Ok so the Hawks weren't aware of the soon to be recapture penalties - my mistake. How many years passed by after signing? The Hawks knew of the 'new' recapture penalties so ride the pony while it's hot & dump it when it's not. I don't blame them, but it still doesn't make it right.
- Aussiepenguin

The recapture penalty came out 4 years after the contract was signed during the new CBA in 2013. Dude get a clue, it completely makes it right. The contract were approved by the league. They were LEGAL. It was only after the fact (and mainly the Kovachuk deal) that the league decided enough is enough. THEN they put in the recapture penalty which is complete BS but whatever.

Well Max is looking for about $7M x 8 from whoever the acquiring team is and Bergevin has let it slip that they don't intend to offer him an extension. So what position are the Habs in to demand a big return? I'd say not very good.

I doubt the Hawks would sign on for big money long term for Max. Straight up they might offer up Anisimov plus one of their 17 signed defenceman. Otherwise I think it would have to be a multi player deal.
- RickJ

If AA is part of the deal for Patches then it's a win win no? You get a leader and someone to fill the net during the now, and then you can choose to let him walk next year and have all that money off the books from AA and Patches. Same goes with Stralman which is another expiring contract. If the Hawks don't have to mortgage the future for these two guys, they both can make this upcoming season at least interesting, and let them walk if they choose. A long with Kunitz and Cam Ward at the end of the season. The organization would have options/flexibility beyond this year, and potentially a lot of cap space.
- SoftServe

This is kinda my hope.

Trade AA, Rutta (maybe +) for Patches

Try and get Stralman on the cheap to help Tampa get Karlsson (helps them from having to overpay OTT to take Callahan back; also puts them in cap hell going forward unless the cap goes WAY up in a few years)

Then we have two veteran players to make a run for a Playoff spot this year that IF it goes south the Hawks actually have pieces to sell off at the Deadline OR if it goes decently (I.E. 6th, 7th, 8th Playoff spot 1st or 2nd Rd exit) you let them walk and gain that cap space to use going forward when there are some big names out there that could be difference makes with the team going forward.

To confirm, if Sidney Crosby went down with one concussion too many in 2022, when his cap hit remains $8.7m/year, but his actual salary is only $3m/year for the next three seasons, you would be opposed to the Penguins trading him to a floor team in order to gain cap relief. Your opinion would be that this is the bed that the team has made and now they have to lay in it. Is that correct?

For reference, I am not saying that I agree with these types of moves, and I understand the frustration another team might have.
- tgentry1084

The problem is that teams l8ke Arizona and others never spend to the cap and often need help just getting to the floor.

Any team that continually refuses - or continually can’t afford - to spend what is required in today’s league should be relegated, dissolved, moved, or taken away from the ownership that continues to fail to spend enough put a representative team on the ice. They take an equal share of national league revenues, they are recipients of revenue sharing money’s, and they don’t invest in on-ice talent.

If AA is part of the deal for Patches then it's a win win no? You get a leader and someone to fill the net during the now, and then you can choose to let him walk next year and have all that money off the books from AA and Patches. Same goes with Stralman which is another expiring contract. If the Hawks don't have to mortgage the future for these two guys, they both can make this upcoming season at least interesting, and let them walk if they choose. A long with Kunitz and Cam Ward at the end of the season. The organization would have options/flexibility beyond this year, and potentially a lot of cap space.
- SoftServe

Sorry where is the win here for the Habs? Anisimov helps them in the sense he is better than some of their current NHL level C crop. But the Habs have signaled they aren't building for today so Anisimov doesn't help long term and frankly one for one isn't close to good value for Patches. Again not saying Bergevin wouldn't do it because I've seen a lot of poor asset valuation in one for one deals...just saying it makes no sense

Ah yes, Anisimov. Forgive me, my mind drifted away from his name. But younger guys, unless they are not deemed as long term winning solutions, then I pass. That is a dangerous game.
- 333inthe3rd

Yes.
Hopefully this is the last time for a long time that we are on the giving end in deals involving picks and young prospects. Bowman needs to be patient and take advantage of other teams now.

