Why not have the same breakdown about Toews and the season he had?

He didn't have his precious LW Saad this season? He demanded 10.3million which made Saad too expensive. He wanted the money...so make it work. Produce. He didn't in the regular season and he didn't in the playoffs. Toews is part of the reason they are in "cap hell" (as is Kane). Kane just won the Art Ross and probably the Hart. Toews had 58pts and 0g in the playoffs

If you have accountability for the guy standing behind the bench, why not have it for the highest paid player in the league with a stick in his hand 82gms a season?
- PatShart

Because he's not in charge of managing the group, filling out the lineup and creating lines and D combos.

But if your asking me if Go Johnny Go needed to do more both in the regular season and playoffs I'd say yes.

Then if you asked me if I had to choose between Toews playing a bit better or Q not running Daley and Garbutt out of town, icing guys like Mash and Rundblad while Weise and Fleishman sit to get past the Blues I'd choose the latter.

Daley means the top 3 skate less minutes and TVR is your #5. Depth at the bottom 6 means they roll 4 lines. Q did neither and in the grand scheme I think that hurt the club more than Toews having an off year.

Because he's not in charge of managing the group, filling out the lineup and creating lines and D combos.

But if your asking me if Go Johnny Go needed to do more both in the regular season and playoffs I'd say yes.

Then if you asked me if I had to choose between Toews playing a bit better or Q not running Daley and Garbutt out of town, icing guys like Mash and Rundblad while Weise and Fleishman sit to get past the Blues I'd choose the latter.

Daley means the top 3 skate less minutes and TVR is your #5. Depth at the bottom 6 means they roll 4 lines. Q did neither and in the grand scheme I think that hurt the club more than Toews having an off year.
- Mr Ricochet

Multiple things played a part in the playoff ouster. Tired guys, depth issues.. but the biggest issue was a total HC failure in playing the best roster available to him. Dont know what the deal was, but Q needs a WTF meeting with ownership as to what he was doing.

(frank)ing Blues. Their goal today was pass deflection off a Stars' player, much like the Game 1 OT goal against the Hawks. Yeah they are a good team, but they're getting WAY too much puck luck this year.
- DMChi2010

This Hawks fan is pullin' for the Blues...

...F' Dallas for being a lousy hockey town and for the NHL facilitating the demise of the Northstars.

May they miss the playoffs next year, and every year until they're forced to relocate due to a lack of interest.

Not sure anyone has mentioned this, but a Hawks hat was seen on the pitch at Leicester during the Premier League Championship celebration...

...relative of Leicester midfielder N'Golo Kante.

This Hawks fan is pullin' for the Blues...

...F' Dallas for being a lousy hockey town and for the NHL facilitating the demise of the Northstars.

May they miss the playoffs next year, and every year until they're forced to relocate due to a lack of interest.
- ArlingtonRob

The farther the Blues go, the better it makes us look. Go Blues!!!

Seriously they probably are the best most well rounded team remaining, championship worthy indeed. And if they do win the Cup it sure won't seem that bad looking back on how we took them to 7 games in an extremely close and competitive series.

The farther the Blues go, the better it makes us look. Go Blues!!!

Seriously they probably are the best most well rounded team remaining, championship worthy indeed. And if they do win the Cup it sure won't seem that bad looking back on how we took them to 7 games in an extremely close and competitive series.
- SimpleJack

Exactly. That will then point to the play-off system. Wasn't that a #3 vs a #5 in the first round? That should be the Conference Finals or Final, not the opening round....

@DareenDreger at 7:42
Bruce Boudreau is finalizing a deal to be next head coach of the Minnesota Wild. Ottawa has been informed..

The Central is not getting any easier my frents

The farther the Blues go, the better it makes us look. Go Blues!!!

Seriously they probably are the best most well rounded team remaining, championship worthy indeed. And if they do win the Cup it sure won't seem that bad looking back on how we took them to 7 games in an extremely close and competitive series.
- SimpleJack

Watching the Blues take advantage of the Stars is fun. Interesting to note that Oduya/Johns have firmly become the #5 and #6 for Dallas and the Stars are not trusting them to play in the D zone at 5v5 with both guys getting hardly any Dzone starts vs STL in the series.

@DareenDreger at 7:42
Bruce Boudreau is finalizing a deal to be next head coach of the Minnesota Wild. Ottawa has been informed..

The Central is not getting any easier my frents
- Marlowe

A slap in the face to Torchetti. Wonder what becomes of him.

I'd be ok with the Blues winning the Cup. I might in a a minority on that, but would rather see them than the Pens. Bolts would be fine with me too, and maybe Sharks in there. Plenty of good vets that would be cool to see celebrate with it.

