Remember when last year how we were told how horrible the D would be without Hamhuis? Exactly the same.
- VANTEL

Remember how bad Bart was? Exactly the same is correct. I would say that if Van would have kept Hammer instead of Edler this D would be better.

Didn't we get a draft pick for him?
- VanHockeyGuy

Yes Stecher does, he's paired with Edler 29% of the time while TRYING to shut the oppositions top pairing. Huttons usually with Tram.

Theres also no reason to think that Guddy can't/isn't going to step up and log a lot of mins next season IF Tanev or Edler disappear.
- Brooks_Light

Imagine
Alzner Stecher
OJ Gudbranson
Hutton Tryamkin.

The thought of that gets me hard.

That's the entire point.
He doesn't play with them because he's being sheltered from a more difficult role he is not ready for...



- Whiskey-Tango

Why doesn't he get a role that isn't sheltered? Everyone keeps eluding to them as kids. Let them have a go. Bring in help if needed.

Hutton Gudbransen
Stecher Trymkin
Sbisa Joulevi

Share the minutes until a tandem proves they can do the job.

The team will fall apart the team will fall apart we can't trade Lack Hamhuis Burrows Hansen Edler Tanev . We went to the cup in 2011 , we have won three playoff games in 6 years but we can't lose those players

Why doesn't he get a role that isn't sheltered? Everyone keeps eluding to them as kids. Let them have a go. Bring in help if needed.

Hutton Gudbransen
Stecher Trymkin
Sbisa Joulevi

Share the minutes until a tandem proves they can do the job.
- thundachunk

And while there's no immediate pressure to win.

You do realize we would not be playing with 4 Dmen if they go . You are allowed to replace them with the cap space you save.
- VANTEL

I do realize that, but here's a reality for you Vantel.

Who ever we replace them with won't be 'better', be it in a skill or cost sense.
If we trade them, we won't be getting back a better D-man, at-least not at the time due them likely being much younger and in need of development. Nobody will trade us a better D man for an inferior one...reality.

What D man could we get on the free market that can log 20-25 minutes a night, that's going to be cheaper then 4.5 and 5 mill a year respectively?

Now you guys can talk all day long about shipping players out, but when you do so without any modicum of foresight or understanding of the long-term effects then it becomes redundant and annoying.

But who am i kidding?
Expose Edler.
Trade Tanev for a late first-rounder.
Demote the Twins or 'force' them out.

Rebuilt complete.

Didn't we get a draft pick for him?
- VanHockeyGuy

When you dive into it.
Dallas Stars
Acquire:
Kris Russell

Calgary Flames
Acquire:
Jyrki Jokipakka
Brett Pollock
2nd-round draft pick in 2016 (conditional) Dillon Dube

Then

Calgary Flames
Acquire:
Curtis Lazar
Michael Kostka

Ottawa Senators
Acquire:
2017 second-round pick
Jyrki Jokipakka

Essentially Cgy turned the trade for Russell into Curtis Lazar.

Why doesn't he get a role that isn't sheltered? Everyone keeps eluding to them as kids. Let them have a go. Bring in help if needed.

Hutton Gudbransen
Stecher Trymkin
Sbisa Joulevi

Share the minutes until a tandem proves they can do the job.
- thundachunk

You saw Hutton and Guds right?

I do realize that, but here's a reality for you Vantel.

Who ever we replace them with won't be 'better', be it in a skill or cost sense.
If we trade them, we won't be getting back a better D-man, at-least not at the time due them likely being much younger and in need of development. Nobody will trade us a better D man for an inferior one...reality.

What D man could we get on the free market that can log 20-25 minutes a night, that's going to be cheaper then 4.5 and 5 mill a year respectively?

Now you guys can talk all day long about shipping players out, but when you do so without any modicum of foresight or understanding of the long-term effects then it becomes redundant and annoying.

But who am i kidding?
Expose Edler.
Trade Tanev for a late first-rounder.
Demote the Twins or 'force' them out.

Rebuilt complete.
- Whiskey-Tango

I get your point you are afraid to try something different even though our team sucks.

Who could we get to replace them for less than 4.5 mil

First of all by moving them you realize you will be getting back better returns, but I will play along.

Left handed Edler could be replaced with Left handed Tyutin at 2 mil .

RH Tanev can be replaced with RH Cody Fransen who played last year for 2.5 mil.

That took me all of two minutes to find

[quote=manvanfan]Imagine
Alzner Stecher
OJ Gudbranson
Hutton Tryamkin.

Hutton Gudbransen
Stecher Trymkin
Sbisa Joulevi

I almost hope those rosters become a reality simply so I can resort to a 'told you so' moment next season when we have hands-down, the worst back-end in the league.