Stralman 1 year left at $4.5 mil would be nice if we did not have to give up too much for a rental. If the Hawks season goes well he would be a good addition. If it goes poorly he might be flipped for a pretty high pick at the TDL. He does have a modified NTC.

Side note - People complain about Stan handing out NMC/NTC. Stevie Y has 10 players with them.

Pacioretty 1 year left at $4.5 mil would be ok if we did not have to get him for AA and pick. If the Hawks season goes well he would be a good addition. If it goes poorly he might be flipped for a pick at the TDL.

I would not mind Hamhuis for 1 year at reasonable price.

If the move AA for a pick I would not mind Vermette, Letestu, or Dominic Moore for 1 year at a reasonable price.

Saad - Toews - Debrincat
Pacioretty - Schmaltz - Kane
Bottom 6 would have Vermette, Kunitz, Kruger, Hayden and then see who wins the last 2 spots in training camp battles.

LD - Keith, Hamhuis, Forsling, Gus
RD - Stralman, Seabs, Rutta, Murphy
Maybe you move one of the defenders (not Keith) in the Pacioretty or Stralman deals.

Crow
Ward

You are not rushing the kids. Rockford would be good. Colliton would help them develop. Next year you would have $22 mil in cap space.

The recapture penalty came out 4 years after the contract was signed during the new CBA in 2013. Dude get a clue, it completely makes it right. The contract were approved by the league. They were LEGAL. It was only after the fact (and mainly the Kovachuk deal) that the league decided enough is enough. THEN they put in the recapture penalty which is complete BS but whatever.
- tyweb69

The “league” didn’t decide - it was collectively bargained and agreed to by the league (with Rocky’s concurrence, as he agreed to the new CBA) and the PA.

Shrewd Stevie Y signings

Callahan...6yrs 35mil and NMC, modified NTC

His last 3yrs..158gms, 17g and 33 assists

Ryan McDonough's contract starts after next season, when he will be 30

7yrs 47.25mil...or 6.75per and NTC. Same as Seabrook (who has won a few things).

Yet Stevie Y is "shrewd" while Stan is an idiot.
- PatShart

I agree with you on this. I think the bigger issue, though, is that we can't really point to many (any?) bargains that Stan Bowman has signed (Keith is one, Crawford is probably another). That may be to what other posters refer.

Steve Yzerman may be called shrewd for the deals that look good; Stan Bowman may be called an idiot for the few (none?) that do. Right?

Agree, as of today. It would have to start with Boqvist being the next Karlsson, Joki the next Seabs, Beaudin a top 4, Schmaltz develop into a legit 1 or 2 C and Dcat a 75 point guy. Then hit with guys like Wise, Gilbert, Carlsson, Sikura types.

Not unreasonable as it was before the draft.
- Mr Ricochet

Mr. Ricochet,
I see you're in Joliet as well. Would love to share an adult beverage and pick your hockey mind during a game. Maybe next season sometime.

Thanks for all your great insight here.

The Habs are in a similar glut situation with too many d and Anisimov wouldn't make sense in any way for the Habs. In no way does that mean I can't see Bergevin doing it...just saying both Anisimov and NHL level 5/6 d make no sense for the Habs
- Takemedrunkimhome

Clearly Bergevin has the For Sale sign out on Pacioretty and he will get him moved eventually. But a big return is limited by the one year left on his current deal and his asking price on an extension. Hawks probably can't make Bergy happy with what they have to offer.

The problem is that teams l8ke Arizona and others never spend to the cap and often need help just getting to the floor.

Any team that continually refuses - or continually can’t afford - to spend what is required in today’s league should be relegated, dissolved, moved, or taken away from the ownership that continues to fail to spend enough put a representative team on the ice. They take an equal share of national league revenues, they are recipients of revenue sharing money’s, and they don’t invest in on-ice talent.
- StLBravesFan

I'm with you on this. There are a lot of problems with Bettman's NHL.

