Over an hour long, but anyone too young to have seen him play, or anyone old enough that wants to remember some great times, should watch this.



- canadianpenfan

Thanks canadianpenfan. I took this time to watch the video. Truly amazing. He's the greatest.

I wonder if there's a similar video for Gretzky. I'd love to compare both.

Funny thing is that when I went to live in Canada (97), Lemieux had just retired so I didn't get to watch him until he came back in 99. Jagr was always the guy I grew up watching. My idol. We need to get him back to this team before he retires.

When great players are mentioned in the NHL Oshie would not be even thought of. Not even close. Give me a break.
- acdc1206

I'd put him in the same tier as a guy like Hornqvist

Why a hard no on Neil from Ottawa?
- 87_71_11_29

Because all he does is create issues this team already has with Downie on the team.
He cannot handle the puck and this team is designed to keep the puck.

Sid and especially Geno can actually protect themselves, this team is going to be screwed if the officials stop calling penalties due to the 'human' element.

IF this team gets it's key players back and the puck possession does pick up to the numbers early in the season and the PPs do not increase then you can assume the officials are not wanting to 'effect' the result by giving the PPs.

Until then, the lack of skill on this team is going to make it harder for them to earn their PPs.

You want to find players like Klinkhammer who can be physical but still handle the puck. You protect your star players by legally being physical on their star players.

Because all he does is create issues this team already has with Downie on the team.
He cannot handle the puck and this team is designed to keep the puck.

Sid and especially Geno can actually protect themselves, this team is going to be screwed if the officials stop calling penalties due to the 'human' element.

IF this team gets it's key players back and the puck possession does pick up to the numbers early in the season and the PPs do not increase then you can assume the officials are not wanting to 'effect' the result by giving the PPs.

Until then, the lack of skill on this team is going to make it harder for them to earn their PPs.

You want to find players like Klinkhammer who can be physical but still handle the puck. You protect your star players by legally being physical on their star players.
- walshy66

Amen... more skilled young players that can play physical.. grit isn't alway needed when skill is not involved

I don't think we were heavily against Douglas Murray the player... just the cost it took to get him.

Scuds, yep nothing else to say on it... Kunitz I think is still fine for another year... the final year I think it will be iffy.
- Guile

Murray was acquired under the misconception the method to beat the Bruins was to try and match their physicality.

The problem with that is it took the Penguins away from the skill set that makes them a good team.

I'll give Shero credit here, he managed to compile that team exactly how Bylsma and himself thought they needed it to be to win, it was just the wrong formula.

The contracts are an issue for every GM, as Gunner has said before, do not overpay for average. There are always players that over perform and then ask for a bigger new contract.

Comeau will be a great example of that, if he asks for too much more than 1.1M he needs to walk next year, a replacement can be found for that cheap contract.

It can be tough to move on from players like that though, GM's are human, have ego's and also can become friendly with the players and not want to part with them.

The cold hard fact is from a GM's point of view these players are just assets that need to fill an on ice requirement under the cap.

This is from a guy who's favorite player is MAF and honestly thought the team would move on from him, and I think his 'likeability' in the room is what kept him in Pittsburgh.

I'll give Shero credit here, he managed to compile that team exactly how Bylsma and himself thought they needed it to be to win, it was just the wrong formula.

- walshy66

Support for all three trades was near unanimous here when they happened. Consensus was that the Penguins needed to complete with the Bruins and with WC teams. It just turned out that we were all wrong.

I'd put him in the same tier as a guy like Hornqvist
- rangerdanger94

would you expect the same increase in production if Oshie was moved to the Penguins.

I don't think anyone expected the increase in production from Hornqvist when he arrived in Pittsburgh.

Support for all three trades was near unanimous here when they happened. Consensus was that the Penguins needed to complete with the Bruins and with WC teams. It just turned out that we were all wrong.
- hardnosed

I think we can say now that playing to a teams strengths rather than changing the team to be something it is not doesn't work.

Penguins
Canucks
Capitals

All good examples of teams who tried to change 'style' away from the strengths of the core of those rosters.

The Canucks are a great example of going back to the strengths of the team. The twins looked cooked at the end of last season, they look 30 again now they can utilize their strengths.

would you expect the same increase in production if Oshie was moved to the Penguins.

I don't think anyone expected the increase in production from Hornqvist when he arrived in Pittsburgh.
- walshy66

I for one imagined it might be possible but you never really know.

My favorites as far as non-Pens includes Tim Kerr. Rick Tocchet before he came here and St Louis. I just thought for a smaller player, St Louis has some major skills. Scott Stevens always could get you going too with his hits.

Support for all three trades was near unanimous here when they happened. Consensus was that the Penguins needed to complete with the Bruins and with WC teams. It just turned out that we were all wrong.
- hardnosed

I didn't like the Morrow deal. Not because we lost J Morrow, but because B Morrow was toast in Dallas. He was demoted to the 4th line prior to coming here.

