The same Brian Campbell that the Hawks fans are all saying "why did we bring him back? He's awful & old & part of the reason we're down 3-0 right now because we have an awful cap situation & only look to acquire nostalgia players"
- ScienceJesus

He's been on the ice for 1 GA at 5v5. And the Hawks have generated 12 high danger chances while giving up 6 with him on the ice. So yeah, that Brian Campbell. He was also on the ice for a +16 goals for at 5v5 in the regular season, while playing on a team with average goaltending this season. I would have loved him on the 3rd pairing playing soft minutes.

So is it wrong to acknowledge that the first two goals were wierd bounces off our own guys. Fluky goals?
- Grinder47

The entire game was weird bounces and fluky goals

This is actually one of his better articles IMO. It may come off as bashing Flower, but it's actually good analysis. (And, if you read the article, he said the defense wasn't good. But it's also true, that they haven't been a stifling defense all year.) It's true though, if you are going to invest 5.75 mil, it better be worth it. He's not wrong about Fleury being erratic in performance. I 100% believe they should have tried to unload Fleury to make improvements on D.

Do I think the teams play was atrocious? Yes
Do I think Fleury's rebound control could have been better? Yes
Do I blame this loss on Fleury? Not even in the slightest
Do I think the Pens could have gotten similar goaltending elsewhere while using Flowers cap hit to improve the D? Absolutely.

But it is what it is, and I hope Fleury plays well more often than not, but I'm also aware how his performances fluctuate like crazy.
- j.boyd919

IMO the lead to the article is atrocious.

We are not paying 5.75 for goalie insurance. That is a sunk-cost fallacy. If Murray didn't come out of practically no where to be a true number 1 at a young age then we would just be paying 5.75 for about an average NHL starting goalie. Murray arrived way ahead of schedule and when we signed Fleury to 5.75/year it wasn't likely that we would have another starting caliber goalie on the roster.

Its questionable we could have even moved Fleury at the deadline. What is undisputed is we had zero chance of finding a replacement for his salary without moving a significant asset to acquire that guy. Its not paying for insurance its a sunk costs.

We don't even know if we had another option in the offseason to move Fleury. If we did then you could call it insurance.

It will be an interesting offseason to see if we can move fleury's salary without retention and whether we find a UFA option or trade partner to take on some salary.

We might even lose Hornqvist or Hagelins salary to expansion. My guess we go the 4 defenseman protection option and protect Letang, Schultz, Maatta, dumolin.

yea this blame flower stuff is ridiculous..We spotted them 3 goals and still clawed back to almost tie it..hell we scored a 5 on 5 SH goal with an empty net for mcjesus sake!! if you didnt think the pens were gonna come out Meh in the elimination sweep game you were only kidding yourself. Its hard to get up and match that kind of desperation...so just chill out have a beer and get ready for tomorrow....and fancy stats?? Im old school..that stuff is dumb.

Quotes didn't work, this is to jmatchett:

Which goals did you think he was out of position? As far as I saw, every time, they had an empty net to deal with was because the defense let a shooter come in that Fleury had to step out and challenge and trust his team to protect the back door, which they did a horrible job of.

As far as rebound control, that seems to be a subjective word that Fleury-haters (not saying you're a Fleury hater) love to use. The rebounds have to go somewhere. Goalies can't absorb every shot thrown at them within 20ft, especially when the team's strategy has been to shoot for the goalie's pads for rebounds. CBJ have been hammering that hard the last couple of games and then they win the race to the rebound. Even the most elite goalies are going to let in those 2nd chance goals without their defense there to back them up.
- jrmjames67

On the 4th goal, on the initial shot, he WAY overcompensated to the left, which was why it took him a fortnight to get back into position on the bank off the boards. On the 5th goal, again, he went way out to his left on the initial shot, leaving an open net on the rebound. Again, the defense didn't do much to help him out, but his positioning on those 2 goals was, at best, piss poor.

As for rebounds, there is such a thing as a controlled rebound. If you're not going to glove a shot or smother it, the good goalies are able to direct the rebounds to the corners or to teammates. A ton of Fleury's kicked straight out last night. Again, you have to count on the defense to support you, but he also wasn't helping them by kicking second- and third-chance shots right back to Columbus players.

