Travis Yost: Three-Year RelativeCorsi% Fun

Whats that mean about Polak?

Whats that mean about Polak?
- jake24242

He wasn't getting favorable possession in St. Louis. However, Hitch did use him in a slightly larger defensive role. But he wasn't playing really 'tough' competition, either.

He's an OK defender. Probably a third-pairing guy.

and again, Parenteau's pretty good at hockey.
- Travis Yost

There's a reason they were traded one for one... they both suck. Montréal has to deal with the extra year of suckage.

There's a reason they were traded one for one... they both suck. Montréal has to deal with the extra year of suckage.
- TimBits

I don't think Parenteau sucks, or is anywhere close to 'sucks'...

Whats that mean about Polak?
- jake24242

Means he's bad at hockey.

I dont get how Polak and Orpik are looked at as shutdown guys. At least AMAC puts up a little offense to go along with his crap corsi rel.

The team effect though is still evident. Seguin leaves Boston and his numbers tumble.

Means he's bad at hockey.

I dont get how Polak and Orpik are looked at as shutdown guys. At least AMAC puts up a little offense to go along with his crap corsi rel.

The team effect though is still evident. Seguin leaves Boston and his numbers tumble.
- Iggysbff

There are contributing factors here. Namely, Dallas' depth was decent last year, but Boston's fourth-line was just getting absolutely caved in (and, additionally, their first-line dominating).

I think the key for guys across multiple teams is to establish positive numbers YtY. There's always going to be fluctuation, like you noted. You don't want to swing wildly down though and stay there, especially YtY. That's when the concern begins.

He wasn't getting favorable possession in St. Louis. However, Hitch did use him in a slightly larger defensive role. But he wasn't playing really 'tough' competition, either.

He's an OK defender. Probably a third-pairing guy.
- Travis Yost

so what you are basically saying is that he is a first pairing guy in Toronto !

so what you are basically saying is that he is a first pairing guy in Toronto !
- Adam_The_Golf

Phaneuf and Polak?

He wasn't getting favorable possession in St. Louis. However, Hitch did use him in a slightly larger defensive role. But he wasn't playing really 'tough' competition, either.

He's an OK defender. Probably a third-pairing guy.
- Travis Yost

I agree. I've seen him play many times and he is a quiet steady D (if you don't notice him he does his job). He is tougher than gunnar, however, not a feared Dman - will fight maybe 2x a year. Leaf fans are claiming he is an upgrade over the terrrible gunnar (who had a good year 17 pts +14 in a purely defensive role). After 20 games or so and leaf fans actually see Polak, it will be interesting to see the comments. Lateral move at best for the leafs.

Phaneuf and Polak?
- spatso

how many polaks does it take to be Phaneufs D partner?

Means he's bad at hockey.

I dont get how Polak and Orpik are looked at as shutdown guys. At least AMAC puts up a little offense to go along with his crap corsi rel.

The team effect though is still evident. Seguin leaves Boston and his numbers tumble.
- Iggysbff

If you dont know how Orpik and Polak are not shut down guys please just stop posting your opinion is flawed.

If you dont know how Orpik and Polak are not shut down guys please just stop posting your opinion is flawed.
- jake24242

Do I have to school you yet again sonny? Dont you get sick of me making you look stupid?

Do I have to school you yet again sonny? Dont you get sick of me making you look stupid?
- Iggysbff

Oh snap

Hey Travis, just wondering if you might have the numbers on pacioretty. Curious how he stacks up to some of the elite shooters. He finished 10th in shots this season, had a decent S%. Personally i think he'll be a highly counted on for scoring come next olympics for the USA. That said he doesnt get much attention for his scoring prowess it seems.

Is this stat 5 on 5 based only?

It's hard to look at one advanced stat alone and make a conclusion. There is value in Corsi/Fenwick but it has severe limitations.

There is still consistency and value in this evaluation as the players are being compared on that same single stat and also its broken down, it seems to compare similar players as far as ice time and roles so there is consistency.

For a stat like this you really need to consider zone starts, TOI and volume of shots.

I take issue with any Corsi/Fenwick stats because it also doesn't take into consideration quality of shots. I could fire 100 pucks towards the net from centre ice and score 0 times. Great for Corsi, not so great for offense.