I fully supported the Iggy deal. I think people would feel differently about that deal had he been used correctly.

I think most thought the Murray deal was a pretty significant over-payment. I mean the guy was getting scratched in San Jose.

I didn't like the Morrow deal. Not because we lost J Morrow, but because B Morrow was toast in Dallas. He was demoted to the 4th line prior to coming here.

I fully supported the Iggy deal. I think people would feel differently about that deal had he been used correctly.

I think most thought the Murray deal was a pretty significant over-payment. I mean the guy was getting scratched in San Jose.
- madmike71

I was giddy, thinking Shero is crazy smart when it all went down. Morrow broke his kneecap, done. Murray was as slow as a paddle wheel river boat, bust. Bylsma had his head up his ass with Iggy, no go. I was confused at first and then realized signing free agents is not always the answer and more is definitely not always better.

Do we have any legitimate bangers in the pipeline who could be a legitimate bottom pairing defenseman in the near future? Ruopp, McNeill, Segalla, etc? Are they too far away from the NHL? Not good enough to be full time NHLers?

Just curious, dont know much about them.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Probably nobody better than Bortuzzo. I do like McNeill as kind of a long shot candidate, just hard to see him breaking through here.

Support for all three trades was near unanimous here when they happened. Consensus was that the Penguins needed to complete with the Bruins and with WC teams. It just turned out that we were all wrong.
- hardnosed

i dunno... most people were taken aback by the 2nd 2nd rounder. one was a stretch. iggy was a deal you make everytime. what was the third again?

nevermind.. some other poster reminder me. didnt mind the morrow deal either... j morrow was going nowhere as a pen and they upped a 5th rounder to a 3rd rounder. was that the third rounder that went with the tk 2nd rounder for jarry?

I still believe that they should have went with Morrow and Iginla as 4th liners, with Crosby and Malkin double shifting on that 4th line with them.

Bylsma won a championship in part because he double shifted Malkin and Crosby and Staal. It instantly changed the dynamic of matching up with them.

He never went back to that formula in subsequent playoffs.

would you expect the same increase in production if Oshie was moved to the Penguins.

I don't think anyone expected the increase in production from Hornqvist when he arrived in Pittsburgh.
- walshy66

I see him as a 25 goal scorer in Pittsburgh.

If he didn't have super over inflated value due to the Olympics, he'd be the perfect level of player to add as a winger. He and Perron are right in that perfect bracket for me in terms of talent. I don't think we need to sell the farm for one tier higher ( Evander Kane types).

What ever happened to ole' Magnus P. over there in St. Louis?

I didn't like the Morrow deal. Not because we lost J Morrow, but because B Morrow was toast in Dallas. He was demoted to the 4th line prior to coming here.

I fully supported the Iggy deal. I think people would feel differently about that deal had he been used correctly.

I think most thought the Murray deal was a pretty significant over-payment. I mean the guy was getting scratched in San Jose.
- madmike71

That's pretty much how I felt. Morrow was clearly in decline and trading a recent 1st rounder, even in an area of excess, was a big overpayment. Murray did exactly what he was brought in to do, add physicality and pk ability to the 3rd pair, but they traded assets that should have gotten them the top 4 guy they needed. Iginla, I make that trade every day at that price. But once the experiment at lw failed, they needed to find a better use for him, and he should have been on the top PP. The big problem was cumulatively the moves made us slower.

That's pretty much how I felt. Morrow was clearly in decline and trading a recent 1st rounder, even in an area of excess, was a big overpayment. Murray did exactly what he was brought in to do, add physicality and pk ability to the 3rd pair, but they traded assets that should have gotten them the top 4 guy they needed. Iginla, I make that trade every day at that price. But once the experiment at lw failed, they needed to find a better use for him, and he should have been on the top PP. The big problem was cumulatively the moves made us slower.
- Tojo.

At the very least, Iggy should have been given time on the first PP. Especially during the B's series. Guy is a HOF'r and still has that bomb. It was maddening watching him send out the same unit game after game with pitiful results.

Dan made one change on the PP. He replaced Letang with Martin in the 4th game. Second to last PP of the series for the Pens.

DK has done some interesting reporting on Dan's tenure towards the end. Some interesting and not so flattering insight.

I still believe that team was good enough to go further than it did.....sadly.

I still believe that they should have went with Morrow and Iginla as 4th liners, with Crosby and Malkin double shifting on that 4th line with them.

Bylsma won a championship in part because he double shifted Malkin and Crosby and Staal. It instantly changed the dynamic of matching up with them.

He never went back to that formula in subsequent playoffs.
- hardnosed

Bylsma made a few mistakes:

Morrow-Malkin-Neal line was clicking and he just took Morrow off without a good reason. That was a great line with Morrow crashing the net....

