What I'm trying to understand is if Kevin Hayes is essentially giving a team a 2nd rd. pick. Let's say you throw in Hayes to Fla and Hayes does not sign with Florida. Does Florida receive the 2nd rd. pick? Do the Hawks? Does no one get a pick if he's traded and still unsigned? If Florida gets the 2nd rd. pick, then he definitely has trade value cause a team gets a 2nd rd. pick for acquiring his rights and not signing him. Does that make sense?
- coldsteelonice

I don't think you can trade compensation....That's what it is because the Hawks have had his rights for 4 years.

I am not 100% certain but I'm thinking the rights can be traded but not sure about the compensation. If so it would be wise to deal him if there is a good chance he isn't signing.

Assuming about $7MM each year - probably a little on the high side.
- StLBravesFan

No one knows what will happen for the '15-'16 season. Planning for a $7M increase a season after this is not smart budget management.

Did I miss the announcement that they have finally set the cap ceiling for next season? Is it changing or is it staying at $71.1 million?
- EKolb13

No announcement yet, but plenty of talk of it creeping back toward the 71.1 number. Probably slightly less. Mirtle suggested 70.5 or something like that, with a similar increase next year. Brisson and Bowman have a much better idea where the cap is going than do the rest of us.

If my calculations are correct and I believe they are. Given a $71 million cap for next year, if the Hawks were able to move Bickell, Versteeg and Rozsival, keep TT, give a raise to Raanta ($2 mill)and Smith ($1.25 mill) they could bring in Kessler's $5 million contract, at least for next year.

That seems a bit much, but A) real estate prices out this way are stupid, and B) St. Louis is an arm pit.

I would venture to guess that housing prices are 2-3x more expensive in CA than St. Louis. LA is cheaper than SF, and I would say SF is at least 2x as expensive as something comparable in Chicago

The real estate market up where DarthKane is presently located is absolutely reeedonkulous. So many foreign investors coming over and dropping cash, at 10-20% over asking price for a place.
- eburgio

I would imagine a comparable home in LA may be 2 or or even 3 times that in St. Louis but all other costs would be relatively close.

Toews and Kane are both asking for $12 million a piece.

It's $10,000,000.

10MM.

TEN MILLION DOLLARS.

How many business executives, movie stars, recording artists, sports franchise owners ever willingly give up $10MM.

Only the athletes get blasted for asking for top value.
- StLBravesFan

Is there a salary cap for those businesses? No. Apples and oranges. Give and take. Both sides. I hope for sub-$10M each. But speaking so as a fan only. I do not begrudge them for pushing the envelope. On the other side of the fence, SB has a budget. A budget movie stars are not remotely faced with in their contracts.

Please go to Capgeek.com. We have 10 players signed for 50 MM, even if the cap is set to 80 MM next year, we'll have 12 players signed for 70 MM.

This is for 2015-16.
- Madkymike

That's salary. Not cap hit.

No one knows what will happen for the '15-'16 season. Planning for a $7M increase a season after this is not smart budget management.
- blackhawk24

If you don't have the facts that they have, you're right. They have a decent idea about next season's revenues by now (TV contracts, season tickets sold, ticket price increases, etc., are known for this season for the most part). They are not guessing, although the number can float a bit.

If you think paying Bick $4m is too much, how can you defend versteeg at $2.2m? thats not a deal - the guy is terrible. If one of the rockford kids can't replace versteeg, then the farm system is in big trouble
- dpard

At 2.2 million for Versteeg he is cheaper then what he was in 2009-10. So yeah, it's a very good deal and no he isn't TERRIBLE. I'll eat MAJOR Crow if he sucks this year, but I am willing to be $$ he wont'.

We'll see like Versteeg, what Bickell does this upcoming year because he sucked big time in the regular season and was a ghost against LA.

I think both of those guys are due for bounce back years. I just don't like Bickell's contract, just like I never liked Bolland's BS deal he got.

Bill Murray is also 50+ years old and doesn't get hit in the head by 250 pound linebackers on skates.

I don't argue with what you're saying, but the problem is that the Union won't let them take marginal increases over where they are today. The Union NEEDS the twins to take big deals, like SteveRain said, so guys like Bolland and Vern Fiddler and Tomas Kopecky get paid.
- eburgio

The same Union that will allow a Torres or Cooke or Bertuzzi to nearly KILL it's high priced prizes on the ice. F the damn union!