Great article regardless Yost. I will continue reading.

Hey Travis, just wondering if you might have the numbers on pacioretty. Curious how he stacks up to some of the elite shooters. He finished 10th in shots this season, had a decent S%. Personally i think he'll be a highly counted on for scoring come next olympics for the USA. That said he doesnt get much attention for his scoring prowess it seems.
- munky123

5.20% 11.10% 7.40%

Crazy good. Subban and lack of productive F depth spikes those numbers higher, but he's still great.

5.20% 11.10% 7.40%

Crazy good. Subban and lack of productive F depth spikes those numbers higher, but he's still great.
- Travis Yost

So with Dellow being the latest scooped up are you lobbying for a job with the Sens???

E.Staal and Semin work great together. Unfortunately they've been saddled with some poor luck/bad linemates at times, but I think using J.Staal (who also has a +Corsi) as a center between the two could make one monster of a line.

And, again, even at 35 -- how many centers in the league are you taking over him right now? There are a few. But that's it. A few.
- Travis Yost

Sidney Crosby
Evgeni Malkin
Jonathan Toews
Anze Kopitar
Jeff Carter
Steven Stamkos
Ryan Getzlaf
Ryan Kesler
Claude Giroux
Matt Duchene
John Tavares
Tyler Seguin
Eric Staal
Ryan O'Reilly
Nathan MacKinnon
David Krejci
Patrice Bergeron
Ryan Nugent-Hopkins
Henrik Sedin
Pavel Datsyuk
David Backes
Paul Stastny
Nicklas Backstrom

Does that qualify as "a few"?

Sidney Crosby
Evgeni Malkin
Jonathan Toews
Anze Kopitar
Jeff Carter
Steven Stamkos
Ryan Getzlaf
Ryan Kesler
Claude Giroux
Matt Duchene
John Tavares
Tyler Seguin
Eric Staal
Ryan O'Reilly
Nathan MacKinnon
David Krejci
Patrice Bergeron
Ryan Nugent-Hopkins
Henrik Sedin
Pavel Datsyuk
David Backes
Paul Stastny
Niklas Backstrom

Does that qualify as "a few"?
- tkecanuck341

You forgot Bozak

You forgot Bozak
- Pea-Brain

No, I didn't.

Sidney Crosby
Evgeni Malkin
Jonathan Toews
Anze Kopitar
Jeff Carter
Steven Stamkos
Ryan Getzlaf
Ryan Kesler
Claude Giroux
Matt Duchene
John Tavares
Tyler Seguin
Eric Staal
Ryan O'Reilly
Nathan MacKinnon
David Krejci
Patrice Bergeron
Ryan Nugent-Hopkins
Henrik Sedin
Pavel Datsyuk
David Backes
Paul Stastny
Nicklas Backstrom

Does that qualify as "a few"?
- tkecanuck341

I'd be curious as to why. Yost seemed like he was talking about present day and not factoring in age/contract and what not. If this is a purely skill-based assessment, I think it's hard to argue that any of those bold names (as well as a few others) are better than Joe.

I'd be curious as to why. Yost seemed like he was talking about present day and not factoring in age/contract and what not. If this is a purely skill-based assessment, I think it's hard to argue that any of those bold names (as well as a few others) are better than Joe.
- MaximumBone

It's also a matter of the type of player they are. E.Staal is more of a "Score off the rush, shoot first" center like Jeff Carter as opposed to a patient playmaker like Thornton. Context is important.

Sidney Crosby
Evgeni Malkin
Jonathan Toews
Anze Kopitar
Steven Stamkos
Claude Giroux
John Tavares
Tyler Seguin
Patrice Bergeron
Pavel Datsyuk
Nicklas Backstrom

Does that qualify as "a few"?
- tkecanuck341

The list looks more like this to me, if we're talking about guys I want centring my first line in 2014-15 and I'm trying to win a Cup.

Obviously a lot of your other names come back onto the list if we're looking 3-4 years down the road, but Jumbo Joe is still a top centre, and you're putting a lot of guys who are definitely worse than him on your list.