Why would the other team trade a young, established legit top four guy for a prospect who might become what they already have?
- mohel

Cap hell Winnipeg tampa Toronto etc.. Plus there would be more added in the potential trade than just a young d prospect.

Justin would be willing to give a one young d prospects for a young established top 4 d man?
Only using this as an example: boqvist, Mitchell, etc..for say salvin, truboa, pesce etc..
- Scott1977

I'd rather stay the course with the D prospects but who the Hawks draft this June may play a factor, particularly if they pick a defenseman like Byram or Broberg with their #1 pick and even with their 2nd rounder.

You are on to something in that the Hawks did publicly state a month or so ago that they would be willing to trade one of their D prospects. Would they actually do it? Of course, the right deal has to come along.

Dale would have loaded up with a bunch of face-punching bone chewers.
- mohel

dale favors injury-prone guys.

That's where my head is at with approaching the forwards given Tyler's blog today about possibly not going the route of a singular top 6 forward but two top 9 forwards instead.

I haven't gone on to Capfriendly to price this all out to see if it would even work (i.e. can the Hawks take on forwards like Ferland and Dzingel while retaining Anisimov and not handcuff their ability to improve the blueline) but just for brainstorming sake:

Ferland - Toews - Kane
DeBrincat - Strome - Perlini
Saad - Anisimov - Dzingel
Caggiula - Kampf - Hayden

Ferland, Perlini, Saad, Anisimov, and Dzingel are somewhat interchangeable as far as slotting on any of lines 1-3. Caggiula, too, but he may be best as a 4th liner that can agitate and grind.

If Anisimov has to move to make this work, maybe something like:

Ferland - Toews - Kane
DeBrincat - Strome - Perlini
Saad - Dzingel - Sikura
Caggiula - Kampf - Hayden

I like this 2nd option much better actually.
- AEL_Fox

I understand the thinking. Could be that the guys you added will cause some cap issues in a couple seasons. But I think it would be easier to do that than trying to find a high end defenseman.

Is Cody Ceci a legit top 4? He is an RFA, and I don't see Ottawa wanting to pay him, maybe trade Anisimov and a mid draft pick for him, as AA's actual cash outlay is less than his AAV is after this year.
- LAHawk

No. He blows.

I'd rather stay the course with the D prospects but who the Hawks draft this June may play a factor, particularly if they pick a defenseman like Byram or Broberg with their #1 pick and even with their 2nd rounder.

You are on to something in that the Hawks did publicly state a month or so ago that they would be willing to trade one of their D prospects. Would they actually do it? Of course, the right deal has to come along.
- AEL_Fox

Is there another Kempney/Rutta (before concussion) in the Euro leagues that Stan can snag?

Cap hell Winnipeg tampa Toronto etc.. Plus there would be more added in the potential trade than just a young d prospect.
- Scott1977

what if the younger D had a higher POTENTIAL ceiling than the current establish D?

No. He blows.
- Elbows15

and thats per the scouting report, thanks for looking that up Elbows!!!

Why would the other team trade a young, established legit top four guy for a prospect who might become what they already have?
- mohel

They won't. Slavin is about as close to an untouchable as it gets for D-men in the league. He's good. Real good. Pesce is on a good contact and probably the Canes' 2nd best D-man.


Why are they trading them? If anyone, they will look to move Faulk before either of those two.


Trouba is a RFA and maybe they could trade for his rights but is he a 8ishM d-man? He has missed a lot of time with injuries. Not really a PP guy. I like him but I am not sure what he is exactly. Doesn't seem to be a 1. Top pair? Prolly, but actually think he is the ideal #3. The question for me is he worth paying twice as much as Murphy and does he bring twice the play?

Yeah yeah. Not your point but it was a good launch point for my ramblings.

I think we can all agree that:
A) This is a very talented offensive team from top to bottom.
B) Crow (if healthy for a full year) is good enough to contend for a cup.
C) The team D needs to be better, much better.

