honesthockey
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Click heels twice and 1c appears. Joined: 09.23.2008
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I will counter that....... Kessel pre RC days was useless defensively. He was known mainly as a sniper, period. Under RC he started playing all 200' of the ice, and became a playmaker.
RC has his faults, but don't think Trotz would have more sucess with this group of defenseman. Aside from Phaneuf and Rielly, you can cast the rest of them out to sea, and they'd all sink. - faceto27
Spot on!!
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ThePresident
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: NY Joined: 12.08.2010
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Thats exactly the point i'm making. You are blaming RC, and that Trotz is going to make this better with the mediocre talent it has.
Trotz, not only had Weber, but he had some stiff named Suter there. He also had a world class goalie.
Bottom line, he had his ass handed to him in the playoffs. - faceto27
What is your point? I'm not blaming RC, but obviously....RC can't do much unless he has 2 Hall of Famer defenders on his back end. Trotz brought those guys along from when they were just getting into the league. He developed them correctly. Would it not be the perfect scenario for guys such as Rielly, Gardiner, Bernier, Kadri, etc....as well as our prospects. My point is, he actually brings the Predators youth along and turns them into full time NHLers. Randy Carlyle cannot do that correctly. |
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Flyfreaky
Philadelphia Flyers |
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Joined: 07.20.2011
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I'm odd? That's hilarious, you were the one posting pics of 14 year sluts wearing spandex claiming that those were pics of Weirdoh. So I think you should be claimed the King Of Odd in this thread. C'mon buddy, those pics were of underage girls. - GCHonda
gross |
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honesthockey
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Click heels twice and 1c appears. Joined: 09.23.2008
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What is your point? I'm not blaming RC, but obviously....RC can't do much unless he has 2 Hall of Famer defenders on his back end. Trotz brought those guys along from when they were just getting into the league. He developed them correctly. Would it not be the perfect scenario for guys such as Rielly, Gardiner, Bernier, Kadri, etc....as well as our prospects. My point is, he actually brings the Predators youth along and turns them into full time NHLers. Randy Carlyle cannot do that correctly. - ThePresident
Not sure how you can say this. |
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nbboy
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Joined: 07.05.2010
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I'm odd? That's hilarious, you were the one posting pics of 14 year sluts wearing spandex claiming that those were pics of Weirdoh. So I think you should be claimed the King Of Odd in this thread. C'mon buddy, those pics were of underage girls. - GCHonda
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nbboy
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Joined: 07.05.2010
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gross - Flyfreaky
You like it |
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Flyfreaky
Philadelphia Flyers |
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Joined: 07.20.2011
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You like it - nbboy
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faceto27
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Location: Burke: Best part of today is I Joined: 01.21.2010
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What is your point? I'm not blaming RC, but obviously....RC can't do much unless he has 2 Hall of Famer defenders on his back end. Trotz brought those guys along from when they were just getting into the league. He developed them correctly. Would it not be the perfect scenario for guys such as Rielly, Gardiner, Bernier, Kadri, etc....as well as our prospects. My point is, he actually brings the Predators youth along and turns them into full time NHLers. Randy Carlyle cannot do that correctly. - ThePresident
Name me one forward that Trotz developed into a legitimate top 6 forward??
I think its more of, he was fortuante to have had Weber and Suter, and with those two future HoF'ers, he couldn't have any sucess in the playoffs. At least Randy won the Cup with his two HoF'ers. |
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ThePresident
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: NY Joined: 12.08.2010
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Not sure how you can say this. - honesthockey
What young player has flourished under him? |
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Flyfreaky
Philadelphia Flyers |
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Joined: 07.20.2011
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Name me one forward that Trotz developed into a legitimate top 6 forward??
I think its more of, he was fortuante to have had Weber and Suter, and with those two future HoF'ers, he couldn't have any sucess in the playoffs. At least Randy won the Cup with his two HoF'ers. - faceto27
i would fire nonis, rc and revamp the scouting and internal staff |
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faceto27
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Location: Burke: Best part of today is I Joined: 01.21.2010
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What young player has flourished under him? - ThePresident
Ryan Getzlaf....... Corey Perry |
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GCHonda
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: MABIE NEXT YEAR!!!!!!! , ON Joined: 07.03.2010
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Thats exactly the point i'm making. You are blaming RC, and that Trotz is going to make this better with the mediocre talent it has.
Trotz, not only had Weber, but he had some stiff named Suter there. He also had a world class goalie.
Bottom line, he had his ass handed to him in the playoffs. - faceto27
I didn't realize, the Preds got 100 points four times under Trotz. Not bad considering they never had a Kessel/JVR combo. Leafs presently have a better offense than Nash. Offense is not the problem for the Leafs. If Trotz can teach the Leafs how to play better defense, along with their offense, the Leafs could be awesome. |
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faceto27
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Location: Burke: Best part of today is I Joined: 01.21.2010
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i would fire nonis, rc and revamp the scouting and internal staff - Flyfreaky
I'm not sure, i'm not ready to go to that extreme yet. I still need to see how the draft picks from the Burke/Nonis era pan out. We should start seeing them in the next two years. |
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Viktory
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Location: Hamilton, ON Joined: 08.12.2011
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Name me one forward that Trotz developed into a legitimate top 6 forward??
