I think that Marner will have more points that Kessel next year. The reason I used 70 points was to show that Kessel's numbers (like Giroux's last year) were likely an abberation, not the norm.

Let me ask this: you can have either Marner or Kessel right now at the same cap hit. Who do you take?

If you don't say Marner, that's just blind homerism.
- jmatchett383

It depends on the length of the deal. If it was 8 more years then of course it would be Marner but if it was only a couple I would stick with Phil.

No they won't. Crosby 8.7M, Malkin 9.5M. Expect Matthews to want above 10M and Marner close to it. Tavares is 10M+.

Expect 5-6M for Guentzel.

It depends on the length of the deal. If it was 8 more years then of course it would be Marner but if it was only a couple I would stick with Phil.
- Mino42

I think if you took a poll of the 29 teams besides Toronto and Pittsburgh, you'd find you're in the minority.

Kessel is a very good player, but his numbers are likely to take a hit. I think 80 points is realistic for him this year. Marner, with Toronto adding Tavares to their team, is only going to make Marner's numbers go up, I think he's a lock for at least 70, pushing 80.

AND Tampa is going to have to gut their team to afford Karlson and Kucherov extensions.

No they won't. Crosby 8.7M, Malkin 9.5M. Expect Matthews to want above 10M and Marner close to it. Tavares is 10M+.

Expect 5-6M for Guentzel.
- Barnaby36

I think Guentzel will use Pastrnak as a comparable. If you can get him locked up for under $8M, you do it, he's the future.

AND Tampa is going to have to gut their team to afford Karlson and Kucherov extensions.
- dcoms77

Especially if they lose Sergachev in the trade. They'll cut Coburn, Stralman, and Girardi loose and either trade or buy out Callahan, but they'll also probably lose one of Johnson, Palat, or Killorn. That McDonagh trade is gonna kill them.

Buy they have Point and Raddysh to make up for the top-6 scoring they'll lose.

But Phil Kessel has a Dad bod and makes it work! Marner not at that level yet!

I think if you took a poll of the 29 teams besides Toronto and Pittsburgh, you'd find you're in the minority.

Kessel is a very good player, but his numbers are likely to take a hit. I think 80 points is realistic for him this year. Marner, with Toronto adding Tavares to their team, is only going to make Marner's numbers go up, I think he's a lock for at least 70, pushing 80.
- jmatchett383

I agree with you that Kessel is very unlikely to hit 90 again this year but besides last year (he was playing when he shouldn't have been) Phil has been money in the playoffs. I understand how life works and that your skills go away as you age but Phil has a proven track record in the playoffs and Marner doesn't. I don't think I'm crazy in saying I would take two more years of Kessel over Marner but beyond that I would gladly switch. I just don't think we need to crown the Leafs just yet that and was my point when I started this.

Kadri > Brassard
Kessel = Marner
Nylander > Jake

Leafs Cap space > Pens Cap Space

Otherwise agr33d

The amount of stupid in this single post makes me wonder if you are James Tanner under fake account... Kessel = Marner.... ???? LOL. On what planet do you live James?

I agree with you that Kessel is very unlikely to hit 90 again this year but besides last year (he was playing when he shouldn't have been) Phil has been money in the playoffs. I understand how life works and that your skills go away as you age but Phil has a proven track record in the playoffs and Marner doesn't. I don't think I'm crazy in saying I would take two more years of Kessel over Marner but beyond that I would gladly switch. I just don't think we need to crown the Leafs just yet and was my point when I started this.
- Mino42

Oh, by no means are the Leafs a lock to win the Cup. And sure, they'll have some hard decisions to make with all of their extensions. But doing a 1-for-1 comparison arbitrarily of certain players isn't a great way to prove it.

If I'm a betting man, I still would pick TB to come out of the East this year, with or without EK. But I think Toronto finally makes some noise this year, while I think the Pens will tread water.

Edit: If healthy, I still think the Pens go to the ECF.

Kadri > Brassard
Kessel = Marner
Nylander > Jake

Leafs Cap space > Pens Cap Space

Otherwise agr33d
- Cape Breton Bruins

Agreed for sure. Kadri > Brass

Oh, by no means are the Leafs a lock to win the Cup. And sure, they'll have some hard decisions to make with all of their extensions. But doing a 1-for-1 comparison arbitrarily of certain players isn't a great way to prove it.

If I'm a betting man, I still would pick TB to come out of the East this year, with or without EK. But I think Toronto finally makes some noise this year, while I think the Pens will tread water.

