I'm curious to how this trade deadline is going to play out. There aren't a lot of teams with ample cap space to play with, so does it become a buyers market with less teams in the mix for certain players? Or is it the opposite. Lots of teams are still in the hunt, so a team looking to sell can use teams bidding against each other to drive up the price.

Kesler is a real good player, but the price is very high.
- MJL

that proposed deal that someone said was floating around of pouliot, bennett, despres, and a first makes me absolutely sick

Why did Maata drop to 22 then? I'd have to imagine he'd go much higher if that draft was redone.

No doubt, don't rush Morin. I think it also comes down to the system you're dropping him into, the coaches, the support, and who are his mentors on the ice. Unfortunately, the Flyers are most likely losing the defensive leader both from an on-ice and team point of view, and that definitely has an impact on young player development.
- wolfhounds

There were several highly ranked defensemen, and a LOT of guys that rose and fell. There were guys like Slater Koekkoek, Derrick Pouliot and Matthew Dumba that were slotted anywhere between 10-20 who all went top ten. Maatta just slid.

A comparable package for the Flyers to land Kesler with what the asking price is. Would be B. Schenn, Scott Laughton, and a 1st round pick. No way in hell!
- MJL

yeah. no way id be a buyer from the flyers perspective on that.

Agreed. He's AHL eligible next season, right? I figure about 2 years and he's learning as he goes in Orange and Black.
- wolfhounds

As a CHLer, he'd have another year in the Q.

No, you have to be 20 to play in the AHL.
- MJL

Another Laughton situation...

I'd like to see the data on that. And like you said, you never know how a player is going to turn out.
- MJL

Look for current top-4 NHL dmen who played in the CHL who didn't put up points rather easily in their post-draft years... let's just say there are a lot more who did than who didn't, even guys that are deemed today to be defensive defensemen.

Also, you can look through the drafts of years past and find the kids taken early on who were touted as having 'offensive upside' but then never fulfilled it... and then see how many of those turned out to be top-4 NHL dmen, or even made the NHL at all.

There will be an outliers here and there, but the trend mostly holds true... if a dman can't produce points in junior, they'll tend to struggle to be an impact player at the top level, in any capacity.

That's the guy I wanted at our spot...was most high on him and Nurse. Z has Morin's size and mobility with twice the offensive game. He was there for the taking and they franking blew it. While I think Morin is intriguing, he's just more of a long shot than Zadorov imo. Time will tell I guess.
- exlund

Morin was the Canadian from the Q. Zadarov the Russian.

End of story for the flyers

that proposed deal that someone said was floating around of pouliot, bennett, despres, and a first makes me absolutely sick
- stayinthefnnet

One of the rumors is that the Flyers involvement in Kesler is similar to their involvement in Clowe last year, i.e. having some interest, but when hearing the asking price, being more interested in driving up the price than actually paying it.

There were several highly ranked defensemen, and a LOT of guys that rose and fell. There were guys like Slater Koekkoek, Derrick Pouliot and Matthew Dumba that were slotted anywhere between 10-20 who all went top ten. Maatta just slid.
- Jsaquella

he is a wild card in my eyes as of now

Look for current top-4 NHL dmen who played in the CHL who didn't put up points rather easily in their post-draft years... let's just say there are a lot more who did than who didn't, even guys that are deemed today to be defensive defensemen.

Also, you can look through the drafts of years past and find the kids taken early on who were touted as having 'offensive upside' but then never fulfilled it... and then see how many of those turned out to be top-4 NHL dmen, or even made the NHL at all.

There will be an outliers here and there, but the trend mostly holds true... if a dman can't produce points in junior, they'll tend to struggle to be an impact player at the top level, in any capacity.
- Tomahawk

That all depends on what the definition of an impact player is. And again here we see that a defenseman has to be a point producer to be an impact player. I don't agree. And we're going round and round. If Morin turns out to be a physical force and a top defensive defenseman that plays at a high level in key defensive situations. Then he indeed will be an impact player. Regardless of how many points he puts up. He doesn't need to put up points to be a high minute impact player for the Flyers.

