Karlsson probably won't be the pre ankle injury player he was ever again. I think the team that pays for him will regret it.
- BetterCallSaul

The Leafs medical staff would have to give the green light, but that's a bad assumption. The team he played on was horrible last year and fraught with off-ice issues, it wasn't his health.

The Leafs medical staff would have to give the green light, but that's a bad assumption. The team he played on was horrible last year and fraught with off-ice issues, it wasn't his health.
- Unholy_Goalie

I definitely think health played a role. I'm not a medical professional, but me thinks an ankle is important to a hockey player.

Not really because Karlsson plays defense and what he brings to the team is completely different (and more necessary) than Nylander.

We're talking about a guy who has been deemed the best defenseman in the NHL (twice). You see Nylander winning an MVP any time soon? Probably not.
- Unholy_Goalie

points are points are points... 6-7mil for those points or 11mil.. seems like an easy decision to me when you know how tight we'll be to the cap.. for those 4-5million extra dollars he'd need to score many more points than Willys 60pts

I definitely think health played a role. I'm not a medical professional, but me thinks an ankle is important to a hockey player.
- BetterCallSaul

The Senators were a lottery team and their best forward was feuding with Karlsson. And he still put up 62 points in 71 games after not skating for 4 months in the off-season and missing camp.

The medical professionals worked on him and brought him back. Unless a medical professional says otherwise, he's healthy.

I definitely think health played a role. I'm not a medical professional, but me thinks an ankle is important to a hockey player.
- BetterCallSaul

If he hadn't missed 11 games last year he'd have broken 70 points again. He was on pace for 72. He had 62 in 71 games.

If he'd played the whole year, it wasn't even much of a down year points wise, just maybe plus/minus lol, but that is partly a reflection of his goalie and whole team playing like garbage. So I find it unlikely the ankle thing is really a problem anymore.

points are points are points... 6-7mil for those points or 11mil.. seems like an easy decision to me when you know how tight we'll be to the cap.. for those 4-5million extra dollars he'd need to score many more points than Willys 60pts
- Puck-us-all

No they aren't. A blueliner like Karlsson makes everyone in front of him more dangerous. It's a different angle of attack, a different problem for teams to deal with. A match-up nightmare. You think teams are deploying shutdown players to stop Karlsson? If they do, it only leaves another more dangerous player wide open, especially on the PP. There's a good reason why Ottawa went to the Conference Finals mostly on Karlsson's back and it's because teams have a very hard time stopping him.

The cap is not an issue at all. I just proved it to you before. Gardiner and Hainsey clear 7 million dollars by themselves. Marleau clears 6.25 million. Horton LTIR at 5.3 million. 6-7 million that Nylander is suppose to get. The Leafs have 30+ million dollars in cap space next year. It's not an issue at all.

If he hadn't missed 11 games last year he'd have broken 70 points again. He was on pace for 72. He had 62 in 71 games.

If he'd played the whole year, it wasn't even much of a down year points wise, just maybe plus/minus lol, but that is partly a reflection of his goalie and whole team playing like garbage. So I find it unlikely the ankle thing is really a problem anymore.
- Thecakeisalie

Every Norris winner in the past 30 years has won the Cup except Karlsson, Burns, Hedman and Subban. Burns, Hedman and Subban all went to the Cup Finals.

Every multi-time Norris winner has won the Cup. Karlsson has 2.

Whomever acquires Karlsson is going to have a damn good shot at a Cup and history backs that up.

No they aren't. A blueliner like Karlsson makes everyone in front of him more dangerous. It's a different angle of attack, a different problem for teams to deal with. A match-up nightmare. You think teams are deploying shutdown players to stop Karlsson? If they do, it only leaves another more dangerous player wide open, especially on the PP. There's a good reason why Ottawa went to the Conference Finals mostly on Karlsson's back and it's because teams have a very hard time stopping him.

The cap is not an issue at all. I just proved it to you before. Gardiner and Hainsey clear 7 million dollars by themselves. Marleau clears 6.25 million. Horton LTIR at 5.3 million. 6-7 million that Nylander is suppose to get. The Leafs have 30+ million dollars in cap space next year. It's not an issue at all.
- Unholy_Goalie

That's true, but I guess nylander doesn't make anyone else better.. also you're assuming marleaus contract will be gone, his nmc makes that harder than you think.. replacing gardiner's and haineys minutes will cost you money too.. you're hoping that money works out and still losing willys 60+ points, so it's a no deal logically ..

