Probably I can't do chin ups either though.
- Yeti1181

So you must be a great hockey player then.

So you must be a great hockey player then.
- whipper334

it's the easiest schedule so we should ice an AHL D to lose winnable games?
- TheNugeIsHuge

I agree we should have Marincin on the team right now. Gives us the best chance of winning for sure.

But if you think Nurse deserves his 9 games. Which I, and most people do, the only way Nurse can get playing time is if Marincin isn't playing.

Purely guessing, but I imagine we see Klefbom and Hunt split the first two (Calgary & Van) and we see Nikita back by next Tuesday for LA. Marincin may as well stay in OKC until Nurses audition is over. By game ten or sooner depending how Nurse does we will have Marincin back.

This is asset (mis)management and an attempt to keep developing players in our system happy. Hunt played well (not as well as Marincin) in preseason and has to be given a legit chance every now and then in the NHL. Hunt can't just stay in the press box all year (no matter how much we would like that to happen). To a lesser extent Klefbom is in the same boat.

I really do not agree with it either but I think that is where Mac T is coming from and there is some amount of logic by doing so. Klefbom and Hunt need to be as prepared as possible for when, not if, we have more injuries.

A big gamble no matter how easy our schedule is but there really is no better time to try it.

I agree we should have Marincin on the team right now. Gives us the best chance of winning for sure.

But if you think Nurse deserves his 9 games. Which I, and most people do, the only way Nurse can get playing time is if Marincin isn't playing.

Purely guessing, but I imagine we see Klefbom and Hunt split the first two (Calgary & Van) and we see Nikita back by next Tuesday for LA. Marincin may as well stay in OKC until Nurses audition is over. By game ten or sooner depending how Nurse does we will have Marincin back.

This is asset (mis)management and an attempt to keep developing players in our system happy. Hunt played well (not as well as Marincin) in preseason and has to be given a legit chance every now and then in the NHL. Hunt can't just stay in the press box all year (no matter how much we would like that to happen). To a lesser extent Klefbom is in the same boat.

I really do not agree with it either but I think that is where Mac T is coming from and there is some amount of logic by doing so. Klefbom and Hunt need to be as prepared as possible for when, not if, we have more injuries.

A big gamble no matter how easy our schedule is but there really is no better time to try it.
- Aerchon

Or you could swap klefbom and marincin and have marincin (more proven in top 4 role) play and have klefbim down, while nurse plays soft comp in the bottom pair

Anyone see the Vid of Mackinnon racing the speed skater?



He won.

Or you could swap klefbom and marincin and have marincin (more proven in top 4 role) play and have klefbim down, while nurse plays soft comp in the bottom pair
- CrustyRooster

We don't really have a true bottom pair this year, much like we never have had a true top pair.

It will be defense by committee, and I imagine until Nikita is back Ferrence and Fayne will get the truly heavy lifting.

Again not disagreeing, this more like an attempt to tank than make the playoffs but it gives a couple prospects sheltered team match-ups to get their toes wet.

how can Klefbom and Marincin currently be on the same level in some minds? Marincin was playing top lines (again, most common opponents Getzlaf, Perry, D Sedin) and performing better than the rest of the club for over half a season. Klefbom played 17 games against softer competition and was at about the average team level.

If you're basing anything off of 6 pre season games then don't even bother responding
- TheNugeIsHuge

well i suppose the obvious retort to that would be; if you're solely basing your opinions on a young players previous half season and giving him carte blanche because of it; don't bother responding

well i suppose the obvious retort to that would be; if you're solely basing your opinions on a young players previous half season and giving him carte blanche because of it; don't bother responding
- hugefemale dog77

I'll take 45 games every single day of the week before I take 6 misjudged meaningless pre season games.

I wasn't much into the media/internet scene of hockey at the beginning of 2011/2012. Wonder what people thought of Petry getting a couple games in OKC

I'll take 45 games every single day of the week before I take 6 misjudged meaningless pre season games.
- TheNugeIsHuge

well you're certainly entitled to your opinion on what's more important.

but as far as the misjudged part; id assume mact doesn't agree with your assessment

Not a real stat sorry...
- The_Hinter

It's ok, Hendo saw him good

you cant measure everything. But you can measure indicators....indicators of positive outcomes. Nothing that's measured anywhere in the world is done by measuring all influential components of the event process. You use statistics to find indicators that seem to be related to a positive outcome, even though we may not know why it happens like that or are able to explain any part of it. Science works that way, medicine works that way. We don't always know why, or the exact mechanics of why something happens, we just know it IS, and it DOES, and that we can use it for reliable prediction of the future. Waiting for every part of that relationship to be completely explored and explained before acting on a positive predictive trend will hinder progress. This is what is happening with corsi and a lot of other advanced stats. Its an indicator of positive outcome, saddled with a large black box. We don't know what's going on in there, but we know its generally accurate, so why do we care about whats in that black box? Sure work on figuring out what in there, but don't wait for those things to be sorted out before you use it. If it proved to be significantly predictive, use it! Should we spend 20 years collecting better data to explain all the reasons why it works first? Or should we just spend those 20 years using it to pick better players.