Kunitz-Crosby-IGINLA never came to fruition...he didn't even TRY this line. A no F'n brainer. How idiotic it was. Dupuis on the 3rd line would give us a whole new dimension and speed...

How about the PP.....take Iginla's shot OFF it....it was working..

I liked Murray and he wasn't responsible for anything wrong that went with this team. He did his job fairly well......his price was a bit high, that's it.


What could have been....thabks for F'n up everything, HCDB.

would you expect the same increase in production if Oshie was moved to the Penguins.

I don't think anyone expected the increase in production from Hornqvist when he arrived in Pittsburgh.
- walshy66

Hornqvist has slowed down considerably after his hot start. I think they'd have similar point totals.

With that said, I think they're different players. Horny is definitely the more clinical finisher. Oshie is an awesome player though...he's the type of player that will race down the wing with the puck, leave it to level the opposition with a monster hit, pick it back up, dangle a bit and then score.

Not every player has to be a PPG player or a name like Stamkos or Perry or Patty Kane to be considered a great NHL player....Oshie is a top 6 guy on every single team in the NHL and likely 1st line on the majority.

Bylsma made a few mistakes:

Morrow-Malkin-Neal line was clicking and he just took Morrow off without a good reason. That was a great line with Morrow crashing the net....

Kunitz-Crosby-IGINLA never came to fruition...he didn't even TRY this line. A no F'n brainer. How idiotic it was. Dupuis on the 3rd line would give us a whole new dimension and speed...

How about the PP.....take Iginla's shot OFF it....it was working..

I liked Murray and he wasn't responsible for anything wrong that went with this team. He did his job fairly well......his price was a bit high, that's it.


What could have been....thabks for F'n up everything, HCDB.
- Barnaby36

I agree with this. Shero's greatest folly could have been his greatest success just as easily. If we won the cup that year, Iginla could still be in a Pens sweater. Goddamn Disco and his refusal to put Crosby and Iggy together. I don't care if maybe it wasn't clicking in practice you gotta at least put it into a game situation and see what happens when it counts.

I agree with this. Shero's greatest folly could have been his greatest success just as easily. If we won the cup that year, Iginla could still be in a Pens sweater. Goddamn Disco and his refusal to put Crosby and Iggy together. I don't care if maybe it wasn't clicking in practice you gotta at least put it into a game situation and see what happens when it counts.
- Victoro311

I don't blame Bylsma for not moving Duper down. He scored 20 goals in a lockout-shortened season that year, and 14/87/9 was far and away the best line in hockey before Orpik rearranged Crosby's face. I totally understand (and supported) that move when it happened.

Same with Iggy on the left side. James Neal was at a 40 goal pace that year. Why mess with that by swapping him to the other side?

The only issue I had was not playing Iggy on the first PP.

I still blame it all on Crosby taking off the jaw protector.

Hornqvist has slowed down considerably after his hot start. I think they'd have similar point totals.

With that said, I think they're different players. Horny is definitely the more clinical finisher. Oshie is an awesome player though...he's the type of player that will race down the wing with the puck, leave it to level the opposition with a monster hit, pick it back up, dangle a bit and then score.

Not every player has to be a PPG player or a name like Stamkos or Perry or Patty Kane to be considered a great NHL player....Oshie is a top 6 guy on every single team in the NHL and likely 1st line on the majority.
- rangerdanger94

This is fair, they're in the same category. Good supporting guys almost every team is looking for to round out their top 6.

Which is why I'll believe Oshie is available, especially for an expiring contract or prospects, when I hear it from a more reliable source than TIOPS. Especially when Dreger just yesterday said reports of him being available were false.

Which is why I'll believe Oshie is available, especially for an expiring contract or prospects, when I hear it from a more reliable source than TIOPS. Especially when Dreger just yesterday said reports of him being available were false.
- Tojo.

[/thread]

I don't blame Bylsma for not moving Duper down. He scored 20 goals in a lockout-shortened season that year, and 14/87/9 was far and away the best line in hockey before Orpik rearranged Crosby's face. I totally understand (and supported) that move when it happened.

Same with Iggy on the left side. James Neal was at a 40 goal pace that year. Why mess with that by swapping him to the other side?

The only issue I had was not playing Iggy on the first PP.

I still blame it all on Crosby taking off the jaw protector.
- hardnosed

I knew it was coming. The old explanation for not taking Dupuis off Crosby's wing even though they sucked throughout most of the playoffs. They took Kunitz off Malkin's wing too even though 14-71-18 was the best line in hockey for a long stretch. You've got to maximize what you've Got on your roster and Iggy and Morrow were left out to dry. Why pay expensive assets to let them aside. POOR MNGMNT

I knew it was coming. The old explanation for not taking Dupuis off Crosby's wing even though they sucked throughout most of the playoffs.
- Barnaby36

Dupuis had 7 goals in the first two rounds of the playoffs. Crosby and Kunitz were also highly productive.