Carolina-can go pound sand. They are desperately trying to get rid of Skinner and Faulk...and want guys like Schmaltz and Saad from the Hawks? Get lost

Forget the deal with Montreal. Unless Pacioretty can be had for a bargain hard pass.

Hawks need to be looking at solid D-men. The only rumor I like is the one involving Tampa Bay....lets cash in on another team's cap hell instead of trading talented young players for another team's unwanted resources.

Curiously...if it was Patches the Hawks are after as I've read from a few places including JJ:

What do Hawks fans think would make sense as a package?

I doubt Schmaltz ends up in MTL although I'd have said the same about Danault for the deadline scraps a few years ago so who knows. I've heard Jokiharju and a pick but again don't know. Would love a level headed Hawks based opinion - because as fans we are all level headed
- Takemedrunkimhome

Nothing. Hawks are in an unspoken rebuild and Pacioretty at 29 is a 1 yr rental unless a team is willing to extend him for 5-6-7 yrs at 7 mil or so. That nowhere near fits where the Hawks are now giving up young assets/picks for a 1 yr rental.

Where there might be a fit is if the Canadiens want a 2/3 C in Anisimov but doubt that includes Pacioretty.

Clearly Bergevin has the For Sale sign out on Pacioretty and he will get him moved eventually. But a big return is limited by the one year left on his current deal and his asking price on an extension. Hawks probably can't make Bergy happy with what they have to offer.
- RickJ

I kinda agree with this...not sure they make the best partners for a balanced trade - but when has that stopped Bergy before?

That said I see Patches a lot different than Karlsson in that I don't think his rental value is that far off his resigned value. Assuming his shooting percentage regresses to his career avg his goals will be back and at deadline a 1st plus a quality prospect seems like a relatively standard payout - extended I don't see the value being that different other than NHL readiness of the prospect

Carolina-can go pound sand. They are desperately trying to get rid of Skinner and Faulk...and want guys like Schmaltz and Saad from the Hawks? Get lost

Forget the deal with Montreal. Unless Pacioretty can be had for a bargain hard pass.

Hawks need to be looking at solid D-men. The only rumor I like is the one involving Tampa Bay....lets cash in on another team's cap hell instead of trading talented young players for another team's unwanted resources.
- kwolf68

Another team to watch is Winnipeg. They are on the road to salary cap issues too. My bet is Tyler Myers is available at quite a reasonable price and maybe a center Bryan Little.

The recapture penalty came out 4 years after the contract was signed during the new CBA in 2013. Dude get a clue, it completely makes it right. The contract were approved by the league. They were LEGAL. It was only after the fact (and mainly the Kovachuk deal) that the league decided enough is enough. THEN they put in the recapture penalty which is complete BS but whatever.
- tyweb69

It is hard to make sense with some of these fans. If the Pens had signed Hossa to the same deal, the same guy would be offering a completely reversed argument.

Like if we had offered Hino and Osterle in trade proposals to other teams in trade proposals a week ago, we would have been scoffed at. Yet reading some blogs yesterday, Arizona seemingly stole 2 stars from us.

Marian Hossa was signed in 2009. The new CBA with the cap recapture penalties went into effect in 2012. In his last season he scored 26 goals and 45 points, so it's not like his career was fizzling out either. I'm sure most Hawk fans (and management) would prefer a healthy Hossa over the extra 5M in cap space without question.
- Lash8

100% this. I'd rather have Hossa at 40 years old on the 3rd line at $5M than seeing what $5M got teams on July 1st this year.

Nothing. Hawks are in an unspoken rebuild and Pacioretty at 29 is a 1 yr rental unless a team is willing to extend him for 5-6-7 yrs at 7 mil or so. That nowhere near fits where the Hawks are now giving up young assets/picks for a 1 yr rental.