No they aren't. A blueliner like Karlsson makes everyone in front of him more dangerous. It's a different angle of attack, a different problem for teams to deal with. A match-up nightmare. You think teams are deploying shutdown players to stop Karlsson? If they do, it only leaves another more dangerous player wide open, especially on the PP. There's a good reason why Ottawa went to the Conference Finals mostly on Karlsson's back and it's because teams have a very hard time stopping him.

The cap is not an issue at all. I just proved it to you before. Gardiner and Hainsey clear 7 million dollars by themselves. Marleau clears 6.25 million. Horton LTIR at 5.3 million. 6-7 million that Nylander is suppose to get. The Leafs have 30+ million dollars in cap space next year. It's not an issue at all.
- Unholy_Goalie

Removing 4 cap hits, but only adding 1? Interesting strategy.

Removing 4 cap hits, but only add 1? Interesting strategy.
- Steven_Seagull

That's what ELC are for. Liljegren won't make much for 3 years. Neither would Sandin. Neither does Dermott. Neither does Johnsson or Kapanen.

If the Penguins could carry Crosby, Malkin and Letang and then add Kessel, the Leafs can afford Tavares, Matthews, Karlsson and Marner.

Removing 4 cap hits, but only add 1? Interesting strategy.
- Steven_Seagull

But it's like a really really good one that costs as much as 4

That's what ELC are for. Liljegren won't make much for 3 years. Neither would Sandin. Neither does Dermott. Neither does Johnsson or Kapanen.

If the Penguins could carry Crosby, Malkin and Letang and then add Kessel, the Leafs can afford Tavares, Matthews, Karlsson and Marner.
- Unholy_Goalie

None of which have a double digit cap hit. Leafs will have 3. Not happening.

That's true, but I guess nylander doesn't make anyone else better.. also you're assuming marleaus contract will be gone, his nmc makes that harder than you think.. replacing gardiner's and haineys minutes will cost you money too.. you're hoping that money works out and still losing willys 60+ points, so it's a no deal logically ..
- Puck-us-all

Nylander doesn't make those around him better as much as Karlsson would. Even if they were equal, 1 for 1, the fact that Karlsson does it from the blueline as a RHD makes him more dangerous and more valuable than a RW. The Leafs have offensive guys who can replace Nylander. They have nobody even remotely close to Karlsson.

Marleau gets a signing bonus so he doesn't have to play his final year to get his money. On July 2nd, 2019, he can get traded to Arizona and retire and collect 3 of the 4 million he was owed for that season.

Karlsson eats up all of Gardiner's minutes easily. Dermott can replace Hainsey. So could Liljegren in time or a cheap UFA signing.

You always get the best player you can and worry about the depth later. ELC and depth UFAs are a lot cheaper than you think.

That's what ELC are for. Liljegren won't make much for 3 years. Neither would Sandin. Neither does Dermott. Neither does Johnsson or Kapanen.

If the Penguins could carry Crosby, Malkin and Letang and then add Kessel, the Leafs can afford Tavares, Matthews, Karlsson and Marner.
- Unholy_Goalie

What!? Lol
Crosby is at like 8mil?
Malkin at 7-8 Jessel at 7mil?
Maty 11
Taveres 11
Karlsson 11
Marner 7

There's a difference

None of which have a double digit cap hit. Leafs will have 3. Not happening.
- Steven_Seagull

The cap was 10 million dollars lower (if not more) before so their cap hits, at that time, were like the Leafs having three 10 million dollar cap hits today.

Nylander doesn't make those around him better as much as Karlsson would. Even if they were equal, 1 for 1, the fact that Karlsson does it from the blueline as a RHD makes him more dangerous and more valuable than a RW. The Leafs have offensive guys who can replace Nylander. They have nobody even remotely close to Karlsson.

Marleau gets a signing bonus so he doesn't have to play his final year to get his money. On July 2nd, 2019, he can get traded to Arizona and retire and collect 3 of the 4 million he was owed for that season.

Karlsson eats up all of Gardiner's minutes easily. Dermott can replace Hainsey. So could Liljegren in time or a cheap UFA signing.

