So when people use advance stats to "find" the best fit player out there doesn't always work as many advance statisticians imply. Prime example actually provided by you is Dubnyk. No stats said he was going to be the answer (some will say he hasn't done enough to solidify himself as the answer).

All i am saying is people need to meet in the middle on things and not be so closed minded. Stats open up an entire realm of information that was never touched before but people that use it need to stop being condescending to anyone that doesn't agree with them. They are like the hipsters of the hockey world, no one is a fan.
- kgrpitt

Exactly, meet in the middle, hell Ryan has said the stats are not the god particle. Where I get frustrated with it, and I know he does too, is the blind hate on the stats.

Then we do come across as condescending, because it baffles me that people don't want to use another tool to look for better options.

That Duby example is perfect, the Wild looked internally saw they had a flaw and went out to try and fix it. The fact Duby has worked is where stats do help, but the stats helped the Wild identify their weakness.

God I wouldnt have gone to Duby, but they may have had scouts watching him for weeks and figured putting a team in front of him who actually controls the puck and reduces high quality shots will allow him to fill that hole.

That is what is so strange with Quick and the Kings, because their possession numbers are so great, when Quick falls apart it really hurts them. Same with Fleury and the Penguins, if either go through a rough patch (a sub .920 e/s sv%) then it gets highlighted because their team dominates but loses due to bad goals.

Yeah, I wasn't counting Gibbons' two goals in that total. 5 from Sutter, 2 from Stempniak, 1 from Adams, 1 from Bennett.

And in terms of regular season productivity, Sutter is far ahead of where he was last year. 26 points in 81 games last regular season, 21 points in 55 games so far this year. I wouldn't be surprised at all if Sutter finishes strong and has another strong playoff season this year.
- hardnosed

If Sutter gets 5 more more points and manages more than 2 pts per round in the playoffs, Bartley will give out free handies.

If Sutter gets 5 more more points and manages more than 2 pts per round in the playoffs, Bartley will give out free handies.
- thickman1178

The third line has looked better since he's been reunited with Spaling and Bennett. But they've had a good game/bad game thing going on. Just need to find some consistency.

Still, Spaling/Sutter/Bennett is infinitely better than Stempniak/Goc/Bennett.
- hardnosed

And even better than that would be Downie - Spaling - Bennett

Hide Sutterd on the 4th line I say

If Sutter gets 5 more more points and manages more than 2 pts per round in the playoffs, Bartley will give out free handies.
- thickman1178

Haha new POTD

If Sutter gets 5 more more points and manages more than 2 pts per round in the playoffs, Bartley will give out free handies.
- thickman1178

The only handies Bartley hands out are in the form of a fashwash...and trust me when I say his gloves DO NOT smell pleasant

Did he take any guesses at what those might be? Because what would be reasonable big trades with those teams? Carolina would have to be one of the Staals for it to be considered a big trade. And Edmonton would have to be Hall or Eberle, maybe Yakupov, but I am not sure that even qualifies as a big trade. I just don't see those being very reasonable trades, and anything else I wouldn't consider big.
- PensFan1103

Maybe Faulk from Carolina ?

Maybe Faulk from Carolina ?
- willi

Lol no.


Just to give you an idea...

http://war-on-ice.com/pla...2015-02-19&splitseasons=0

Exactly, meet in the middle, hell Ryan has said the stats are not the god particle. Where I get frustrated with it, and I know he does too, is the blind hate on the stats.

Then we do come across as condescending, because it baffles me that people don't want to use another tool to look for better options.

That Duby example is perfect, the Wild looked internally saw they had a flaw and went out to try and fix it. The fact Duby has worked is where stats do help, but the stats helped the Wild identify their weakness.

God I wouldnt have gone to Duby, but they may have had scouts watching him for weeks and figured putting a team in front of him who actually controls the puck and reduces high quality shots will allow him to fill that hole.

