Martinez > Muzzin
- sjsharksss

SJ could use a solid 3/4 like Martinez. Is Mirco Mueller that guy?

SJ could use a solid 3/4 like Martinez. Is Mirco Mueller that guy?
- Only_A_Ladd

Hopefully he will be in 2/3 years when Martin is no longer a top 4 dman.. he seems to be improving his defensive game this season with the cuda but still has a lot to improve on. We'll see.

I remarked yesterday about what I perceive as Muzzin's low hockey IQ and I'd like to point to the play that he made at the very end of the 2nd period last night. In his own zone, in a tied game and with mere seconds left on the clock, he sent a blind pass up the wall and directly to Wingels, who passed to a wide open Couture, who forced Quick to make probably one of the saves of the year to keep the score tied going into the 2nd intermission. There's just no excuse for that, and it's a good example of the kind of play that he makes too often, but which tends to be overlooked because he's usually bailed out by someone else (Quick, in this case).

Yes. End of story. Muzzin gets 40+ points. Plays 22+ minutes. Is a possession monster. Plays all three zones. Plays all situations.

He is a good defenseman. End of story.
- Jason_Lewis

You missed my point. You're more than welcome to believe that he's a good defenseman (which isn't even unreasonable, now that you've dialed it back from "near elite" to "very good" to just "good"). That's not what I was taking issue with there. It was with saying "end of story," which I find to be extremely weak from an argumentative standpoint and makes it look like you think really highly of your opinions. If you're not comfortable with having a debate about what you wrote or I wrote, you don't need to try to tell me how much what I wrote isn't worth responding to or try to arrest open dialogue by saying "end of story." Just say that you strongly disagree, but would rather not engage in an argument, and I'd respect that.

It really isn't difficult to name better. Nashville is one team with a better 1-2 and a better top-4 than LA. I'm sorry, but it's wrong to say that Weber/Josi is "a bit questionable perhaps" as even being an elite pairing. That is, by far, IMO, the best pairing or "one-two punch" in the league. Doughty is a bit better than Weber, but Josi is head and shoulders better than Muzzin. It's not even close. Josi is actually quite a bit closer to being on Doughty's level than he is Muzzin's level.

There isn't anything elite about Muzzin. Much of the reason why people make the mistake of thinking that he is is because they're Corsi watching and see him 3rd in the league. Dustin Brown and Nick Shore are 10th and 11th in the league in Corsi, yet that doesn't make them elite forwards. Also, Muzzin's Corsi did drop considerably from last season (from 9 less than Doughty in 14-15 to 115 less than Doughty in 15-16, not to mention from a Rel% of 3.5 to 1.9), so saying that playing with Doughty didn't inflate his numbers is incorrect. In addition, Doughty's numbers have gone up considerably since being separated from Muzzin (from 410 SAT and 2.0 Rel% to 481 and 4.4 Rel%). If you argue that it's not the separation, but the team's better regular season, that is behind Doughty's improvement, then that only makes Muzzin's drop, despite being on the same better team, even more noteworthy.

When you actually watch Muzzin closely, you see a player who has offensive and puck-moving skills, but low hockey IQ and little mind for defense. He routinely pinches when no one's covering for him, attempts to exit the zone without the puck (because he's so eager to go on offense), turns the puck over (even egregiously), is slow to get back on defense, gets turned inside out (often reacting by hauling the player down for a penalty) and chases the puck in the defensive zone. Other Kings defensemen commit some of the same things, but that's rather the point. If he were elite, he wouldn't look as bad as any of the others as often as he does.

He's committed every single one of the just-mentioned misplays in just the last couple of games, but you would've had to notice them, yourself, since no attention is paid to such things because the faithful who cover them, like Jim Fox and (I'm sorry, but) this blog, only ever highlight Muzzin's good plays. The bad plays never get highlight packages or GIFs made from them. They get swept under the rug or have excuses made for them (it's always some other player's fault). In fact, once, when Muzzin was overly aggressive, missed his man completely and allowed a 3-on-1 against, Jim Fox said "you can't fault him." It's stuff like that that Muzzin routinely gets excused for (while other players get called out) because, I believe, some want to believe that they have two elite defensemen and that the d-corps isn't carried as much by Doughty as others would accuse.
- Osprey

Didn't read any of this but I'm sure it's a debbie d whah....whah....whah

Didn't read any of this but I'm sure it's a debbie d whah....whah....whah
- dprice818

It is. Total Charlie Browns teachers voice.
Ospry = contrarian. END OF STORY.

Didn't read any of this but I'm sure it's a debbie d whah....whah....whah
- dprice818

Exactly.