It's Bowman job to figure out a way to build this team around these 2 guys. Not yours. Not mine. Does this hurt things...Sure, but then again maybe you shouldn't be paying a guy like Bryan Bickell 4 million a year? This is why I caution all this Kruger love. If that guy wants a LOT of money for what he is actually worth, he will be replaced just like Bolland was.

That is also why a guy like Versteeg is NOT being traded. They need huge return on low salary guys. So as much as a clown like Zawaski wants to build up a mob to go burn and pillage Kris Verseeg, it isn't happening.


- SteveRain

As much as I believe that he is and will continue to be a solid (not great) goalie and good locker room guy, I would add Crow to this list.

My point is, a $70 mil deal would put them both at $110 mil career earnings at the end of the new deal, and thats just salary/bonuses from playing hockey, not counting other stuff

At what point do you say, Ive already made $80 mil or whatever and I dont really need the extra $10 mil

I work in advertising and we were negotiating with Bill Murray to be an endorser of one of our events, and his agent said, "he just wants to find work he's interested in, he doesnt care about money, he's already made enough money in his life"
- FourFeathers773

I love Bill Murray but he's near the end of his career. These guys are not quite at their prime. I get your point. I truly do. And I get the other guy's, SBF specifically too. Give and take. Give and take. We .... shall .... see.

Ill put it this way.

Patrice Bergeron just signed an 8 year deal at 6.5 per that starts this season. Toews and Kane's contract will kick in the following year.

Based off 1 year difference and their play, is Toews and Kane both really $4 million better players than Bergeron?

I say no. $3 mil? Sure, ill concede that. But its just pushing it too much for me at $10+

I get what you guys are all saying about the cap and NHLPA and stuff

but for them to come out and say theyd like to stay and be hawks forever and what not leads you to believe they are going to give the hawks a fair deal. $10+ is not a fair deal to the Hawks, its a fair deal to the NHLPA

From a cap hit, it's really the difference between a 39% raise and a 59% raise.

There's give and take on both sides.

I'd like to believe they're thinking something along the lines - though not identical - to how the NFL Pats managed player contracts.

Guess we'll see, eh?
- blackhawk24

Agreed and if Bowman gets them under 10 million a piece he wins.

I think we are all missing a big point here....

if the guys each get 11m that means.....

STAN WILL BE FORCED TO MOVE SOME BODIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


isn't that what we all were hoping for?
- ChicagoDave

Not by that means .... Not one single bit.

The same Union that will allow a Torres or Cooke or Bertuzzi to nearly KILL it's high priced prizes on the ice. F the damn union!
- powerenforcer

If it wasn't for the 'damn union' Toews and Kane would be getting Blackhawk jackets as signing bonuses which they could wear to their off season jobs so they could support their families.

Ill put it this way.

Patrice Bergeron just signed an 8 year deal at 6.5 per that starts this season. Toews and Kane's contract will kick in the following year.

Based off 1 year difference and their play, is Toews and Kane both really $4 million better players than Bergeron?

I say no. $3 mil? Sure, ill concede that. But its just pushing it too much for me at $10+

I get what you guys are all saying about the cap and NHLPA and stuff

but for them to come out and say theyd like to stay and be hawks forever and what not leads you to believe they are going to give the hawks a fair deal. $10+ is not a fair deal to the Hawks, its a fair deal to the NHLPA
- FourFeathers773

Fair enough....19/88 are THE Deals for this CBA. I think everyone knew it from both sides, and the whole league is monitoring it very closely. Sets the parameters.

They will be bargains in 2 to 3 years. I promise you that.

No announcement yet, but plenty of talk of it creeping back toward the 71.1 number. Probably slightly less. Mirtle suggested 70.5 or something like that, with a similar increase next year. Brisson and Bowman have a much better idea where the cap is going than do the rest of us.
- mohel

Exactly. If it goes up another $5-6-7 mil for 2015 to $76-78 mil. That's great. If it only goes up $2 mil or so, like it had a few of the years before the last CBA, that really kills us. If Kane and Toews sign for $10 mil each, that's almost $8 mil total in new salary for 2015. That doesn't even include the other space needed for raises for Saad, etc. Someone, more like someone(s) will have to go. That's why it's not a bad idea to at least get Sharp's trade value this off-season and see if there's a good deal to move him now, since he or Seabrook almost certainly have to go in a year if the cap doesn't take a huge jump again.

