I would include Q in my explosion of the core... This is the 3rd season since the last cup win and they look to be getting more and more distant from competing for the next cup. Rather than continuing this mediocrity, I'd rather suffer through some terrible seasons & reload through the draft. Get rid of everyone and load up on draft picks via those trades and some bad records. I'd rather see a young team gel then be hopeful that something miraculous happens and our core generates more magic.
- isu83boo

Pretty sure half the league would love to have the talent that the hawks have, so there is no need to blow up the core at this point (enjoy watching the Bulls this year to further my point)
The special teams have been a nightmare for quite some time although 2 PP goals in garbage time after the game was lost.
Either Q isn't planning for the next opponent, or execution of game plan isn't happening. Either way it falls on mgmt. to assemble a winning team, coaches to players. It's early but it sure looks to me like the potential of this team is not being realized game in and game out, yet the talent is there or mostly there.
Bozo's on the bus? Mr. Ahhh Clem, Mr. Ahhh Clem!

so which is the aberration: the first 2 games or the games vs wild and blues...

CC was sporting a .960 save% and 1.25 GA and seeing 35 sog's per game....

sorry that can't be sustained..last night was a correction game...sadly his mates got assists on 3 of those goals...
- bogiedoc

This combined with the numerous comments on coaching and having the team ready makes me wonder if there isn't already some conflict brewing amongst the coaching staff.

Those first two games were against good teams, and not buying the back to back games excuse. Just from memory without going back and rewatching the games, I'd say there were two distinctly different styles of play. The first two games we were challenging plays at center ice, last couple games we are back to backing in at the blue line.

The first two games we were focusing on quick chips out of our zone and turning up ice. Now we seem to have slid back to stupid up the middle and cross ice passes.

Is this the players reverting back or battling coaching philosophy at work?

Okay... so I'm fully committed to being a proud new member of the Doom and Gloom crowd. Any tips from some of the long time Doom and Gloomers on how to construct a solid pessimistic point of view statement? I'm fairly new at this...

Yet nobody can offer any real evidence that Toews has somehow declined.

Here is some information from the small sample size of this season. Most important factors are in line with expectation as far as Toews is concerned. That is saying something considering Saad+Panik is at the level of Saad + Hossa in terms of two way play and elite skill. Not saying Panik isn't doing his job, but he isn't a future hall of famer.

1) His line is putting a ton of pressure on the opposition when they are on the ice and that is with all 3 forwards taking their turns attacking. This is clearly visible when you watch him play.

2) His point production is normal for him

3) His possession relative to his teammates is right on par.

4) His line has only given up 2 goals at even strength

5) In terms of dangerous scoring chances, his line is generating them at a pace that would be a career high, in terms of chances per game and his ratio of high danger chances for to against is at a level similar to his best seasons.

6) He is on pace to take his lowest amount of offensive zone draws 5v5 and a career high in defensive zone draws. (This is a trend for the whole team)

Toews is Toews, but the team in general is not effective. It is clear as day when you watch the game and really only 4 or 5 guys are being effective all game.
- breadbag

>I get it -- you will come to Jonny's defense no matter what
>Toews passing this year is dreadful, his line is being driven by the endless motor of Saad, and the super-human strength of Panik
>Is Toews as captain, responsible or partly responsible for "the room"?
>Hawks have played a full 60 minute game a handful of times in the past 2 years
>Hawks have trouble starting games, what is Toews role in this?
>Toews on the PP -- other than the occasional draw win -- what is he doing that makes the PP better?
>Toews still does not pass the "eye test" -- he is on the wrong side of the puck more than any time in his career
>The Hawks desperately need JT to be an impact player - -the kind of impact that a fan attending their first game says, "Who is #19, that guy just dominates when he's on the ice'?