I do realize that, but here's a reality for you Vantel.

Who ever we replace them with won't be 'better', be it in a skill or cost sense.
If we trade them, we won't be getting back a better D-man, at-least not at the time due them likely being much younger and in need of development. Nobody will trade us a better D man for an inferior one...reality.

What D man could we get on the free market that can log 20-25 minutes a night, that's going to be cheaper then 4.5 and 5 mill a year respectively?

Now you guys can talk all day long about shipping players out, but when you do so without any modicum of foresight or understanding of the long-term effects then it becomes redundant and annoying.

But who am i kidding?
Expose Edler.
Trade Tanev for a late first-rounder.
Demote the Twins or 'force' them out.

Rebuilt complete.
- Whiskey-Tango

Now you are just being the Ignorant Jack ass that you always turn into when conversations get going.

That's if for me you POS

[quote=manvanfan]Imagine
Alzner Stecher
OJ Gudbranson
Hutton Tryamkin.

Hutton Gudbransen
Stecher Trymkin
Sbisa Joulevi


I almost hope those rosters become a reality simply so I can resort to a 'told you so' moment next season when we have hands-down, the worst back-end in the league.
- Whiskey-Tango

You talk as if that's a bad thing?

[quote=manvanfan]Imagine
Alzner Stecher
OJ Gudbranson
Hutton Tryamkin.

Hutton Gudbransen
Stecher Trymkin
Sbisa Joulevi


I almost hope those rosters become a reality simply so I can resort to a 'told you so' moment next season when we have hands-down, the worst back-end in the league.
- Whiskey-Tango

We have the worst D in the league with Tanev and Edler. Can I say "I told you so" right now?

Now you are just being the Ignorant Jack ass that you always turn into when conversations get going.

That's if for me you POS
- VANTEL

Whiskey: 1.
Skip: 0.

We have the worst D in the league with Tanev and Edler. Can I say "I told you so" right now?
- manvanfan

Hopefully there's a "generational player" available in the 2018 & 2019 draft.

We have the worst D in the league with Tanev and Edler. Can I say "I told you so" right now?
- manvanfan

If, over the course of the next 5 games, our D-core manages to allow more goals then all of TOR, NYI, WIN, FLA, DAL, DET, NJ, ARZ and COL, then sure, by all means.

If, over the course of the next 5 games, our D-core manages to allow more goals then all of TOR, NYI, WIN, FLA, DAL, DET, NJ, ARZ and COL, then sure, by all means.
- Whiskey-Tango

Not to mention our D doesn't help play defence, they also don't help with offence. If Van didn't have Miller.

We have the 4 th highest GA OA

We have the 2 nd lowest GF OA

We currently sit in 27 th spot OA

This is the team that some pinheads are afraid to change.

We really do have some Willy D clones on here with keep the vets

Hopefully there's a "generational player" available in the 2018 & 2019 draft.
- VanHockeyGuy

Stecher, Hutton, Tryamkin all got a years experience, hopefully they come back next season better.

well , cody glass doesn't look anything special to me, he made a couple of plays and the cougars goalie sucked, if hes a top pick this draft isn't good, his wingers make him good I thought. The hawks were outplayed by a wide margin goalie stood on his head and Edmonds sucked. Popaguiev could be a good one if he works on his first 2 steps, his work effort is questionable but he has a nice set of hands for a big dude.

Remember how bad Bart was? Exactly the same is correct. I would say that if Van would have kept Hammer instead of Edler this D would be better.
- manvanfan

Bart is now part of the Flames turnaround success

The D issue is complex. It's a combo of coaching, systems, team play and individual D skills and development. Right now 2 regulars are completing their first season of NHL play. A third his second. So can they do more next season?!? If so, then a new D like OJ, if ready, can take up the sheltered role. Thus making a senior D expendable.

Not to mention our D doesn't help play defence, they also don't help with offence. If Van didn't have Miller.
- manvanfan

That's certainly a huge factor as well, I'll give you that.

We have the 4 th highest GA OA

We have the 2 nd lowest GF OA

We currently sit in 27 th spot OA

This is the team that some pinheads are afraid to change.

We really do have some Willy D clones on here with keep the vets
- VANTEL

Hey, this has been nice. A heated debate about the defence that has gone on for pages with stats and figures. I haven't seen a bunch of name calling. No one is getting extra angry.

That's certainly a huge factor as well, I'll give you that.
- Whiskey-Tango

The Possession stat for Van has been terrible. The forwards aren't helping out the D. Has a lot to do with coaching.