So now everyone thinks Murphy sucks? Okay.

Other than the fact that he is playing top-line minutes in Rockfish - and learning the pro game there as a 19 year old - what evidence is there that Colliton doesn't like him?

How about - he's not ready for prime time yet - he still has a lot to learn - and unlike some other 19 year olds who may very well have had their careers limited by going directly from juniors to the Show - he will be better off developing in the top minor league into what the Hawks (including the head coach) assume will be a top-pairing defenseman?

I like that analysis better....
- StLBravesFan

Me, too.

last nights showtime. Kane on the winner should solidify him for the Hart. How many times has he did that this season. he is standing on his head to carry team late, Kutcherov has big leads at this stage and lots of help from four lines.

last nights showtime. Kane on the winner should solidify him for the Hart. How many times has he did that this season. he is standing on his head to carry team late, Kutcherov has big leads at this stage and lots of help from four lines.
- holyJumpin_NL

He's certainly having an MVP year, but he was a ghost til he buried there at the end.

He's certainly having an MVP year, but he was a ghost til he buried there at the end.
- nickmo2699

And Toews couldn't catch a pass on his stick until he could.

Is he a 2nd pair guy on a Cup contender, or just the Hawks. I'd rather not pay big money for the latter.
- mohel

His TOI is 18:25 playing for Cup contender Winnipeg. He is one of the 4 d-men in their PK rotation. He's LD, got good size (6'3" / 220lbs) and skates well. He's 27 and his cap hit this season is only $1.4M. Because he doesn't score much (15 points in 59 games this season) he probably won't be too expensive. If he can be signed for under $4M I think it would be a pretty good deal.

His TOI is 18:25 playing for Cup contender Winnipeg. He is one of the 4 d-men in their PK rotation. He's LD, got good size (6'3" / 220lbs) and skates well. He's 27 and his cap hit this season is only $1.4M. Because he doesn't score much (15 points in 59 games this season) he probably won't be too expensive. If he can be signed for under $4M I think it would be a pretty good deal.
- EbonyRaptor

Comparable to Hammer? If so, Hammer got over $5M to re-sign in the desert.

I know people say Seabrook can't be moved, but I think we've seen everyone can be moved in the right deal. What do you think it would take to move him? Hawks retain 1.2/1.5 million, add a 2nd + a good prospect? There are teams that will have the cap headroom.
- breadbag

I think it will take more than that to find a sucker ... er ... I mean buyer for Seabrook. The problem isn't that he's awful - he isn't, nor is the problem that he is overpaid because the Hawks could retain 50% and Seabrook at $3.4M is a lot closer to acceptable. The problem is he has 5 years remaining after this season - 5 YEARS! If Seabrook is barely a $3.4M d-man now - how much hope does it take to believe Seabrook will be close to a $3.4M d-man 3-4-5 years from now.

I think to trade Seabrook would take something like 50% retained and Mitchell for a 7th round pick ... and saving $3.4M off the cap would probably be worth it.

Comparable to Hammer? If so, Hammer got over $5M to re-sign in the desert.
- mohel

Yeah maybe. I don't know what it will take to sign him. I certainly wouldn't compare him to the old Hjalmarsson but I haven't seen enough of Hjalmarsson lately to know if he's worth $5M.

I like Chiarot but not sure if he is top 4 material. A solid 3rd pair, though. Could be wrong, though.

Either way, sign me up. Might be worth it if Colliton decides Jokiharju needs more time in Rockford and he keeps Keith and Seabrook together.
- AEL_Fox

This describes so many d-men in the league now. There is a severe shortage of top-4 d-men, and because of this the salaries being paid to borderline second pairing guys has become a little ridiculous. I think the league is in the process of transitioning again, like it did from wide-open hockey, to the Devils and their "left-wing lock" to the Hawks and solid D and high possession numbers, the Bruins and Kings with size and physicality, to the Penguins and Caps with a little more wide open Offense again.

It all goes in cycles, and we seem to be in one now where a lot of the young d-men coming into the league are more puck movers and offensive minded, while the emphasis on pure defensive d-men has dwindled. Maybe we need to start changing our perception of what a top-4 d-man should bring.