I would include Q in my explosion of the core... This is the 3rd season since the last cup win and they look to be getting more and more distant from competing for the next cup. Rather than continuing this mediocrity, I'd rather suffer through some terrible seasons & reload through the draft. Get rid of everyone and load up on draft picks via those trades and some bad records. I'd rather see a young team gel then be hopeful that something miraculous happens and our core generates more magic.
- isu83boo

Agreed 100%

Its time to blow it up, including the head coach

You Hawks fans are hilarious. 2 wins in a row and you're going to the win the Cup this year. One bad game against a solid opponent and you all b*tch and moan about how horrible the coach is, how bad your defense is, etc etc. The Hawks are still a damn good team, it will just take a little bit of time for the new faces to gel. Now if it was 30-40 games into the season and the same issues are still a problem then yeah, time for concern. I have no doubt Hawks will be right there again come playoff time.

JJ: The Alex Debrincat Hattrick bit is really funny. I wish there was more blog writing like this on the site.

>I get it -- you will come to Jonny's defense no matter what
>Toews passing this year is dreadful, his line is being driven by the endless motor of Saad, and the super-human strength of Panik
>Is Toews as captain, responsible or partly responsible for "the room"?
>Hawks have played a full 60 minute game a handful of times in the past 2 years
>Hawks have trouble starting games, what is Toews role in this?
>Toews on the PP -- other than the occasional draw win -- what is he doing that makes the PP better?
>Toews still does not pass the "eye test" -- he is on the wrong side of the puck more than any time in his career
>The Hawks desperately need JT to be an impact player - -the kind of impact that a fan attending their first game says, "Who is #19, that guy just dominates when he's on the ice'?
- SnapitUpstairs

Again, sad but true. There is no denying that Toews is no longer who he once was. Anyone still disputing this is lying to themselves.

>I get it -- you will come to Jonny's defense no matter what
>Toews passing this year is dreadful, his line is being driven by the endless motor of Saad, and the super-human strength of Panik
>Is Toews as captain, responsible or partly responsible for "the room"?
>Hawks have played a full 60 minute game a handful of times in the past 2 years
>Hawks have trouble starting games, what is Toews role in this?
>Toews on the PP -- other than the occasional draw win -- what is he doing that makes the PP better?
>Toews still does not pass the "eye test" -- he is on the wrong side of the puck more than any time in his career
>The Hawks desperately need JT to be an impact player - -the kind of impact that a fan attending their first game says, "Who is #19, that guy just dominates when he's on the ice'?
- SnapitUpstairs

Well said. I'd add does he look dangerous with the puck on his stick? No. I've also never seen him get knocked down so much or lose so many puck battles.

You Hawks fans are hilarious. 2 wins in a row and you're going to the win the Cup this year. One bad game against a solid opponent and you all b*tch and moan about how horrible the coach is, how bad your defense is, etc etc. The Hawks are still a damn good team, it will just take a little bit of time for the new faces to gel. Now if it was 30-40 games into the season and the same issues are still a problem then yeah, time for concern. I have no doubt Hawks will be right there again come playoff time.
- hockeydood

It's not just last nights game.

ALL of these things have been trending over the past 2 years:

Dcore getting worse, specifically Keith and Seabrook declining

Center depth and face off ability getting worse, specifically Toews declining

Q's coaching getting worse and worse, team no longer executes the system they used to

Special teams getting worse and worse

Puck possession and advanced metrics getting worse and worse....and WORSE

These things have all been steadily creeping up on this Hawks team, and if you look at the way they've played this season excluding the first 2 games where they were lucky to catch the Penguins and Blue Jackets on back-to-backs on the road, they've been utterly dominated and all those things I mentioned above are the key reasons why.

Nothing is going to get better, no amount of time "to gel" is going to fix this team. The core is burnt out. The head coach is burnt out. The supporting cast/youth movement isn't anything special.

The Hawks are definitely no longer "a damn good team". We MIGHT make the playoffs, but if we do we'll be out in the 1st round....again...