In a randomized controlled trial of a drug, if unexpected positive or negative outcomes occur that are proven to be real, the trial is immediately stopped or changed even if determinants of these outcomes remain unknown. If science and medicine can do this, why cant hockey. I literally cannot understand this.
- gravis1982

That's an interesting theory on how science works. Thankfully it's not true. If it were, a lot more bridges and highrises would fall down, a lot more foods would be extremely poisonous and a lot more children's toys would spontaneously explode.

Proper analysis needs proper data. The depth and breadth and weighting of those results in where the magic or garbage will come from. Looking at limited information will bring limited results at best.

edit- to be fair, a lot of medical science works in less than accurate numbers. Until recently, even the best supercomputer was unable to model all of the changes that occur when a drug interacts with a human body. I can't think of any other science that actually does this.

Anyone see the Vid of Mackinnon racing the speed skater?



He won.
- robin_steele264

It was just the first few steps. Still impressive none the less

I'll take 45 games every single day of the week before I take 6 misjudged meaningless pre season games.
- TheNugeIsHuge

Based off of this argument a rookie would never crack a line up. I know that's not your point but I'm sure that the coaches and management saw something in all the practices and behind the scenes stuff that we didn't see. They probably based their decision on more than 6 preseason games.

Just cause the Fames suck and your HB threads are boring is no reason to bring yer derp in here flags.

Looking forward to watching the Oil (and everyone else) beat 'em down all year.

well you're certainly entitled to your opinion on what's more important.

but as far as the misjudged part; id assume mact doesn't agree with your assessment
- hugefemale dog77

as I'm sure Tambo disagreed with people complaining about his misjudgments

as I'm sure Tambo disagreed with people complaining about his misjudgments
- TheNugeIsHuge

im sure he did.

Anyone see the Vid of Mackinnon racing the speed skater?



He won.
- robin_steele264

Bust

A GOOD statistician will acknowledge the fact that their analysis is subject to misinterpretation. They will also admit that their analysis is only as good as the data that they have to work with.

Far too many analytics supporters want to use only the information readily available at their fingertips, ignoring an extremely large number of unanswered questions and then come to absolute conclusions.

So many things that affect each play are never accounted for. THAT is the shortcoming of analytics. Ice degradation, player injuries during game, muscle fatigue, mental issues and hundreds of other things will make a difference on every single play. None of these things are currently accounted for by analytics.

Analytics experts need FAR more quantifiable data if they want to claim accurate results. I'm not talking about basic mathematic facts, I'm talking about true analysis. Until analysts can actually gather more information to build an accurate picture, perhaps they should stop trying to claim that they can tell the rest of us the future.
- sportsjunkie007

fantastic post

Anyone see the Vid of Mackinnon racing the speed skater?



He won.
- robin_steele264

Link?

Edit:nvm

All i can see is that you are complaining about unquantifiable variables.

As for the bad ice, yes, i understand what you are getting at, but bad ice effects all the players.
- ChetManly

The ice was simply one thing that I chose to focus on, assuming that most people would be able to recognize it's effect on the game.

Bad ice DOES affect all of the players, but not in the same way. Late in the period it is easier to defend. That's because forwards can't do toe-drags and other fun moves at the same speed as they could earlier. The snow on the ice slows the puck down, making it easier for defensemen to check the attacker. This is just one way that the quality of the ice will change how the game is played.

Ever see a player lose the puck during a shootout attempt? Bad ice. Ever see a goalie catch an edge during a shootout, falling at an inopportune moment? Bad ice.

Ice is just one of a LOT of measurable things that have a large influence on the outcome of every single play. Even just measuring a few more influences like ice quality would go a long way to making analytics results far more accurate.

I'm not satisfied with half-assed results. I don't care if it's an Oilers game or the analysis of that very game. Better results should be something that we all want to see more of.

Where the crap have you been!!! I've been worried sick.
- whipper334

Back in school, and it is good for my mental and physical health to take periodic breaks from HB.

It was just the first few steps. Still impressive none the less
- CrustyRooster

His first few strides are about as good as it gets in hockey...

and first 3 strides are whats most important in the NHL

His first few strides are about as good as it gets in hockey...

and first 3 strides are whats most important in the NHL
- robin_steele264

No I'm not saying that, but it is a little misleading to say Mackinnon beat Charles Hamelin in a race haha. If its 100 meters or the size of a rink it probably goes the other way

No I'm not saying that, but it is a little misleading to say Mackinnon beat Charles Hamelin in a race haha. If its 100 meters or the size of a rink it probably goes the other way
- CrustyRooster

He beat him in a blueline to blueline sprint... about the only hope a hockey player would have vs. a speedskater.


Impressive still