The questions now are:
1) How much better can this team get defensively with a lot of the same personnel?
2) What type of players do we need to add?
3) How much will they cost (in players, prospects, picks, cap space)?

This team can get a lot better defensively with about the same personnel. We have seen hints of it already. Witness two games against offensively challenged teams (AZ and Dallas) and 2 periods against a very good offensive team (Toronto). You can see changes in structure and commitment.

How much would a good 200’ 3C that can win faceoffs and bring some offense help the team D? I think you can get that in free agency at a reasonable price and term.

How much would a gritty veteran 4th line winger help team defense. I think you can get that cheap in free agency.

Saad - Toews - Kane
ADB - Strome - Perlini
Sikura - FA 3C - Kahun
Caggiula - Kampf - Gritty FA
13th C/F Kruger or ?

A top 4 is also needed. What will it cost? Ideally AA, a 2020 1st round pick, one of our prized defensive prospects, maybe another pick or prospect. Maybe even Saad (instead of AA). You pay it.

Joki - Keith
Murphy - trade acquisition
Seabs - Gus
7th defender - Koekkoek or Dahlstrom or ?

Crow and Delia (or a surprise like Lankinen, Nalimov, or Forsberg)

Ok Stan. Get r done.

I may be in the minority on this but every time I've watched Winnipeg this season Ben Chiarot looks like he might fit the bill.
- EbonyRaptor

I agree with you. For this team, the ideal free agents should be in the 25 to 28 year old range. Ben Chariot would be ideal. I believe he is coming off of a deal that pays him slightly under 2 million ??? Could be had for 3 or 4 million at the most. Winnepeg is slated to be in cap hell ..... they cannot sign everyone and depending on how much of a raise he is looking for, Jets most likely will not be able to afford him

and thats per the scouting report, thanks for looking that up Elbows!!!

- glennjpawlak22

Personal opinion. But he is terrible. Ottawa has been trying to give him away for a couple of season. No one wants him.

Honestly, Manning may actually provide more to a team than Ceci. THIS version of Ceci.

I would much rather let Sikura grow into his boy body, you can almost see through him he's so skinny
- BetweenTheDots

Sikura seems to have good instincts but YES is way undersized and generally plays around the perimeter and when he goes down low, is knocked off of the puck many times.

They won't. Slavin is about as close to an untouchable as it gets for D-men in the league. He's good. Real good. Pesce is on a good contact and probably the Canes' 2nd best D-man.


Why are they trading them? If anyone, they will look to move Faulk before either of those two.


Trouba is a RFA and maybe they could trade for his rights but is he a 8ishM d-man? He has missed a lot of time with injuries. Not really a PP guy. I like him but I am not sure what he is exactly. Doesn't seem to be a 1. Top pair? Prolly, but actually think he is the ideal #3. The question for me is he worth paying twice as much as Murphy and does he bring twice the play?

Yeah yeah. Not your point but it was a good launch point for my ramblings.
- Elbows15

Glad to read your ramblings.

Personal opinion. But he is terrible. Ottawa has been trying to give him away for a couple of season. No one wants him.

Honestly, Manning may actually provide more to a team than Ceci. THIS version of Ceci.
- Elbows15

That is extra strength Lavender bullet board material for Ceci!!!!

I agree with you. For this team, the ideal free agents should be in the 25 to 28 year old range. Ben Chariot would be ideal. I believe he is coming off of a deal that pays him slightly under 2 million ??? Could be had for 3 or 4 million at the most. Winnepeg is slated to be in cap hell ..... they cannot sign everyone and depending on how much of a raise he is looking for, Jets most likely will not be able to afford him
- chuckdahammer

Why add more to the mix of bottom 3 D-men? He is good in his role of a bottom pair D-man but the injuries to the Jets d-men, Buff and Morrisey, have forced Chariot to play up in the pairings. Coincides with the Jets play falling off. Well, that and Hellebuyck play being meh-ish

Sikura seems to have good instincts but YES is way undersized and generally plays around the perimeter and when he goes down low, is knocked off of the puck many times.
- chuckdahammer

So a kid playing his first year of pro hockey needs to get stronger? Well, yeah. Point is he gets in there. Has won his share of board battles. He goes to the net a lot.