>I get it -- you will come to Jonny's defense no matter what
>Toews passing this year is dreadful, his line is being driven by the endless motor of Saad, and the super-human strength of Panik
>Is Toews as captain, responsible or partly responsible for "the room"?
>Hawks have played a full 60 minute game a handful of times in the past 2 years
>Hawks have trouble starting games, what is Toews role in this?
>Toews on the PP -- other than the occasional draw win -- what is he doing that makes the PP better?
>Toews still does not pass the "eye test" -- he is on the wrong side of the puck more than any time in his career
>The Hawks desperately need JT to be an impact player - -the kind of impact that a fan attending their first game says, "Who is #19, that guy just dominates when he's on the ice'?
- SnapitUpstairs

The Hawks' first goal, game 6 finals vs Boston, that's the Toews you're talking about: explosive, dynamic, pure finish

Stan should call up Sakic right now and and say, Q for Landeskog or Duchene

Again, sad but true. There is no denying that Toews is no longer who he once was. Anyone still disputing this is lying to themselves.
- SimpleJack

>Yes
>Am hoping JT can get back to top form

Well said. I'd add does he look dangerous with the puck on his stick? No. I've also never seen him get knocked down so much or lose so many puck battles.
- bhawks2241

>Yes
>And lose a ton of 10 foot races
>Still hoping for a "turnaround"

The Hawks' first goal, game 6 finals vs Boston, that's the Toews you're talking about: explosive, dynamic, pure finish
- Hawkjet

Yup. Last seen game 6 of the 2015 SCF(he was especially amazing in the 2015 WCF against the Ducks). 2+ seasons of decline later its silly that some people think he's ever going to be the same.

The Hawks' first goal, game 6 finals vs Boston, that's the Toews you're talking about: explosive, dynamic, pure finish
- Hawkjet

>Yes
>Think every Hawk fan loves Toews and wants to see THAT level of excellence return

But hey at least Toews can still eek by as 1C with solid linemates. Idk if there's anything that can save Seabrook at this point. He looks like a bottom pairing parking cone.

Agreed 100%

Its time to blow it up, including the head coach
- SimpleJack

>I get it -- you will come to Jonny's defense no matter what
>Toews passing this year is dreadful, his line is being driven by the endless motor of Saad, and the super-human strength of Panik
>Is Toews as captain, responsible or partly responsible for "the room"?
>Hawks have played a full 60 minute game a handful of times in the past 2 years
>Hawks have trouble starting games, what is Toews role in this?
>Toews on the PP -- other than the occasional draw win -- what is he doing that makes the PP better?
>Toews still does not pass the "eye test" -- he is on the wrong side of the puck more than any time in his career
>The Hawks desperately need JT to be an impact player - -the kind of impact that a fan attending their first game says, "Who is #19, that guy just dominates when he's on the ice'?
- SnapitUpstairs

Apparently Troy Murray ripped the "veteran leadership" of this team after the game. I didn't hear it but saw a scribe quote him. Very interesting.

All 3 Hawks letter wearers are showing downward trend. I caught Pierre last night making some off the wall comment on Keith unprovoked as if to defend him and build him up....nationally. Found that amusing this early in the season, those are truly reserved for Foley.

You would think, hope playing a huge rival after a long break you would come out flying, but Hawks were badly on their heels and I was just waiting for the blues to score and some blown coverage gave Schwartz a gimmee.....on goal 2 a bad change gave him another one, on goal 3 AA couldn't receive a pass that may/may not should have been given to him if Seabrook recognizes 91 lurking........

A brutal game.......

Apparently Troy Murray ripped the "veteran leadership" of this team after the game. I didn't hear it but saw a scribe quote him. Very interesting.

All 3 Hawks letter wearers are showing downward trend. I caught Pierre last night making some off the wall comment on Keith unprovoked as if to defend him and build him up....nationally. Found that amusing this early in the season, those are truly reserved for Foley.

