also decent on the Pk, I think the Hawks should try to move him and pickup someone else they can trust to win those shorthanded draws.

Toews took the starting faceoffs the most, followed by Kampf/Kruger. AA has most of his PK time on the fly coming off the bench, which usually meant the Hawks got the puck out and were in a better position not to be scored on because they've already turned the PP back to get a change.

I guess to summarize, Kampf could hopefully do more. I don't know if Kruger will be back, but if not, it is another spot for a PK Center. If they don't fill that gap, then AA or someone else needs to take more draws or they exhaust Toews more on the defensive end. Sikura, like you say might be a good PK option. I think they need at least one more good PK guy to be added, in addition to probably finding a Dman to take regular PK minutes.

I fully expect Sikura to be resigned and make the team out of camp next fall. Agree, his compete level is one of the best on the team already. The things that can help him elevate his game are within his control (i.e. gaining strength) and a summer of working out and being hungry to prove he can score in the NHL will be good for him.

I know there are varying perspectives of him on these boards, but IMO, he is one of the starters in next year's top 9. If the team expects to be more competitive, then you start with players who compete whistle to whistle. And youngsters like Sikura and Caggiula compete.
- AEL_Fox

Top 9
Kane
Toews
Saad
ADB
Strome
Kahun
#3C you acquire in trade or free agency

The last two spots are up for grabs. AA (if he is still here)? Sikura? Perlini? Hayden? Kampf? prospect? free agent?

Posters have said that AA moves after the Hawks pay AA his July 1 bonus. Wouldn't it be better to move him before the draft and eat the amount of his July 1 bonus? Dollars wise it would be the same for the Hawks and the team acquiring AA.

Your analysis is logical and practical. For whatever reasons, though, the last 30 gp or so Forsling plays nearly always and one of the othet two sit. I am guessing that the biggest reason for that is due to the being in love concept of how to take advantage of Forslings' skillset..This was their thinking at the beginning of last season and may have been influenced by Samuelson

Make no mistake it is all on Bowman now who tells Colliton to play Forsling. There probably is wiggle toom for Colliton to overrule and heakthy scratch him. But he has to be atrocious. Reality is that Forsling has been up and down with his play. Overall you do hit the nail on the head.

I have mentioned what wiz told me about Forsling. I still believe that is probably going to "play" out. Wiz said that maybe they give him until xmas to improve.

Improve to what extent. Don't know. Until xmas eh? Oh maybe the time frame shrinks if one or more prospects turn heads..And i do not say that even should Forsling blossom after leaving Chicago, we do not have a Lou Brock situation whereas the baseball Cubs outfielder went on to be come a star for the hated enemy the st Louis Cardinals.

Forsling top selling point: not his shot (which is very good) rather ability to make proper good reads and make a play at speed. Wiz explained he is best on team in this facet....
- jhawk59[and] This is what the league wants its puck movers to be capable to produce. The example wiz gives is how I Cole role changed for Penguins. Was a #5 dman on Cup winner. Solid enough. Later (next season) asked to handle puck make play at speed. The former first rounder could not comply. Was healthy scratch often. Landed in Colorado.

If that was the case, then somewhere along the line he lost that ability. His reads are by far the worst on the team. He steps up at the wrong times, fails to see plays developing and if and when he does his angles to the play or the puck are awful. I won't even get into the poor passing and the turnovers that continue and show little improvement.

On ice, you can debate as you wish. There is no doubt that the NHL is what it is today because of Wayne Gretzky. From his scoring prowess to his move to LA and all that followed. No one has done more for hockey on and off of the ice for than Wayne Gretzky.
- TrueGrit

Gretzky and Bettman have done more for the game in the U.S than anyone. Orr was the best player ever.

@Dylan Sikura


- EnzoD

Kruger lol