Pickard being signed doesn't make him the better NHL goalie. He was signed for the game he got lit up last year in the NHL. Didn't help him.
- Unholy_Goalie

1 game*

I doubt the one game he sucked in last year didn't earn him much trust though.
- Unholy_Goalie

who did the Leafs play in that game?

1 game*
- Steven_Seagull

AHL back-up the rest of the year.

Quick.... To the Cloning Machine!

We need to clone us an Andersen!




ps: never clone a clone from a clone
- dmnted

The issue for me is, if Babcock does not trust the backup, how can fans?
I hope the guy can be Pickard, but what happens if Babcock still doesn't trust one of our other goalies.
Also, Andersen is danish. You don't clone danishes, you bake them or order them from the danish bakery

UG, please select all images with street signs, thanks.



- As_I_See_It

Second image is a highway sign, not a street sign

I'm willing to debate you for 20 pages on this subject

who did the Leafs play in that game?
- dmnted

4 goals against on 28 shots, OTL @ Colorado.

4 goals against on 28 shots, OTL @ Colorado.
- Unholy_Goalie

Watching any cool TV shows?

AHL back-up the rest of the year.
- Unholy_Goalie

Played 10 less games than Sparks.

They're proven NHL goalies who can be relied upon to be better back-ups. They're just better goalies, period.
- Unholy_Goalie

Why not get a proven backup to be the backup? Goalies who are used to playing as a starter doesn't mean they will for sure put up as good or better stats with less games.

Career GAA, and SV%

Lehtonen: 2.71 - .912

Mason: 2.70 - .911

Pickard: 2.78 - .913
- Steven_Seagull

669 career games. 34 years old.

476 career games. 30 years old.

87 career games. 26 years old.

By time Lehtonen and Mason were 26 years old, they had a lot more than 87 games under their belt, a lot more wins, a lot more time in the NHL.

669 career games. 34 years old.

476 career games. 30 years old.

87 career games. 26 years old.

By time Lehtonen and Mason were 26 years old, they had a lot more than 87 games under their belt, a lot more wins, a lot more time in the NHL.
- Unholy_Goalie

Those extra games didn’t help them have better stats.

Why not get a proven backup to be the backup? Goalies who are used to playing as a starter doesn't mean they will for sure put up as good or better stats with less games.
- burn

Ryan Miller was fine as a back-up who was a starter for years. Rather have legit NHL goalies than roll the dice on unproven (Sparks) NHL back-ups.

Sparks and Pickards odds of being starters are slim to none. If they were legit, top prospect, 20 or 21 year olds, that would be one thing. But they're not that good. It's not nearly as important to the development of goalies because the Leafs goaltending prospects are slim to none.

They should be developing goalies, but those two guys aren't likely to go anywhere past back-up status and for the coming year, they need a guarantee they can get 25-30 games out of their back-up, not a "hope" to "develop" a middle of the road back-up like Sparks or Pickard are likely to become.
- Unholy_Goalie

Doubles and triples. Everything counts. Having a young, eager backup on a ELC is what smart teams do. We have two excellent goaltending prospects; I don't know how else to classify them, because they're putting up all-time numbers playing in a development league.

Nobody's drafting goaltenders in the first round anymore, because nobody knows what they have until they start to do things like Sparks and Pickard have done.

And once they start putting up those numbers, how could you not?

Look at Matt Murray: lit it up with the farm team for two years, just like Sparks has done. Comes up, plays a dozen games in the NHL, does really well. Year after, same thing. This year? .907.

What's his trajectory? He's won a cup, sure, but what if he puts up another mediocre season?

The point is, you have to give those guys a shot. Let Sparks start 15-20 games next year; this team is good enough in front of him that he'll likely put up decent numbers, which is all this team needs.

If he doesn't pan out? There will be goalies available, there always is.

Second image is a highway sign, not a street sign

I'm willing to debate you for 20 pages on this subject
- twiztedmike

Sparks and Pickards odds of being starters are slim to none. If they were legit, top prospect, 20 or 21 year olds, that would be one thing. But they're not that good. It's not nearly as important to the development of goalies because the Leafs goaltending prospects are slim to none.

They should be developing goalies, but those two guys aren't likely to go anywhere past back-up status and for the coming year, they need a guarantee they can get 25-30 games out of their back-up, not a "hope" to "develop" a middle of the road back-up like Sparks or Pickard are likely to become.
- Unholy_Goalie

Would you say Sparks AHL career = Lehner AHL career, but at different ages..
Lehner was a starter recently. I would think that Sparks has a chance also to be a starter, granted maybe not with the Leafs.