That is what is so strange with Quick and the Kings, because their possession numbers are so great, when Quick falls apart it really hurts them. Same with Fleury and the Penguins, if either go through a rough patch (a sub .920 e/s sv%) then it gets highlighted because their team dominates but loses due to bad goals.
- walshy66

I agree with most of this except bold. Started out that way but now seems to be 100% stats or get out which is fine since its up to him to do it that way. Also it is sometimes neat to see these advanced stats. But main reason most regulars don't frequent as often (I presume is the reason because its reason I don't) is because the good ole game day blog no longer exist and the stupid "go find 1 of a million other sites that have generic game day blogs" saying is counterproductive.

On another note, LGP!

Lol no.


Just to give you an idea...

http://war-on-ice.com/pla...2015-02-19&splitseasons=0
- BINGO!

no more charts and graphs please. I can't take them anymore

I don't know how anyone can't view him as a major cap hit waste. I compared him to the current top 20 teams' 3Cs. Here's how he ranks:
Relative Corsi- dead last at 20th, Corsi%- 18th, pts./60- tied at 17th, salary- 14th.

Don't forgot, this is the BEST he has played for the Pens. He is gonna kill the team again in the postseason.
- jfkst1

If Staal would waive to come here and be 3rd C again, I wouldnt balk at his contract. Same way I wouldn't have balked at ROR coming here at his price. But both guys are in the 1% as far as likelihood of being traded here.

My heart wants to believe GMJR is smart enough to see the biggest bottom 6 issue is Sutter....but my brain is telling me JR has Sutter on his list of untouchables.

The only handies Bartley hands out are in the form of a fashwash...and trust me when I say his gloves DO NOT smell pleasant
- AmericanHabsFan

Killian?

If Staal would waive to come here and be 3rd C again, I wouldnt balk at his contract. Same way I wouldn't have balked at ROR coming here at his price. But both guys are in the 1% as far as likelihood of being traded here.

My heart wants to believe GMJR is smart enough to see the biggest bottom 6 issue is Sutter....but my brain is telling me JR has Sutter on his list of untouchables.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

I don't think Rutherford has him on the list of untouchables, but he also doesn't seem to be actively shopping him like he should be either. They should have shipped him first chance they got in the Perron trade. Moving the blackhole and his inflated salary out for anything would benefit the team at this point since there is an actual serviceable 3C on the roster still in Spaling. Rutherford will probably end up sending him out instead of Sutter.

random observation of the day:

I really wanted to see the infusion of youth and exuberance to the roster. At the beginning of the year, I felt that would be important. Just reflecting on how our youth is actually very mellow and poised. Guys like Pouliot, Maatta, Bennett, etc.

Point being, not having the same effect I thought it would with how CBJ had young players going balls to the wall last season. That's one area I think we're hurting. In addition to one or two Downie/Lap/Farnham types, we need one of those Jenner/Wilson/Lowry types.

no more charts and graphs please. I can't take them anymore
- willi

Point is that Faulk is only 22 years old and is excellent all around while not being sheltered at all.

He's not going anywhere. I would trade every other player on the team and in the system before Justin Faulk.

I don't think Rutherford has him on the list of untouchables, but he also doesn't seem to be actively shopping him like he should be either. They should have shipped him first chance they got in the Perron trade. Moving the blackhole and his inflated salary out for anything would benefit the team at this point since there is an actual serviceable 3C on the roster still in Spaling. Rutherford will probably end up sending him out instead of Sutter.
- jfkst1

Most of us said no to that at the time because Sutter was tricking us all at the time. Sutter's inconsistency is what really grinds my gears. We know he's capable of playing decent hockey...but long stretches of poor play drive me nuts. I can't figure out if it's lack of effort or lack of natural ability.

Most of us said no to that at the time because Sutter was tricking us all at the time. Sutter's inconsistency is what really grinds my gears. We know he's capable of playing decent hockey...but long stretches of poor play drive me nuts. I can't figure out if it's lack of effort or lack of natural ability.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

This is the best you are getting out of Sutter. Look into his stats and tell me you are optimistic he is going to play better. Compare him to playoff teams' 3Cs and similar salaried players. He is who he is; a famous last name 4th liner being masqueraded like he is a good 3C/marginal 2C.

If Staal would waive to come here and be 3rd C again, I wouldnt balk at his contract. Same way I wouldn't have balked at ROR coming here at his price. But both guys are in the 1% as far as likelihood of being traded here.