His TOI is 18:25 playing for Cup contender Winnipeg. He is one of the 4 d-men in their PK rotation. He's LD, got good size (6'3" / 220lbs) and skates well. He's 27 and his cap hit this season is only $1.4M. Because he doesn't score much (15 points in 59 games this season) he probably won't be too expensive. If he can be signed for under $4M I think it would be a pretty good deal.
- EbonyRaptor

Chiarot is also a UFA so doesn't cost any assets. As long as the salary terms are reasonable, worth kicking the tires on. I agree, he's better than Koekkoek, Dahlstrom, and Forsling as they stand today. He's also better at D than Gustafsson.

To me, you add someone like Chiarot but make sure he is slotted properly. Part of the roster issues besides overall team defense has been inappropriate slotting due to lack of depth. Not sure what the advanced stats bare out on whether Chiarot is a top 4 defender or a 3rd pair type.

So now everyone thinks Murphy sucks? Okay.
- nickmo2699

...and Saad is a stud

Yeah maybe. I don't know what it will take to sign him. I certainly wouldn't compare him to the old Hjalmarsson but I haven't seen enough of Hjalmarsson lately to know if he's worth $5M.
- EbonyRaptor

Me, either. The trouble with the UFA market is the term that's needed to get the guy.

I think it will take more than that to find a sucker ... er ... I mean buyer for Seabrook. The problem isn't that he's awful - he isn't, nor is the problem that he is overpaid because the Hawks could retain 50% and Seabrook at $3.4M is a lot closer to acceptable. The problem is he has 5 years remaining after this season - 5 YEARS! If Seabrook is barely a $3.4M d-man now - how much hope does it take to believe Seabrook will be close to a $3.4M d-man 3-4-5 years from now.

I think to trade Seabrook would take something like 50% retained and Mitchell for a 7th round pick ... and saving $3.4M off the cap would probably be worth it.
- EbonyRaptor

At this point they are not Cap-crunched. There is no reason to bury 3.4 million for multiple years until they are, or until Seabrook is completely useless.

Chiarot is also a UFA so doesn't cost any assets. As long as the salary terms are reasonable, worth kicking the tires on. I agree, he's better than Koekkoek, Dahlstrom, and Forsling as they stand today. He's also better at D than Gustafsson.

To me, you add someone like Chiarot but make sure he is slotted properly. Part of the roster issues besides overall team defense has been inappropriate slotting due to lack of depth. Not sure what the advanced stats bare out on whether Chiarot is a top 4 defender or a 3rd pair type.
- AEL_Fox

What term does he want? You have to look 3 years out and project where do you expect your own D prospects being? Bovquist, Beaudin, Joki, Carlsson, Galvas, Mitchell, Hillman, you know that Keith and Seabrook are more likely than not to still be here.

...and Saad is a stud
- StutzBlackhawk

he definitely was dynamic last night - thats the Saad i like to pay $6MM.

This describes so many d-men in the league now. There is a severe shortage of top-4 d-men, and because of this the salaries being paid to borderline second pairing guys has become a little ridiculous. I think the league is in the process of transitioning again, like it did from wide-open hockey, to the Devils and their "left-wing lock" to the Hawks and solid D and high possession numbers, the Bruins and Kings with size and physicality, to the Penguins and Caps with a little more wide open Offense again.

It all goes in cycles, and we seem to be in one now where a lot of the young d-men coming into the league are more puck movers and offensive minded, while the emphasis on pure defensive d-men has dwindled. Maybe we need to start changing our perception of what a top-4 d-man should bring.
- TheTrob

I would agree with that perception of how teams are trending with D-men. I recall at the past two drafts at least that a few GMs using the term "modern NHL defensemen" and they were alluding to prospects like Jokiharju, Boqvist, Dahlin, Q Hughes, Heiskanen, Brannstrom, Makar, etc.

While we contemplate which free agents are going to sign here this summer, did anybody notice the performance bonuses that could be paid out? https://www.capfriendly.c...ckhawks/performance-bonus
Does anybody know what each player has to do to earn these bonuses?

At this point they are not Cap-crunched. There is no reason to bury 3.4 million for multiple years until they are, or until Seabrook is completely useless.
- TheTrob

Yep. The calculus becomes Seabrook at $6.8, or the cost of his replacement plus $3.4.