Think because the Blue's guys on our board have generally been pretty cool, would be kinda neat for them to experience that. Then again, I started work at 5, so I'm probably a little loopy from being sleep deprived.
- howiehandles

I initially thought I'd prefer the Blues to win over the Stars. But now I think the further the Blues go the more likely Panarin is gonna want to join Tarasenko instead of staying in Chicago

I initially thought I'd prefer the Blues to win over the Stars. But now I think the further the Blues go the more likely Panarin is gonna want to join Tarasenko instead of staying in Chicago
- maria_wyeth

Only way Panarin leaves is if he's a top10 scorer again next year and gets $8mil from a team with a lot more cap space than STL

Multiple things played a part in the playoff ouster. Tired guys, depth issues.. but the biggest issue was a total HC failure in playing the best roster available to him. Dont know what the deal was, but Q needs a WTF meeting with ownership as to what he was doing.
- z1990z

I hope Toews is next meeting to answer WTF did he do this year to be the highest (overpaid) player in the league to have a pathetic regular and post season. That contract is second behind Bickell's anchor

Because he's not in charge of managing the group, filling out the lineup and creating lines and D combos.

But if your asking me if Go Johnny Go needed to do more both in the regular season and playoffs I'd say yes.

Then if you asked me if I had to choose between Toews playing a bit better or Q not running Daley and Garbutt out of town, icing guys like Mash and Rundblad while Weise and Fleishman sit to get past the Blues I'd choose the latter.

Daley means the top 3 skate less minutes and TVR is your #5. Depth at the bottom 6 means they roll 4 lines. Q did neither and in the grand scheme I think that hurt the club more than Toews having an off year.
- Mr Ricochet

Toews' game was down all year long and he is obviously key to the Hawks success...no point in minimizing the impact that had on the forward group. Was it because his line was/is in a state of flux or because his own offensive play lacked a certain dynamic component it has had in the past is open to question. He had a subpar year but no doubt he has better years still ahead.

Q made some decisions that didn't work out but to think that any coach, given the amount of turnover that this team is forced to deal with, could do better is unrealistic.

The real villain here is the current salary cap era that we as Hawk fans follow our team in. The Blackhawks assemble generational talent on a team and we are forced to sweat it out while management is compelled to move players they don't want to move and we suffer as these players flourish elsewhere. While as a Hawks fan I have had to endure successive cups won in Montreal, NY, and Edmonton, today we as Hawks fans are left to watch as our championship "Cap Dynasty" team shaves off salary by trading players those teams were able to hold on to for years. Indeed, no championship team in any sport in my lifetime has had to cope with this level of turnover of good productive players.

Lets hope that while they figure out if they are going to trade our version of Grant Fuhr or resign our Bob Nystrom, they somehow are able to plot a way to win one or two more cups while this group is still in their prime years.

Big picture is I'd cut them some slack.

I hope Toews is next meeting to answer WTF did he do this year to be the highest (overpaid) player in the league to have a pathetic regular and post season. That contract is second behind Bickell's anchor
- PatShart

Based on last year's compensation schedule, anything over $7.5MM would return 2 firsts, a second, and a third - and the signing team must be able to deliver their own original picks.

Any offer sheet over $5.5MM would return a first, a second, and a third.

I initially thought I'd prefer the Blues to win over the Stars. But now I think the further the Blues go the more likely Panarin is gonna want to join Tarasenko instead of staying in Chicago
- maria_wyeth

I thought that before and especially given what Panarin had said about Q , the cash availability, playing in Kane's shadow, not a good recipe, So if Hitch and Armstrong felt they made a mistake by not pursuing Panarin, after they win the cup, they can re visit those negotiations by throwing Colton Parayko and Jake Allen on the table for starters!

Note to Blues fans reading this site, Revel in the moment if you should happen to win the cup, just remember those kids on your team are gonna wanna get paid also so be ready to pony up and also probably lose some guys. Just pray you don't have what looks like a Bowl of Spaghetti running your team which what the situation looks like it is turning into here. It's a hot mess!

A slap in the face to Torchetti. Wonder what becomes of him.
- TyCamScore

Agreed...

Have no clue what the back story to all this is, but Torch helped turn that club around and even found 2 wins against the Stars sans Parise.

Wonder where Torch ends up...since I'm sure he wants nothing more to do with the Wild.

Can't wait for someone else to come on and mention daley or his hawk corsi without using their eyeballs again tonight.

First goal, he never is in position,
I won't fault his swing and miss on the puck that went by his stick for the second, but,what never sits well with me is the way Daley's head and footwork on Justin
Williams final goal that makes the case on him...
Does he ever skate in a backpedal?
...or,show enough instinct to read and be in position to react?
So you want to puff your chest for him, you might have missed him up close and personal.

Like the rest of you, very surprised by Bruce Boudreau in Minny over Torchetti.

Management there must thi9nk it is now or never and Boudreau and the f-bomb make players out on the bottom nine forwards.

