You're right, but...

Think about it like you're the coach. Like this is what you do for a living.

You want to make the playoffs and lose in 5 to Pittsburgh?

No, you want to get in and make a run. You can't do that with certain players playing at particular levels.

Here's a question, if they were to make a playoff run, which three players (other than the goalie....) do you think would have to significantly improve between now and late April?
- njdevils350

Benching Gelinas right now will have little to no impact on how our first series goes. And if I were DeBoer, I'd want to make the playoffs first and foremost. Missing two years in a row would put him on the hot seat and it wouldn't make us an attractive destination during free agency. Benching Gelinas really didn't make him play better, he's just an inconsistent rookie defensman but he's very valuable to the team.

I think fans overlook deficiencies in their game (at this stage in development) because they just want to "see the kids play" and they don't think this team has a chance in the playoffs. Meanwhile, these decisions are being made off of the concept of making a meaningful playoff run.

Thus, the outrage.

For example, if Zidlicky had thrown that blind pass through the middle of his own zone right onto Marleau's tape everyone would've wanted him released immediately. It's a double standard. Understandable nonetheless. Zidlciky is a veteran and you know what he is. You don't know what Gelinas is and you want to see him play.

I get that.

Salvador gets beat wide pretty regularly and everyone is filled with outrage.

Gelinas gets beat wide and everyone cuts him a break.

I get it. He's flashy and he has sooo much offensive upside. But, no one even wants Salvador in the lineup when he's getting smoked to the outside or when he can't smash people in the corners.

With Gelinas, it's ok.

Double Standard because He's a rookie with a ton of potential and not a veteran
- njdevils350

There is no double standard. Gelinas makes us a better team. Yes he makes mistakes but we'll have to live with them at this point.

There is no double standard. Gelinas makes us a better team. Yes he makes mistakes but we'll have to live with them at this point.
- rmdevil313

now you're acting like yourself again..

Do you guys think if Cory started more games you guys would be in a playoff spot? Last time I checked marty had a better w/l record but Schneiders numbers were better I believe.
- nyrangers9479

Unless our D tightens up it won't matter who is starting.

I never said he was good. You are very confused.
- njdevils350

You're defending the fact that a poopty stay at home dman should be playing over an offensive dman that puts up points and makes the same mistakes as the "stay at home dman"

I think you don't get it

Sal. Our transition game sucks with both Volchenkov and Salvador.
- rmdevil313

it does just Merril been pretty weak lately. I miss Anton in as he is the only guy back there who hits with consistency. That Semin goal is still pissing me off he should of been on his ass before he even spun around. Gelly is the last guy who should be sitting though.

Guys I think he wants volchenkov and sal playing over gelly because they're rated higher in nhl14

Guys I think he wants volchenkov and sal playing over gelly because they're rated higher in nhl14
- shvingter88

I am really starting to believe that DeBoer made a HockeyBuzz account to justify his awful coaching decisions, and that is who that is. Seems like the same stupid logic being applied.

Sal is a veteran who should know better, meanwhile Gelinas is a defenseman who will make errors (Gelinas also makes our PP function and puts up points on a regular basis). I'd rather give up a few defensive problems and let Gelinas learn, and put up points, then have Sal do the exact same thing and not score a single point or take the body.

Sal is old and broken. He used to hit people, but now doesn't seem to want to. Kind of reminds me (although not totally) of how Colin White became. Was a truck of a hitter, then got a concussion, and was afraid to hit again.

Big game tonight the boys better come out ready for a war. Can't afford another no show like in that Detroit game. That was an embarrassing game with them missing a lot of key players and they still smoked us.

Guys I think he wants volchenkov and sal playing over gelly because they're rated higher in nhl14
- shvingter88

Big game tonight the boys better come out ready for a war. Can't afford another no show like in that Detroit game. That was an embarrassing game with them missing a lot of key players and they still smoked us.
- blizzzard

Who the hell made our schedule?! Seems like we can't get into a rhythm.

Who the hell made our schedule?! Seems like we can't get into a rhythm.
- FAZOOL

The guy that gave us the kovy penalty

You're defending the fact that a poopty stay at home dman should be playing over an offensive dman that puts up points and makes the same mistakes as the "stay at home dman"

I think you don't get it
- shvingter88

When did I say Salvador should play over Gelinas?

It is painful to sit here and have to explain the most minute details of things because you can't follow along.

What I did was essentially compare a deficiency in both Gelinas and Salvador's game. They both struggle at being taken wide off the rush.

Do I know have to explain what I mean when I say "taken wide"? I hope not....

The point was that you give more of a pass to Gelinas on this particular deficiency than you do Salvador. Similarly, you give more of a pass to Gelinas offensive misdeeds than you do Zidlicky.

Defense means just as much in the game as offense does.

It's amazing that I never compared the two players on an overall level. Not once. Right there in black and white. Yet, I had multiple people pretending I did.

Slow down and try to comprehend what you're reading.

Benching Gelinas right now will have little to no impact on how our first series goes. And if I were DeBoer, I'd want to make the playoffs first and foremost. Missing two years in a row would put him on the hot seat and it wouldn't make us an attractive destination during free agency. Benching Gelinas really didn't make him play better, he's just an inconsistent rookie defensman but he's very valuable to the team.
- rmdevil313

Well, at least you comprehended the idea.