What term does he want? You have to look 3 years out and project where do you expect your own D prospects being? Bovquist, Beaudin, Joki, Carlsson, Galvas, Mitchell, Hillman, you know that Keith and Seabrook are more likely than not to still be here.
- LAHawk

Exactly.

So it's three years to wait and see which two or three of those guys make it, because the numbers say they all won't, combined with not enough cap space to sign even one top four D talent in at least the first two of those three years.

Can Stan upgrade worst case at even money with the crop of D guys he has now?

These are the only two paths to upgrading the D available to the Hawks - wait and see or make good cap neutral trades.

Other than the fact that he is playing top-line minutes in Rockfish - and learning the pro game there as a 19 year old - what evidence is there that Colliton doesn't like him?

How about - he's not ready for prime time yet - he still has a lot to learn - and unlike some other 19 year olds who may very well have had their careers limited by going directly from juniors to the Show - he will be better off developing in the top minor league into what the Hawks (including the head coach) assume will be a top-pairing defenseman?

I like that analysis better....
- StLBravesFan

I question the reason Joki was sent to Rockford when he was. He is just short of the magic "40 games" that would constitute a full season toward UFA status. Keeping him under 40 games effectively adds another year until he transitions from team control to UFA. Were there signs that he was struggling a bit more than he was earlier in the season? Yeah but there were also extenuating circumstances like moving him around from Keith's partner to LD and other positions. The changes to how he was used seemed counterproductive and doubtful he helped him.

The idea that rushing a player is a bad thing is generally a matter of that player losing confidence and either thinking too much or playing scared. The word on Joki was that he is an extremely confident guy and that would appear to be supported with the way he played at WJC - he wasn't in a shell because his confidence was shattered from playing in the NHL too soon.

I'm not against him spending the rest of the season in Rockford or even all of next season there - he will play for the Hawks when all things considered are best - but I'm not buying into the notion that Joki went "deer in the headlights" after the first couple months of the season.

Exactly.

So it's three years to wait and see which two or three of those guys make it, because the numbers say they all won't, combined with not enough cap space to sign even one top four D talent in at least the first two of those three years.

Can Stan upgrade worst case at even money with the crop of D guys he has now?

These are the only two paths to upgrading the D available to the Hawks - wait and see or make good cap neutral trades.
- Return of the Roar

Yup, hopefully Anisimov plus can get you a top 4 defeseman

So now everyone thinks Murphy sucks? Okay.
- nickmo2699

Not everyone. Murph is a solid 2nd pair guy.

While we contemplate which free agents are going to sign here this summer, did anybody notice the performance bonuses that could be paid out? https://www.capfriendly.c...ckhawks/performance-bonus
Does anybody know what each player has to do to earn these bonuses?
- 333inthe3rd

Strome is the only one that would be costly. Most of those larger amounts are for top 10 spots in scoring for forwards or various awards. The lesser amounts are for games played for the most part. Even if Dinky hits all of his, its less than a million. It won't be an issue cause the Hawks have the cap space to handle them for this season. No carry over like they had to deal with in the past.

I question the reason Joki was sent to Rockford when he was. He is just short of the magic "40 games" that would constitute a full season toward UFA status. Keeping him under 40 games effectively adds another year until he transitions from team control to UFA. Were there signs that he was struggling a bit more than he was earlier in the season? Yeah but there were also extenuating circumstances like moving him around from Keith's partner to LD and other positions. The changes to how he was used seemed counterproductive and doubtful he helped him.

The idea that rushing a player is a bad thing is generally a matter of that player losing confidence and either thinking too much or playing scared. The word on Joki was that he is an extremely confident guy and that would appear to be supported with the way he played at WJC - he wasn't in a shell because his confidence was shattered from playing in the NHL too soon.

I'm not against him spending the rest of the season in Rockford or even all of next season there - he will play for the Hawks when all things considered are best - but I'm not buying into the notion that Joki went "deer in the headlights" after the first couple months of the season.
- EbonyRaptor

I don't think he went deer in headlights, but he was at his best the first couple weeks of the season. He is a young guy and a rookie that makes some mistakes.

I do think the Hawks are looking to next year more than this year. They didn't sign anyone crazy in the offseason, they didn't buy any rentals at TDL, they probably do feel he needs big minutes for his development. Joki might have gotten minutes in our top pair early in the year, but he isn't yet a top pair NHL dman. I hope they let him develop into it.