Edit: If healthy, I still think the Pens go to the ECF.
- jmatchett383

Sounds like anti Pittsburgh Homerism to me. I believe if Pens survived Caps last year they would have won Cup. They didnt. Tampa doesnt scare me because we have played well against them over the years. That said, if EK goes to Tampa, you are looking at a Golden State style super team. I would not like Pens chances against TB then

I agree with you that Kessel is very unlikely to hit 90 again this year but besides last year (he was playing when he shouldn't have been) Phil has been money in the playoffs. I understand how life works and that your skills go away as you age but Phil has a proven track record in the playoffs and Marner doesn't. I don't think I'm crazy in saying I would take two more years of Kessel over Marner but beyond that I would gladly switch. I just don't think we need to crown the Leafs just yet that and was my point when I started this.
- Mino42

What’s the ratio of Phil’s “money” goals that are snipes in the playoffs vs tap ins gifted to him by Hagelin, Bonini, Sid, and Geno? A good chunk of his goals are absolute snipes, but another good chunk are backdoor beauties. The proof is in the Pens playoff goal highlights on YouTube

Oh, by no means are the Leafs a lock to win the Cup. And sure, they'll have some hard decisions to make with all of their extensions. But doing a 1-for-1 comparison arbitrarily of certain players isn't a great way to prove it.

If I'm a betting man, I still would pick TB to come out of the East this year, with or without EK. But I think Toronto finally makes some noise this year, while I think the Pens will tread water.
- jmatchett383

I mostly agree with you. TBL is going to be tough and if they get EK look out. Everyone this time last year was down on the Caps and we saw how worked out. The Leafs need to fix that D if they want to make it outta the first round. I see it being another tough year to come outta the east.

Sounds like anti Pittsburgh Homerism to me. I believe if Pens survived Caps last year they would have won Cup. They didnt. Tampa doesnt scare me because we have played well against them over the years. That said, if EK goes to Tampa, you are looking at a Golden State style super team. I would not like Pens chances against TB then
- Amanion

So the fact that I rooted for Pittsburgh to win the Cup the past 3 years (sans the first round last year) makes me anti-Pittsburgh? I guess I'm not a real Steelers fan either when I wave my Terrible Towel around every Sunday too.

But nice try.

I mostly agree with you. TBL is going to be tough and if they get EK look out. Everyone this time last year was down on the Caps and we saw how worked out. The Leafs need to fix that D if they want to make it outta the first round. I see it being another tough year to come outta the east.
- Mino42

Hey, if the Penguins could win a Cup playing Ron Hainsey on their top pair, I don't see what's stopping the Leafs from doing something similar.

So the fact that I rooted for Pittsburgh to win the Cup the past 3 years (sans the first round last year) makes me anti-Pittsburgh? I guess I'm not a real Steelers fan either when I wave my Terrible Towel around every Sunday too.

But nice try.
- jmatchett383

He didn't mean it...

Only RW would get a hard on over signing Ennis. Anyone under 5’9 and can skate RW drools over and bashes any bigger player. Napoleon complex at its finest

Hey, if the Penguins could win a Cup playing Ron Hainsey on their top pair, I don't see what's stopping the Leafs from doing something similar.
- jmatchett383

Yeah but the Pens didn't have 5 Ron Hainsey's and a Morgan Reilly. Even without Letang they had guys that could step up into the play and move the puck.

He didn't mean it...
- Mino42

I hope not. I don't hide the fact that I'm a Flyers fan. But growing up, I always liked the Penguins (prior to Crosby, the hate didn't go both ways, sorry guys), too. Then when I got married, my wife's family is from Pittsburgh, so I watched them even more.

I'm not the biggest fan of Malkin, I never liked Kunitz, and I think Letang is a Richard, but I never had a problem rooting for them as a team unless they play the Flyers.

Yeah but the Pens didn't have 5 Ron Hainsey's and a Morgan Reilly. Even without Letang they had guys that could step up into the play and move the puck.
- Mino42

I think Toronto's D can move the puck. Stopping the other team from moving the puck will be their issue.

I think Guentzel will use Pastrnak as a comparable. If you can get him locked up for under $8M, you do it, he's the future.
- jmatchett383

God I hope so. Especially since Pastrnak is better

God I hope so. Especially since Pastrnak is better
- Nucker101

Guentzel has a high PPG average over his first 2 seasons than Pastrnak had, and has been money in the playoffs.

I think Toronto's D can move the puck. Stopping the other team from moving the puck will be their issue.
- jmatchett383

Well they did have Roman Polak so I stand by my statement.

Well they did have Roman Polak so I stand by my statement.

- Mino42

I agree.