Where there might be a fit is if the Canadiens want a 2/3 C in Anisimov but doubt that includes Pacioretty.
- Mr Ricochet

The Habs don't want a 3 C (AA isn't a legit 2C) who is 30 years old with a career high of 45 points. If you think the Blackhawks are in an unspoken rebuild...the Habs are in a pretty well broadcasted rebuild under the guise of trying to make the playoffs

The idea that the Hawks can go into next years UFA with 20+ mil available could be interesting looking at some of the names possibly available

Carolina-can go pound sand. They are desperately trying to get rid of Skinner and Faulk...and want guys like Schmaltz and Saad from the Hawks? Get lost

Forget the deal with Montreal. Unless Pacioretty can be had for a bargain hard pass.

Hawks need to be looking at solid D-men. The only rumor I like is the one involving Tampa Bay....lets cash in on another team's cap hell instead of trading talented young players for another team's unwanted resources.
- kwolf68

I agree, Max would be a great add 3 years ago, would love his 30 goals on this team but he'll be on the wrong side of 30 soon. I imagine the great Y is going to struggle making the trade for Karlsson, he doesn't want to give up anything of value, ever.

Why in the world would the Hawks (or anyone) acquire Ryan Callahan - a 33-year old 3rd line winger making $5.8M for 2 more years who scored all of 18 points in 67 games last season. Puh-leeze.

Schmaltz (and DeBrincat) should be untouchables unless the trade is too good to be true (meaning equal or better player with long term contract or RFA). No way those two should be traded for a Pacioretty or Skinner. Sikura - fine because he hasn't proven himself yet, but I wouldn't even trade Sikura for a player with only 1 or 2 years on their contract before they hit UFA.

The point is - do we really think the Hawks are a legitimate Cup contender if they add a Stralman and Skinner/Pacioretty? I don't. Maybe they eek into the playoffs if a lot of things go right but they are not one of the best teams anymore. They should be aiming for 2019/20 season, if not the 2020/21 season.
- EbonyRaptor

Neither do I and most importantly so far it seems like the Hawks don't think so either. ..... My hope is the realize this and stay patient adding youth/picks as they go while not adding age with term.

I kinda agree with this...not sure they make the best partners for a balanced trade - but when has that stopped Bergy before?

That said I see Patches a lot different than Karlsson in that I don't think his rental value is that far off his resigned value. Assuming his shooting percentage regresses to his career avg his goals will be back and at deadline a 1st plus a quality prospect seems like a relatively standard payout - extended I don't see the value being that different other than NHL readiness of the prospect
- Takemedrunkimhome

The comparable out there on an extension for Pacioretty is JVR's new deal with Philly - 5 years @ $7M. But he cost Philly nothing other than cash. Bergy is looking for an equivalent (or close) return in talent for Max and then let the acquiring team deal with the extension numbers. That's a little different.

100% this. I'd rather have Hossa at 40 years old on the 3rd line at $5M than seeing what $5M got teams on July 1st this year.
- Hawksfan37

Definitely. The narrative that the Hawks ditched him as soon as he declined is BS because he hasn't declined that much. His cap hit would still a great value if he were healthy.

Another team to watch is Winnipeg. They are on the road to salary cap issues too. My bet is Tyler Myers is available at quite a reasonable price and maybe a center Bryan Little.
- RickJ

I'd love both those guys. Hawks would be loaded at Center if they got Little, though I suspect they'd move AA if that were to happen.

This is kinda my hope.

Trade AA, Rutta (maybe +) for Patches

Try and get Stralman on the cheap to help Tampa get Karlsson (helps them from having to overpay OTT to take Callahan back; also puts them in cap hell going forward unless the cap goes WAY up in a few years)

Then we have two veteran players to make a run for a Playoff spot this year that IF it goes south the Hawks actually have pieces to sell off at the Deadline OR if it goes decently (I.E. 6th, 7th, 8th Playoff spot 1st or 2nd Rd exit) you let them walk and gain that cap space to use going forward when there are some big names out there that could be difference makes with the team going forward.
- Savetheembers33

That’s a terrible trade for MTL.