I figured Ottawa was where he would go re-invent himself...

Would love to see StanBo try and trade into the top 15 to select a future pillar on Defense...Jakob Chychrun looks to be a solid 2-way dman
- EnzoD

Top 15?

I think he goes pretty fast before that slot.

There truly are only four defenseman who look like safe packs imo.

...and maybe it is me, but the Russian and Finn don't seem to be more than projections based on their feet and offense, not complete solid defensive games.


yeah maybe he gets to nine,if Vancouver doesn't feel totally compelled to trade out to like slot 5 and take him.

http://www.draftsite.com/nhl/mock-draft/2016/

It is really easy as fans to take notice of the bigger defenders with skill and decent feet, but the past ten years, there is plenty of evidence that higher drafted big men can flop even after four years in the NHL, at a high rate than the forwards you see them ranked close to.

Personally I have likes Dante Fabbro the most, and he can still get bigger and he might be there at the 15 slot...if the scouts don't value him as highly as i do.

The thing is what you are asking...what do the hawks have to trade to do that?

Troy Brouwer harvested a #26 overall selection used to draft Danault, but most in the know will argue pick 15 is right before the quality drops and the next draft tier begins...
I don't know what if a team trades out for what I belive the Hawks would be willing to offer....and the other thing is the Brouwer trade was early Draft Cap years where teams didn't as yet see the value of holding on to them ... in 2011, the Cap rose 3 million, and there wasn't even though of compression like nowadays.

So a mid first rounder (even in this draft that dummies down rather quickly in the first to players with warts you see by the third erund in that first) has value and a team have to really feel the vet and package they acquire is gonna take them places so they can forget about the choice as a long term Cap solution.

Top 15?

I think he goes pretty fast before that slot.

There truly are only four defenseman who look like safe packs imo.

...and maybe it is me, but the Russian and Finn don't seem to be more than projections based on their feet and offense, not complete solid defensive games.


yeah maybe he gets to nine,if Vancouver doesn't feel totally compelled to trade out to like slot 5 and take him.

http://www.draftsite.com/nhl/mock-draft/2016/

It is really easy as fans to take notice of the bigger defenders with skill and decent feet, but the past ten years, there is plenty of evidence that higher drafted big men can flop even after four years in the NHL, at a high rate than the forwards you see them ranked close to.

Personally I have likes Dante Fabbro the most, and he can still get bigger and he might be there at the 15 slot...if the scouts don't value him as highly as i do.

The thing is what you are asking...what do the hawks have to trade to do that?

Troy Brouwer harvested a #26 overall selection used to draft Danault, but most in the know will argue pick 15 is right before the quality drops and the next draft tier begins...
I don't know what if a team trades out for what I belive the Hawks would be willing to offer....and the other thing is the Brouwer trade was early Draft Cap years where teams didn't as yet see the value of holding on to them ... in 2011, the Cap rose 3 million, and there wasn't even though of compression like nowadays.

So a mid first rounder (even in this draft that dummies down rather quickly in the first to players with warts you see by the third erund in that first) has value and a team have to really feel the vet and package they acquire is gonna take them places so they can forget about the choice as a long term Cap solution.
- wiz1901

I don´t see defensemen safe picks at all like you pointed out later there..

Agreed...

Have no clue what the back story to all this is, but Torch helped turn that club around and even found 2 wins against the Stars sans Parise.

Wonder where Torch ends up...since I'm sure he wants nothing more to do with the Wild.
- ArlingtonRob

This is a little off topic and probably too early, but here is a possible trade that would help the Hawks and Edmonton:

Andrew Shaw, Corey Crawford and a player from Rockford for Darnell Nurse and Leon Draisaitl.

The Hawks get the young d-man they need, a young versatile forward, the team gets a little bigger and younger, and Edmonton gets valuable veteran experience and a top 10 goalie.

And the Hawks get valuable cap relief.

Let the debate begin.

This is a little off topic and probably too early, but here is a possible trade that would help the Hawks and Edmonton:

Andrew Shaw, Corey Crawford and a player from Rockford for Darnell Nurse and Leon Draisaitl.

The Hawks get the young d-man they need, a young versatile forward, the team gets a little bigger and younger, and Edmonton gets valuable veteran experience and a top 10 goalie.

And the Hawks get valuable cap relief.

Let the debate begin.





- dahawks8819

Where do I sign even though it would sting a bit trading Shaw.

Toews' game was down all year long and he is obviously key to the Hawks success...no point in minimizing the impact that had on the forward group. Was it because his line was/is in a state of flux or because his own offensive play lacked a certain dynamic component it has had in the past is open to question. He had a subpar year but no doubt he has better years still ahead.

Q made some decisions that didn't work out but to think that any coach, given the amount of turnover that this team is forced to deal with, could do better is unrealistic.