You always get the best player you can and worry about the depth later. ELC and depth UFAs are a lot cheaper than you think.
- Unholy_Goalie

Marleau such a great pro.. standup guy just (frank)ing of cause you say so haha didn't he say he wants to keep playing? Why the (frank) would he waive for Arizona?

What!? Lol
Crosby is at like 8mil?
Malkin at 7-8 Jessel at 7mil?
Maty 11
Taveres 11
Karlsson 11
Marner 7

There's a difference
- Puck-us-all

Malkin 9.5, Crosby 8.7, Kessel 6.8, Letang 7.25

In 2014/2015, the salary cap was 69 million. Before that it was even lower. It's not that far off.

Marleau such a great pro.. standup guy just (frank)ing of cause you say so haha didn't he say he wants to keep playing? Why the (frank) would he waive for Arizona?
- Puck-us-all

Because he'd get his signing bonus and retire and Arizona would eat his cap hit, like they just did with Hossa. And Bolland. And Pronger. And Datsyuk. And every other dead contract out there.

Because he'd get his signing bonus and retire and Arizona would eat his cap hit, like they just did with Hossa. And Bolland. And Pronger. And Datsyuk. And every other dead contract out there.
- Unholy_Goalie

Oh I see so you're assuming he retires cause that'd work better for us.. I get ya

Karlsson probably won't be the pre ankle injury player he was ever again. I think the team that pays for him will regret it.
- BetterCallSaul

Agreed. Not only will he never be what he was but he also, still, can't play defense. Which is what the Leafs need, first and foremost, from a defenseman.

The sooner Karlsson gets traded to some other team, or inexplicably, re-signs with Ottawa, the better. That way the ridiculous talk of the Leafs trading way too (frank)ing much for him will stop.

Agreed. Not only will he never be what he was but he also, still, can't play defense. Which is what the Leafs need, first and foremost, from a defenseman.

The sooner Karlsson gets traded to some other team, or inexplicably, re-signs with Ottawa, the better. That way the ridiculous talk of the Leafs trading way too (frank)ing much for him will stop.
- GreatGigInTheSky

Preach🙌👏🙌

Oh I see so you're assuming he retires cause that'd work better for us.. I get ya
- Puck-us-all

Even if he didn't, the Leafs would still have 31.5 million (plus 5.3 million in LTIR) to sign Matthews, Marner and Karlsson. That's 36.8 million total. And it's assuming the cap stays exactly the same which it never does. Even if it goes up only 1 million per year, they'd be perfectly fine. Hyman and Brown can both be traded and replaced with ELC players. That's another 4.5 million cleared. Zaitsev can be traded, another 4.5 million cleared and replaced with an ELC if absolutely necessary (which it wouldn't be).

Agreed. Not only will he never be what he was but he also, still, can't play defense. Which is what the Leafs need, first and foremost, from a defenseman.

The sooner Karlsson gets traded to some other team, or inexplicably, re-signs with Ottawa, the better. That way the ridiculous talk of the Leafs trading way too (frank)ing much for him will stop.
- GreatGigInTheSky

Tavares was on the ice for 114 goals against last year (worst total by a center in the past 10 years) but was a spectacular signing. But Karlsson "can't play defense" even though he's routinely on the ice for more goals for than against but stay away from him.

Even if he didn't, the Leafs would still have 31.5 million (plus 5.3 million in LTIR) to sign Matthews, Marner and Karlsson. That's 36.8 million total. And it's assuming the cap stays exactly the same which it never does. Even if it goes up only 1 million per year, they'd be perfectly fine. Hyman and Brown can both be traded and replaced with ELC players. That's another 4.5 million cleared. Zaitsev can be traded, another 4.5 million cleared and replaced with an ELC if absolutely necessary (which it wouldn't be).
- Unholy_Goalie

What if they trade for him, lock him up for his 8yrs at 11mil and he's still garbage at defending? You know like how Gards is but with him it's only for 1 more cheap year

Oh I see so you're assuming he retires cause that'd work better for us.. I get ya
- Puck-us-all

To be fair to UG, when Marleau was first signed, everyone defending the deal were talking about this exact scenario. How we could easily move his contract in the last year if necessary. UG was actually against the signing and people kept pushing the narrative that Marleau could easily be traded in year three.

Now he is using the scenario all of Marleau's supporters kept mentioning and the people arguing with him are saying it's not believable. It's a bit ironic actually.