That is extra strength Lavender bullet board material for Ceci!!!!
- TrueGrit

Three shifts and this crowd would be calling for his head. I would join them. He really is not good.

I think we can all agree that:
A) This is a very talented offensive team from top to bottom.
B) Crow (if healthy for a full year) is good enough to contend for a cup.
C) The team D needs to be better, much better.

The questions now are:
1) How much better can this team get defensively with a lot of the same personnel?
2) What type of players do we need to add?
3) How much will they cost (in players, prospects, picks, cap space)?

This team can get a lot better defensively with about the same personnel. We have seen hints of it already. Witness two games against offensively challenged teams (AZ and Dallas) and 2 periods against a very good offensive team (Toronto). You can see changes in structure and commitment.

How much would a good 200’ 3C that can win faceoffs and bring some offense help the team D? I think you can get that in free agency at a reasonable price and term.

How much would a gritty veteran 4th line winger help team defense. I think you can get that cheap in free agency.

Saad - Toews - Kane
ADB - Strome - Perlini
Sikura - FA 3C - Kahun
Caggiula - Kampf - Gritty FA
13th C/F Kruger or ?

A top 4 is also needed. What will it cost? Ideally AA, a 2020 1st round pick, one of our prized defensive prospects, maybe another pick or prospect. Maybe even Saad (instead of AA). You pay it.

Joki - Keith
Murphy - trade acquisition
Seabs - Gus
7th defender - Koekkoek or Dahlstrom or ?

Crow and Delia (or a surprise like Lankinen, Nalimov, or Forsberg)

Ok Stan. Get r done.
- -Doh-

Nazem Kadri fits your 3C description to a tee. Would you trade Gus and a #2 pick for him (knowing Toronto can't add on salary)?

Nazem Kadri fits your 3C description to a tee. Would you trade Gus and a #2 pick for him (knowing Toronto can't add on salary)?
- LAHawk

They have cap issues. Gus would be more than enough. No reason to add anything else. If someone else does, oh well.

Delia was just extended for 3 years at that low Cap hit and that is what intrigues me.
- 67hawks

I think they had better hold onto Forsberg ,he has the better pedigree . To me Delia is a flash in the pan .

I understand the thinking. Could be that the guys you added will cause some cap issues in a couple seasons. But I think it would be easier to do that than trying to find a high end defenseman.
- mohel

Yeah, agree that the tricky part is avoiding cap issues despite this likely being the more feasible path for personnel changes this summer. I also didn't factor in the salary raises for DeBrincat and Strome, not to mention other free agents.

I think they had better hold onto Forsberg ,he has the better pedigree . To me Delia is a flash in the pan .
- oldduffman

Forsberg is an RFA, no leverage, I would definitely hold onto him.

As long as Saad plays more Hossa-like on a consistent basis, they can't trade him.

Adding depth D guys below the top pair may still be of value, especially if it means guys who are still AHL types aren't in the lineup anymore, and are solid 15-18 minute guys who know how to clear the zone and the crease.

But not worth moving Saad to get a 3/4 guy.
- Return of the Roar

Saad really doesn't play like Hossa at all. He sometimes shows a similar speed power move other than that I don't see a lot of similarities. Hossa is a HOF. Saad is an above avg top 6 power forward (minus the physical play).

Hossa elite at puck possession, elite at stick handling (despite using such a long stick), had an elite shot, elite goal scorer, one of the best back checkers I've ever seen. Hossa would also lay some big time hits when needed.

Its $48MM with CC off the books. Go with Delia as your #1 and yes, you have more room. Jury is still out on him, and even if he rises to the occasion, his deal is over in 21-22, leaving them with the need to sign a #1 goalie at a #1 salary hit. That will be at least what CC makes now.
- Return of the Roar

It still leaves them with money to sign a few guys. Just saying there is a bit more wiggle room than you've implied.