Benching him is designed to make him play better defensively. Which, in turn, could take his game to another level.

If you want to skip it because you don't think it will work, that's fine. You're entitled to your opinion.

When did I say Salvador should play over Gelinas?

It is painful to sit here and have to explain the most minute details of things because you can't follow along.

What I did was essentially compare a deficiency in both Gelinas and Salvador's game. They both struggle at being taken wide off the rush.

Do I know have to explain what I mean when I say "taken wide"? I hope not....

The point was that you give more of a pass to Gelinas on this particular deficiency than you do Salvador. Similarly, you give more of a pass to Gelinas offensive misdeeds than you do Zidlicky.

Defense means just as much in the game as offense does.

It's amazing that I never compared the two players on an overall level. Not once. Right there in black and white. Yet, I had multiple people pretending I did.

Slow down and try to comprehend what you're reading.
- njdevils350

How is gelinas going to learn how to handle players coming in wide while in the press box?

So let's see here, an old and slow Salvador that can't handle being taken wide on the rush and doesn't put up any points and falls on our goaltender all the time, for a younger better skating gelinas that puts up points but makes the same mistakes as Salvador.

Yeah you're a genius dude.

What I did was essentially compare a deficiency in both Gelinas and Salvador's game. They both struggle at being taken wide off the rush.


The point was that you give more of a pass to Gelinas on this particular deficiency than you do Salvador. Similarly, you give more of a pass to Gelinas offensive misdeeds than you do Zidlicky.

- njdevils350

I give more of a pass to Gelinas because he's a rookie, mistakes are part of the learning process.

I don't give a pass to Salvador because he's been in the league for X number of years and makes $X million dollars. He's no longer learning, he just plain sucks.

The difference is one is learning, and the best way is via in game learning. If Salvador is still learning then he needs to be bought out ASAP.

Same for Zidlicky. For easily the first 1/4 of the season he was averaging one minor stupid penalty per game. PER GAME. Hooking, tripping, slashing, holding, all the stupid calls you would expect a VETERAN NOT to make because it hurts his team.

Do I expect it to happen once in a while? Sure. But every single game for a veteran? No.

You talk about responsibilities for a rookie, what about the failed accountaibility for the veterans?

IF you're a veteran and you make the same mistakes game after game, you should sit. No matter how much you make or how important you think you are.

Sit the rookies? Fine.
But make sure bench Sal when he gets beaten wide, pinned in his own end, makes a horrible turnover, and does all this things EVERY SINGLE game. Do the same for Volchenkov. Do the same for Zidlicky when he takes his customary penalty in the last 5 minutes of the game allowing the opposition a PP chance when NJ is either tied or already down a goal, because those mistakes are just as detrimental.

How is gelinas going to learn how to handle players coming in wide while in the press box?

So let's see here, an old and slow Salvador that can't handle being taken wide on the rush and doesn't put up any points and falls on our goaltender all the time, for a younger better skating gelinas that puts up points but makes the same mistakes as Salvador.

Yeah you're a genius dude.
- shvingter88

This has very little to do with Salvador, as I've said multiple times. It's annoying to have to say something the same way 10 time before you can wrap your mind around it.

The idea of sitting for a game to help a rookie is not original. I didn't think of it. DeBoer didn't think of it. It's been around for a long time. It's not "Pro-Salvador" as you somehow conjured up.

It's to help Gelinas get better.

I give more of a pass to Gelinas because he's a rookie, mistakes are part of the learning process.

I don't give a pass to Salvador because he's been in the league for X number of years and makes $X million dollars. He's no longer learning, he just plain sucks.

The difference is one is learning, and the best way is via in game learning. If Salvador is still learning then he needs to be bought out ASAP.

Same for Zidlicky. For easily the first 1/4 of the season he was averaging one minor stupid penalty per game. PER GAME. Hooking, tripping, slashing, holding, all the stupid calls you would expect a VETERAN NOT to make because it hurts his team.

Do I expect it to happen once in a while? Sure. But every single game for a veteran? No.

You talk about responsibilities for a rookie, what about the failed accountaibility for the veterans?

IF you're a veteran and you make the same mistakes game after game, you should sit. No matter how much you make or how important you think you are.

Sit the rookies? Fine.
But make sure bench Sal when he gets beaten wide, pinned in his own end, makes a horrible turnover, and does all this things EVERY SINGLE game. Do the same for Volchenkov. Do the same for Zidlicky when he takes his customary penalty in the last 5 minutes of the game allowing the opposition a PP chance when NJ is either tied or already down a goal, because those mistakes are just as detrimental.
- FLdevilsFAN

I agree with much of this. Often, playing is the best way to learn. But, sitting for a game can be just as beneficial if it helps the mental approach.

I'm just amused that some people somehow decided I was saying Salvador and Zidlicky were better than Gelinas. That wasn't it at all.

If people want to say, as you have, that Gelinas gets a pass because he's learning, that's fine. That's one way to look at it. Thankfully, I've illustrated to you that Gelinas has been, at times, as bad as Salvador and Zidlicky in certain aspects of the game. That was the point.

I wish we could sit Salvador and Volchenkov too, we just don't have the depth.....

It's annoying to have to explain something ten times because people either can not or do not want to comprehend it.

Big (frank)ing win boys big (frank)ing win. A good thing I noticed was Cory was pretty happy at the end of the game had a big smile on his face when giving Marty a tap