The defense and the goalie have to be able to cover for each other. Last night, neither was helping the other out.

We might even lose Hornqvist or Hagelins salary to expansion. My guess we go the 4 defenseman protection option and protect Letang, Schultz, Maatta, dumolin.
- sditulli

I hope we expose Maatta. He will always be slow. He gets injured a lot. He is not physical. He is offensively limited. He can be replaced for $4 mil or less. I think Hornqvist is the least replaceable out of the three and he will be on an expiring contract. Hagelin brings more value to the team on a nightly basis. Not to mention you get to protect two more skaters if you go 7-3 rather than 4-4.

Maatta might improve, but he will always be slow in a league now dictated by speed. He is just too much of a liability to rely on going forward. If he were still on an ELC or a RFA, I might reconsider (ED notwithstanding).

I hope we expose Maatta. He will always be slow. He gets injured a lot. He is not physical. He is offensively limited. He can be replaced for $4 mil or less. I think Hornqvist is the least replaceable out of the three and he will be on an expiring contract. Hagelin brings more value to the team on a nightly basis. Not to mention you get to protect two more skaters if you go 7-3 rather than 4-4.

Maatta might improve, but he will always be slow in a league now dictated by speed. He is just too much of a liability to rely on going forward. If he were still on an ELC or a RFA, I might reconsider (ED notwithstanding).
- T-Train

Guentzel already replaced Hornqvist...

How can you really pick on this game... it was bad from so many angles lol.

1) Giveaway City. EVERYONE, that includes Sid, were committing egregious errant passes. Maatta was probably the biggest offender in this respect.

2) No intensity until later in the game, but it was too late. CBJ hit their stride and stuck with it.

3) Fleury showing why he's Fleury. No, not every goal was on him, but two of them certainly were.

4) Overall the Pens played a loose careless game. There was no commitment to team defense the way Games 1,2 and 3 had. In those games they clogged up the shooting lanes, kept CBJ mainly to the perimeter and that led to success. They let their foot off the gas in this area and getting back to that is the only way they win.

I do not have a lot of confidence in MAF as a goalie on a regular basis. His performances are much too inconsistent. Even when we won a cup in 2009 his performance, especially against Detroit was erratic. That said, who knows, he could make a fantastic performance against the BJ's tomorrow night. That is the problem IMO. Going into any game you never know which MAF will show up. Was last night all his fault, no way. However with a less than spectacular defense we need .920 goaltending to go very far.

If there's one thing that I do criticize Flower for is that when he's left on an island, like he was last night, with no defensive help in sight, he tries to do too much because it seems like he's trying to do everything since he knows it's going to be one of those nights where he can't rely on anyone else, and therefore gets himself all out of sorts. When he actually gets help & knows "someone will get to the rebound & clear it away, make the 1st save & direct it towards somewhere that my guy can get to it first", he's fine.

But that's a trait that I think a lot of players have when they feel like they're all alone in their own end & no reinforcements are coming to help bail them out.
- ScienceJesus

This is one of the first posts around I've ever see that seems to "get it" when it comes to the psychology of the position of goaltending, and how it relates to Fleury. It never ceases to amaze me how many goaltending experts there are around here who have never stepped between the pipes in a local beer league, much less the NHL.

Yes. Fleury's biggest fault is probably trying to do too much when the team isn't playing that well in front of him. And I believe that is the largest factor in his shortcomings. But he'll never, ever call his team out on it. Goalies don't do that. Goalies stop the puck, no matter what. And if it goes in, it's on him. Not his teammates.

Is it time for the Penguins to move on from Fleury? Maybe. I'm not personally one-hundred percent convinced, but I'm willing to concede it could be the case. But I also believe that statistics, simple or fancy, can almost always be massaged to show any point you wish to make.

Dan Hamhuis
Brian Campbell
Jason Demers

were the only 3 FAs I would have been interested in.

I was also interested in Schlemko, John-Michael Liles, and Clendening to a lesser extent. I thought Schlemko was a perfect fit for the Pens system.
- j.boyd919

THERe we go. I knew I wanted to sign someone. It was Schlemko. I really wanted Schlemko.