The real villain here is the current salary cap era that we as Hawk fans follow our team in. The Blackhawks assemble generational talent on a team and we are forced to sweat it out while management is compelled to move players they don't want to move and we suffer as these players flourish elsewhere. While as a Hawks fan I have had to endure successive cups won in Montreal, NY, and Edmonton, today we as Hawks fans are left to watch as our championship "Cap Dynasty" team shaves off salary by trading players those teams were able to hold on to for years. Indeed, no championship team in any sport in my lifetime has had to cope with this level of turnover of good productive players.

Lets hope that while they figure out if they are going to trade our version of Grant Fuhr or resign our Bob Nystrom, they somehow are able to plot a way to win one or two more cups while this group is still in their prime years.

Big picture is I'd cut them some slack.
- Hawkshead

Indeed Q made some decisions that didn't work out and didn't have Buff, Campbell, Brouwer, Sharp or Saad types to bail him out. The margin for error is now minuscule for Q and StanBowPops&McD. .....

As far as any coach dealing with turnover I see Mike Sullivan in PITT doing a fine job in all respects melding his world class core with rookies Kuhnhkackl, Sheary (undrafted FA 1st line with Crosby) and Rust along with middling vets like Bonino, Fehr and Hagelin who are being used so they are useful.

And with a D core that would scare anyone to have to ice in a playoff matchup let alone vs the top scoring club in the world. After Letang and Daley you have to close your eyes with Maata their next best Dman out you're forced to ice Shultz, Cole, Lovejoy, Domulin, Pouliot!!! Man they barely have a top 2 and certainly don't have a top 4 but are outplaying the President Cup winners with a 21 yr ROOKIE in net behind that defense!!

But Wilson is getting it done. In fact as I watch the Pens right now I'm hoping StanBowPops&McD are too and maybe see a template moving forward.

Yea the cap is screwing them but that's how the rules are set up, adapt or die. The luxury of having guys fit your systems/scheme perfectly is gone. The luxury of overwhelming talent is gone. The luxury of not having to let rookies play through mistakes are gone. The luxury of thumbing your nose at deals the GM makes at great future cost is gone.

Sure I'll cut em some slack, they've proven they can win. That's yesterday though and the parameters have changed in building and icing a team. The margin for error is near zero and luxuries afforded in the PAST are gone. Adapt or die.



[url]

Can't wait for someone else to come on and mention daley or his hawk corsi without using their eyeballs again tonight.

First goal, he never is in position,
I won't fault his swing and miss on the puck that went by his stick for the second, but,what never sits well with me is the way Daley's head and footwork on Justin
Williams final goal that makes the case on him...
Does he ever skate in a backpedal?
...or,show enough instinct to read and be in position to react?
So you want to puff your chest for him, you might have missed him up close and personal.
- wiz1901

I'm here for you, yesterday, today and tomorrow. Was the day they acquired Daley, when they had him, when he was run out of town and will be tomorrow and posted so. How anyone, using their eyes or stats, can't see Daley at 3 mil per as a #4 Dman for the Hawks, moving TVR to #5 and shaving 10 minutes off of the top 3's minutes as a better option than any two of Sved/Rundblad/Gus in a Game 7 I'll just have to agree to disagree.

More stats. All defensmen playing in the playoffs in round 1 on getting the puck OUT of their own zone. You know Q's theory of the offense triggered by the defense, getting the puck out from a Dman to a forward. Leddy fans will like this. http://www.sportsnet.ca/h...cemen-proficient-offence/

And an easy to see/understand chart, which also confirms my views that Rozy is far better than 90% of Hawk fans think: https://public.tableau.com/profile/sean.tierney#!/vizhome/Zoneexits/Dashboard1

Simply said the very best defense is one that allows his team to play the game at the other end and guys like Daley, and even clubfoot Rozy, do that better than most. Sure you can point to Daley kicking a puck on A play here and there, the same as a Keith or Doughty, but the data says you are wrong 9 ways to Sunday not to mention the minutes he would eat allowing the top 3 10 minutes less TOI per game. .

This is a little off topic and probably too early, but here is a possible trade that would help the Hawks and Edmonton:

Andrew Shaw, Corey Crawford and a player from Rockford for Darnell Nurse and Leon Draisaitl.

Let the debate begin.

- dahawks8819

Debate ? More like a jok.e

Oilers should trade the two things the team needs more of (low Cap hit Defender and big two way forward centre with grit)

Not being considered or even worth debating.

I love Shwazie but you have to think of every undersized plugger on every team can have long bodies of work, but teams must think of those average sized forwards as older vehiches that as the keep running as more inclined to need repair.

So simply think of it that way...why would any team trade two of their past top ten picks who still are smaller Cap hits?
(when they have many others who have underachived, still don't have 200 foot games and are about to need FATTTER Cap hit contracts...)

Discussion closed