You would think, hope playing a huge rival after a long break you would come out flying, but Hawks were badly on their heels and I was just waiting for the blues to score and some blown coverage gave Schwartz a gimmee.....on goal 2 a bad change gave him another one, on goal 3 AA couldn't receive a pass that may/may not should have been given to him if Seabrook recognizes 91 lurking........

A brutal game.......
- SteveRain

Those in attendance at the Blackhawks' optional skate: Hartman, Bouma, Wingels, Hayden, DeBrincat, Franson, Rutta, Oesterle, Forsling, Murphy, Anisimov, Kempny, Forsberg, Schmaltz, Kero, and Sharp.

The seven not here: Toews, Saad, Panik, Kane, Keith, Seabrook, Crawford, now that's what I call leadership!

>I get it -- you will come to Jonny's defense no matter what
>Toews passing this year is dreadful, his line is being driven by the endless motor of Saad, and the super-human strength of Panik
>Is Toews as captain, responsible or partly responsible for "the room"?
>Hawks have played a full 60 minute game a handful of times in the past 2 years
>Hawks have trouble starting games, what is Toews role in this?
>Toews on the PP -- other than the occasional draw win -- what is he doing that makes the PP better?
>Toews still does not pass the "eye test" -- he is on the wrong side of the puck more than any time in his career
>The Hawks desperately need JT to be an impact player - -the kind of impact that a fan attending their first game says, "Who is #19, that guy just dominates when he's on the ice'?
- SnapitUpstairs

Sure, so you believe that Saad and Richard Panik are carrying Toews? Do you seriously believe that?

You talk about slow starts, how about the Nashville game where in period 1 Toews and his line were the only ones going early. Toews had 2-3 attempts from the middle of the ice in the first period. Where were the rest of the team?

Look, I get it. People remember some highlights of the glory days of the this team and you want to think Toews was making those plays night after night, but that isn't reality. Some of you will appreciate what Toews brings to the team when he is actually declined or is gone.

Sure, so you believe that Saad and Richard Panik are carrying Toews? Do you seriously believe that?

You talk about slow starts, how about the Nashville game where in period 1 Toews and his line were the only ones going early. Toews had 2-3 attempts from the middle of the ice in the first period. Where were the rest of the team?

Look, I get it. People remember some highlights of the glory days of the this team and you want to think Toews was making those plays night after night, but that isn't reality. Some of you will appreciate what Toews brings to the team when he is actually declined or is gone.
- breadbag

If you have time today, rewatch game 7 of the 2015 WCF. Watch Toews carefully the entire game.

You can't seriously say that the same Toews was out on the ice last night, or at any point these past few seasons.

- DarthKane

If you have time today, rewatch game 7 of the 2015 WCF. Watch Toews carefully the entire game.

You can't seriously say that the same Toews was out on the ice last night, or at any point these past few seasons.
- SimpleJack

You cherry picking one game from late in the playoffs as a comparison? Is any player going to consistently match one of their best performances? Be realistic. Is there anyone on the Hawks roster putting in that kind of effort right now? Should they be? No.

Apparently Troy Murray ripped the "veteran leadership" of this team after the game. I didn't hear it but saw a scribe quote him. Very interesting.

All 3 Hawks letter wearers are showing downward trend. I caught Pierre last night making some off the wall comment on Keith unprovoked as if to defend him and build him up....nationally. Found that amusing this early in the season, those are truly reserved for Foley.

You would think, hope playing a huge rival after a long break you would come out flying, but Hawks were badly on their heels and I was just waiting for the blues to score and some blown coverage gave Schwartz a gimmee.....on goal 2 a bad change gave him another one, on goal 3 AA couldn't receive a pass that may/may not should have been given to him if Seabrook recognizes 91 lurking........

A brutal game.......
- SteveRain

>That's very interesting
>If Troy is saying that publicly, then "the room" is currently "not right"