THERe we go. I knew I wanted to sign someone. It was Schlemko. I really wanted Schlemko.
- Victoro311

Yeah me too. Without Fleury's cap hit, if they wanted to go Murray/Jarry all season, they could have tried to get Demers or Schlemko or both.

http://www.broadstreethoc...358450/stay-classy-philly

If MAF and Carey Price traded places.....who would be a star and who would be a bum. I think the answer is obvious. In Montreal MAF would fold like a cheap suit and the media would be all over him. He would be in a mental institution almost immediately. Carey Price on the other hand would have had multiple Stanley Cups. NO DOUBT ABOUT IT. It is the reason why Price is Team Canada's goalie and MAF IS NOT
- holeinone

If Prime Hank wasn't able to will the Rags to a Cup then Carey Price wouldn't have been able to will any of the post-2010 dumpsterfire Pens teams to a Cup. Nice try.

http://www.broadstreethockey.com/2017/4/19/15358450/stay-classy-philly
- jmatchett383

I saw that, so poopty. People are scumbags. Regardless of where they're from.

http://www.broadstreethockey.com/2017/4/19/15358450/stay-classy-philly
- jmatchett383

Hahahaha that was a super well written blog.

Still waiting for an objective blogger to present the numbers on MAF. numbers dont lie. the people that present them do.

Fleury was not good last night. Objectively, he wasn't. His rebound control was bad, and his positioning on at least 2 goals was poor.

However, placing the bulk of blame on him for last night is just wrong. The defense was porous, letting CBJ drive the net at will, and the forwards backchecking was, in general, very poor. The Blue Jackets were able to gain the blue line easily and weren't pressured while in the offensive zone. A fantastic goaltender may have been able to keep the GA to 3, but the Penguins, as a team, didn't deserve to win last night.

Regroup, focus, and win Game 5.
- jmatchett383

all of this

Guentzel already replaced Hornqvist...
- j.boyd919

I agree guentzel replaced hornqvist. I'd rather have hagelin on the 3rd line than hornqvist. If horn isn't 1st pp he loses a lot of value to us.

Maatta could be trade bait. I'd rather lose horn to expansion then use maatta as trade bait. I wander if a maatta/drouin swap could make sense or something like that maybe for a 3rd line center.

Ryan Wilson should resign or be fired by Hockey Buzz for egging on Fleury. Without Mark Andre, the Pens would be toast by now. He saved Games 1 and 2. Game 4 it was bad D, bad crosby, bad Malkin. Schultz was invisible. Most forwards except Kessel, Guenzel were present only in body. If Hainsey and Kuhnackle are your scorers, you are not going to win any games whatsoever. So many turnovers and errors by the defencemen, I lost count.

Take the day off today and prepare to play hard to WIN.

Oh, fire Ryan Wilson, enough back stabbing Fleury
- allaboutpens

Another fluent apologist. Face it, his best days are behind him. I would take Murray any day of the week over fluent and that includes back when they beat detroit for the cup. Fluor has never had a stellar year in his career. Having Crosby and malkin etc is the ONLY reason he has most of those career wins. He's average at best. Look at his career statistics. Case and point

Another fluery apologist. Face it, his best days are behind him. I would take Murray any day of the week over fluent and that includes back when they beat detroit for the cup. Fluor has never had a stellar year in his career. Having Crosby and malkin etc is the ONLY reason he has most of those career wins. He's average at best. Look at his career statistics. Case and point
- bigdaddywaite

MAF apologists out in full force today.

These are the same people who thought Troy Polamalu should've never retired.

People that bang on the glass and act like morons are embarrassing. What is going on in their brains that makes them do that?

MAF apologists out in full force today.

These are the same people who thought Troy Polamalu should've never retired.
- Francois Leroux

(frank) the Steelers, (frank) Polamalu and (frank) you!

Go Flower!

MAF apologists out in full force today.

These are the same people who thought Troy Polamalu should've never retired.
- Francois Leroux

(frank) Troy and (frank) MAF