My heart wants to believe GMJR is smart enough to see the biggest bottom 6 issue is Sutter....but my brain is telling me JR has Sutter on his list of untouchables.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

I would. Jordan Staal as a third line center at 6 million per year for the next XXX years isn't worth it. When you have 35% of your cap invested in three players, adding a third line center making that much money is not smart at all. ROR say way. He would be a third line center making loads of cash and he is a UFA after next year. His negotiating tactics aren't anything Pittsburgh should have any interest in. I really don't get the logic behind wanting ROR or even Jordan Staal. With that, you are in worse shape and its not close.

I don't think Rutherford has him on the list of untouchables, but he also doesn't seem to be actively shopping him like he should be either. They should have shipped him first chance they got in the Perron trade. Moving the blackhole and his inflated salary out for anything would benefit the team at this point since there is an actual serviceable 3C on the roster still in Spaling. Rutherford will probably end up sending him out instead of Sutter.
- jfkst1

GMJR has already traded Sutter once before to acquire a guy in Staal that he was GOING TO GET regardless. So ... if something makes sense, Sutter is gone.

GMJR has already traded Sutter once before to acquire a guy in Staal that he was GOING TO GET regardless. So ... if something makes sense, Sutter is gone.
- Oneonta Penguin

A team interested in making the cap floor will probably be the only one interested in Sutter this summer.

GMJR has already traded Sutter once before to acquire a guy in Staal that he was GOING TO GET regardless. So ... if something makes sense, Sutter is gone.
- Oneonta Penguin

I don't think it was guaranteed he was going to Carolina. Pretty sure Shero could have traded Staal to NYR with Marc too. I know he said he wanted to play with one of his brothers, but I don't believe he specified which one. I also don't think that was a deal where Rutherford was actively shopping Sutter, but rather an opportunity when J.Staal made his intentions known and Shero needed a center for the roster.

I don't think it was guaranteed he was going to Carolina. Pretty sure Shero could have traded Staal to NYR with Marc too. I know he said he wanted to play with one of his brothers, but I don't believe he specified which one. I also don't think that was a deal where Rutherford was actively shopping Sutter, but rather an opportunity when J.Staal made his intentions known and Shero needed a center for the roster.
- jfkst1

Yeah, the Rags made an offer. I think Gaborik+.

I don't think it was guaranteed he was going to Carolina. Pretty sure Shero could have traded Staal to NYR with Marc too. I know he said he wanted to play with one of his brothers, but I don't believe he specified which one. I also don't think that was a deal where Rutherford was actively shopping Sutter, but rather an opportunity when J.Staal made his intentions known and Shero needed a center for the roster.
- jfkst1

He wanted to play with Eric in Carolina not Marc in NY. JR got nervous when Shero went to the Rags because there was a Staal there. That said, he wanted Carolina, not NY. Good chance the Rags fork over assets for one year of Jordan before he walked.

Downies awesome, I know more than you just accept it? I mean that's about all I can say. Don't need to look up stats and compare stanley cup winners when you know your right.
- Grinder47

Grinder. I heart you! You represent me! Armstrong IS awesome! Gibbons! Is awesome! Just cause! Mancrushes broseph! Let's lick some balls!

If we don't win the Cup this year or at very least get to the conference final, Geno is gone along with HCMJ and we rebuild. The time is now, there is no next 5 years.


We will never win anything with Sutter on this team end of story.



F Sutter

WWJJD
- nbartley9

So you think Geno is gone and we rebuild with Fleury as our goalie? The guy known in the Vegas sports books as "Creampuff" because he is so soft and can't outplay goalies on good teams? So your opinion is that we will never win anything with Sutter on this team and Geno being gone but we need to keep Fleury to win???

Oh i forgot MAF is Crosby's buddy and "is great in the locker room" whatever that means?

But don't worry we got four more years of this guy so let's see how many cups we win with this guy in goal.

Don't worry we can blame the defense being young, Crosby and Malkin not scoring, the fact that he's play too many games and is tired, Scudari, Opik, Martin, Sutter, his baby who keeps him up - when does this all stop and the Pens address the real problem?