We're debating signing Kari Lettin-em-in...this takes it to a whole new level of dizzerp.

Those extra games didn’t help them have better stats.
- Steven_Seagull

Still don't know how stats work, huh? Damn shame.

We're debating signing Kari Lettin-em-in...this takes it to a whole new level of dizzerp.
- Zezel

Is it better or worse than arguing about future HOFer Vermette? Let’s debate this for 3 days.

Lehner did everything Sparks did at 21. So by prospect standards, Sparks isn't much of one. He was on a great Marlies team and his NHL stint wasn't that great. Sure he could improve but he can't guarantee you 25-30 quality starts the same way a proven NHL veteran could.
- Unholy_Goalie

Lehner at 21 - 31GP, 2.12, .938
Sparks at 23 - 31GP, 2.16, .922

Just because one got rushed into the league after a good half season in the minors, because his numbers the year before were pretty terrible doesn't mean jack. Sparks just built upon that season with 43GP, 1.79, .936
Not to mention these are goalies, who develop different than players... If you were the GM what would be the point of draft picks? Oh a player isn't a star after 2 seasons, time to move on and get a guy in his 30s... Reminiscent of the early 2000s....

And yea sparks NHL stint was so bad, lets ignore that it was on the team that finished dead last in the league, cant put that in because it doesn't fit my narrative.

Still don't know how stats work, huh? Damn shame.
- Unholy_Goalie

Career GAA, and SV%

Lehtonen: 2.71 - .912

Mason: 2.70 - .911

Pickard: 2.78 - .913

4 goals against on 28 shots, OTL @ Colorado.
- Unholy_Goalie

I wasn't sure it was the Avs. That sucked playing vs your old team like that. They know where to score on you from practice.

Doubles and triples. Everything counts. Having a young, eager backup on a ELC is what smart teams do. We have two excellent goaltending prospects; I don't know how else to classify them, because they're putting up all-time numbers playing in a development league.

Nobody's drafting goaltenders in the first round anymore, because nobody knows what they have until they start to do things like Sparks and Pickard have done.

And once they start putting up those numbers, how could you not?

Look at Matt Murray: lit it up with the farm team for two years, just like Sparks has done. Comes up, plays a dozen games in the NHL, does really well. Year after, same thing. This year? .907.

What's his trajectory? He's won a cup, sure, but what if he puts up another mediocre season?

The point is, you have to give those guys a shot. Let Sparks start 15-20 games next year; this team is good enough in front of him that he'll likely put up decent numbers, which is all this team needs.

If he doesn't pan out? There will be goalies available, there always is.
- gravyface

Matt Murray was lightning it up at 20-22. Sparks, Pickard and McElhinney are all significantly older. He also played for the Pittsburgh Penguins.

I understand what you're saying about developing goalies and I agree but only if it's legit prospects. Sparks and Pickard are in their mid 20s and haven't shown they're very good. In the AHL, sure, they had some good numbers but in the NHL, the results have been either poor or a mixed bag.

They should be developing their own goalies but these ones just aren't very impressive and for the short term, the goal of keeping Andersen rested is more important than rolling the dice on one of two guys who are probably journeymen back-up goalies like McElhinney turned out to be anyway.

Is it better or worse than arguing about future HOFer Vermette? Let’s debate this for 3 days.
- Steven_Seagull

I think I might just go take a crunch in the toilet and then stare at it for a thousand years, I want to have more fun.

669 career games. 34 years old.

476 career games. 30 years old.

87 career games. 26 years old.

By time Lehtonen and Mason were 26 years old, they had a lot more than 87 games under their belt, a lot more wins, a lot more time in the NHL.
- Unholy_Goalie

Don't forget the Leafs new motto to over ripen their prospect in the AHL before making it to the BIGS!.

Would you say Sparks AHL career = Lehner AHL career, but at different ages..
Lehner was a starter recently. I would think that Sparks has a chance also to be a starter, granted maybe not with the Leafs.
- dmnted

Sparks just turned 25. I don't know what he's talking about with 20-21 year olds, but they ain't starters in any pro league.

What was the last bluechip goalie prospect you can remember? The list of goalies taken in the 1st round in the last 10 years is brutal. Vasilevskiy is like the only one I can think of that's solid starter.