I think its more of, he was fortuante to have had Weber and Suter, and with those two future HoF'ers, he couldn't have any sucess in the playoffs. At least Randy won the Cup with his two HoF'ers. - faceto27
Patrick Hornqvist, Scott Hartnell, Nick Spaling is up there now, Wilson, Craig Smith, but realistically, they've developed far more defensemen and brought it in forwards from outside. |
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faceto27
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Location: Burke: Best part of today is I Joined: 01.21.2010
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I didn't realize, the Preds got 100 points four times under Trotz. Not bad considering they never had a Kessel/JVR combo. Leafs presently have a better offense than Nash. Offense is not the problem for the Leafs. If Trotz can teach the Leafs how to play better defense, along with their offense, the Leafs could be awesome. - GCHonda
Ahhhhhhh yes....... JVR. Another forward that flourished under RC. |
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Flyfreaky
Philadelphia Flyers |
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Joined: 07.20.2011
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Ryan Getzlaf....... Corey Perry - faceto27
dustin penner, chad kilger
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lumlums
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: ON Joined: 06.25.2011
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Shanahan was Carlyles roommate at one point. Not sure he'd hang him out to dry. If he deems Carlyle is the problem and must go then he should have done it. - honesthockey
Again, I don't think he's gonna storm onto the job and start dropping the axe. I think there'll be discussions with Carlyle and with management to figure out their vision, see if it matches, and see if it can work.
I'm just not that patient |
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Flyfreaky
Philadelphia Flyers |
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Joined: 07.20.2011
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I'm not sure, i'm not ready to go to that extreme yet. I still need to see how the draft picks from the Burke/Nonis era pan out. We should start seeing them in the next two years. - faceto27
nonis seems to be the type of gm that sets the team during the off season and then rides it out until the next off season
not a good way to run a team |
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honesthockey
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Click heels twice and 1c appears. Joined: 09.23.2008
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Ryan Getzlaf....... Corey Perry - faceto27
Even Cam Fowler
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ThePresident
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: NY Joined: 12.08.2010
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Name me one forward that Trotz developed into a legitimate top 6 forward??
I think its more of, he was fortuante to have had Weber and Suter, and with those two future HoF'ers, he couldn't have any sucess in the playoffs. At least Randy won the Cup with his two HoF'ers. - faceto27
Shea Weber and Suter are no Chris Pronger and Scott Neidermayer. Any team in the league with both Pronger and Neidermayer on the backend, yeah an instant Stanley Cup favorite.....again, RC is not responsible for it. Barry Trotz brought along Weber, Suter, and also had a pretty damn good track record with goalies. He obviously understands that it's most important to build from the net out. As far as forwards go, they did not have much....which is why it is so impressive that he was able to bring them to the playoffs 7 out of the last 10 years. He made it work with what he was supplied with. Can't say that about many coaches around the league, given his roster. |
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faceto27
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Location: Burke: Best part of today is I Joined: 01.21.2010
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Patrick Hornqvist, Scott Hartnell, Nick Spaling is up there now, Wilson, Craig Smith, but realistically, they've developed far more defensemen and brought it in forwards from outside. - Viktory
Seriously, the best you can come up with were those three players??
Honqvist best season is 53 points. Spaling best season is what something like 35 pts. And Hartnell best days are with the Flyers.
C'mon man |
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honesthockey
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Click heels twice and 1c appears. Joined: 09.23.2008
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Again, I don't think he's gonna storm onto the job and start dropping the axe. I think there'll be discussions with Carlyle and with management to figure out their vision, see if it matches, and see if it can work.
I'm just not that patient - lumlums
He didn't have to. Carlyle reports to Nonis.
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ThePresident
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: NY Joined: 12.08.2010
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Ryan Getzlaf....... Corey Perry - faceto27
I'm talking on the Leafs. |
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faceto27
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Location: Burke: Best part of today is I Joined: 01.21.2010
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Shea Weber and Suter are no Chris Pronger and Scott Neidermayer. Any team in the league with both Pronger and Neidermayer on the backend, yeah an instant Stanley Cup favorite.....again, RC is not responsible for it. Barry Trotz brought along Weber, Suter, and also had a pretty damn good track record with goalies. He obviously understands that it's most important to build from the net out. As far as forwards go, they did not have much....which is why it is so impressive that he was able to bring them to the playoffs 7 out of the last 10 years. He made it work with what he was supplied with. Can't say that about many coaches around the league, given his roster. - ThePresident
Weber and Suter will both be Hall of Famers. To think otherwise is silly.
As for the forwards..... is it they didn't have much? Or they didn't develop much??
After 15 years, you'd think he would have developed ONE, just ONE decent forward.
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Flyfreaky
Philadelphia Flyers |
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Joined: 07.20.2011
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I'm talking on the Leafs. - ThePresident
kadri and jake g |
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