Please go to Capgeek.com. We have 10 players signed for 50 MM, even if the cap is set to 80 MM next year, we'll have 12 players signed for 70 MM.

This is for 2015-16.
- Madkymike

That's salary. Not cap hit.
- tcmoritz

Not sure what you mean, the new CBA outlawed the type of contracts your thinking of. I'm assuming that they will make 10AAV, so 8 years for 80 MM in total.

Reguarding Sharp, I saw him at the game last night, what we forget is he really likes it in Chicago, he has a family, is established here. More than that he is loved by most of the fans and is one of the "faces" of the new Hawks. Marketing disaster should they move or try to move him. Why on earth would he agree to leave to a non-contender? Players are people with the same family and life issues we all have. It is all about keeping things as stable as possible and for him/us winning is important.

Reguarding Sharp, I saw him at the game last night, what we forget is he really likes it in Chicago, he has a family, is established here. More than that he is loved by most of the fans and is one of the "faces" of the new Hawks. Marketing disaster should they move or try to move him. Why on earth would he agree to leave to a non-contender? Players are people with the same family and life issues we all have. It is all about keeping things as stable as possible and for him/us winning is important.
- Cup-Bearer

You see him at the yame with Campbell ?? Lured to Florida my friend......

I wouldn't worry about the Kane and Toews contract situation, Stan will do the right thing and pay them whatever it takes to keep them. I don't care if it's $8.5 million, $10 million, or $12 million per season.

Stan has to deal with the hand he's been dealt. The Blackhawks have two of the best players in the game and they've help turn this franchise around and bring us 2 Cups since 2010. Kane and Toews deserve every cent.

Realistically Stan has two options:

1. Give Kane and Toews what they want and move other players to remain cap compliant if necessary; or

2. Sign one of Kane or Toews and trade the other.

In my opinion there is no choice, Stan has to go with option #1. Even if Stan signs them for $12 million it's not like the deal is going be a killer for all 8 years. Maybe it hurts for the first couple of years, but that its. Next year they are still making $6.3 million, so the first year of their new contract the cap will likely be around $75 million (or so it's been estiamted).

Staring at capgeek.com for 2015-16

Your committed cap number say 19/88 is at 49.5.....if the cap is at 75...that leaves you....

25.5 to:

sign a back up goalie
Sign Kruger
Sign Saad
Sign 3 d men....either Oduya/Leddy and bring up kids
Sign Morin/Smith this year..if they choose to.

Point is you only have 10 guys on the books and need at least 11, probably 12 to fill out this roster.

So again...some big names have to go, and sooner or later some of these KIDS have to prove their weight in results.

So yeah.....I would consider this cap hell.....because I cant' see them walking away from Smith/Morin or Raanta or giving any of them just 1 yr deals...So odds are you will really only have about 20 million to sign 8 to 9 guys, and I can't see them letting Oduya AND leddy both leave. One will still be there.

Ill put it this way.

Patrice Bergeron just signed an 8 year deal at 6.5 per that starts this season. Toews and Kane's contract will kick in the following year.

Based off 1 year difference and their play, is Toews and Kane both really $4 million better players than Bergeron?

I say no. $3 mil? Sure, ill concede that. But its just pushing it too much for me at $10+

I get what you guys are all saying about the cap and NHLPA and stuff

but for them to come out and say theyd like to stay and be hawks forever and what not leads you to believe they are going to give the hawks a fair deal. $10+ is not a fair deal to the Hawks, its a fair deal to the NHLPA
- FourFeathers773

I have a better morefair way to compare. Take the player you want to compare, determine what percentage of the cap his salary is, AT THE TIME OF SIGNING. Then determine the percentage of Kane and Toews salary to the cap, AT THEIR TIME OF SIGNING.

If at that point Kane and Toews make a higher percentage of their respective salary caps, you have an argument.