A more truer and accurate statement is that if a defenseman can't produce points at a high level in Junior Hockey, then it's not likely that he'll be a point producer at the NHL level. I'm fine if Morin doesn't become a point producer at the NHL level. But his Junior career is not likely over after this Season.

he is a wild card in my eyes as of now
- stayinthefnnet

Yep. I know OB liked him during that draft and was pissed that he ended up in Pittsburgh.

A comparable package for the Flyers to land Kesler with what the asking price is. Would be B. Schenn, Scott Laughton, and a 1st round pick. No way in hell!
- MJL

Yeah would have trouble trading Schenn and either laughton or 1st let alone both....no thank you

Morin was the Canadian from the Q. Zadarov the Russian.

End of story for the flyers
- Just5

Yeah that bias did worry me...I wonder if they would have even taken Nichushkin if he dropped to them.

That all depends on what the definition of an impact player is. And again here we see that a defenseman has to be a point producer to be an impact player. I don't agree. And we're going round and round. If Morin turns out to be a physical force and a top defensive defenseman that plays at a high level in key defensive situations. Then he indeed will be an impact player. Regardless of how many points he puts up. He doesn't need to put up points to be a high minute impact player for the Flyers.

A more truer and accurate statement is that if a defenseman can't produce points at a high level in Junior Hockey, then it's not likely that he'll be a point producer at the NHL level. I'm fine if Morin doesn't become a point producer at the NHL level. But his Junior career is not likely over after this Season.
- MJL

Dude this went right over your head haaaaaaaa

Yep. I know OB liked him during that draft and was pissed that he ended up in Pittsburgh.
- Jsaquella

his knowledge of prospects definitely far exceeds mine. i remember being pissed they didnt take a swing at a forward.

but from what i have seen of pouliot, he seems high risk/high reward.

One of the rumors is that the Flyers involvement in Kesler is similar to their involvement in Clowe last year, i.e. having some interest, but when hearing the asking price, being more interested in driving up the price than actually paying it.
- Jsaquella

Very well could be the case

Yeah that bias did worry me...I wonder if they would have even taken Nichushkin if he dropped to them.
- exlund

If Craig Button is to be relied upon, Morin was their guy at 11 all along. If one feels that the whiteboard in their pre-draft meetings on "Flight Plan" was accurate, Morin was their 7th rated guy, behind the obvious big 5 and Sean Monahan

his knowledge of prospects definitely far exceeds mine. i remember being pissed they didnt take a swing at a forward.

but from what i have seen of pouliot, he seems high risk/high reward.
- stayinthefnnet

He is, and IIRC, OB mentioned that at the time. I generally defer to him and the CHL analysts I follow/talk to on twitter for their judgement on the prospects.

that proposed deal that someone said was floating around of pouliot, bennett, despres, and a first makes me absolutely sick
- stayinthefnnet

As it should...but if I deal is made Sutter will be in there

As it should...but if I deal is made Sutter will be in there
- nonpoint22

Yes, the Canucks want a young Center that can step immediately into the lineup.

think about it we drafted jvr instead of couture

As it should...but if I deal is made Sutter will be in there
- nonpoint22

yeah it would have to include him. sutter isnt exactly garbage by any means. but he isnt the player kesler is.

think about it we drafted jvr instead of couture
- 2Real

The Sharks drafted Pat Falloon ahead of Scott Niedermayer

That all depends on what the definition of an impact player is. And again here we see that a defenseman has to be a point producer to be an impact player. I don't agree. And we're going round and round. If Morin turns out to be a physical force and a top defensive defenseman that plays at a high level in key defensive situations. Then he indeed will be an impact player. Regardless of how many points he puts up. He doesn't need to put up points to be a high minute impact player for the Flyers.

A more truer and accurate statement is that if a defenseman can't produce points at a high level in Junior Hockey, then it's not likely that he'll be a point producer at the NHL level. I'm fine if Morin doesn't become a point producer at the NHL level. But his Junior career is not likely over after this Season.
- MJL

Yeah, you seriously missed the point.

We're not talking about being able to produce points at the top level... we're talking about being top-4 caliber period, or making the NHL period.

Guys like Vlasic, Hamhuis, Gorges... they were elite point producers in junior... that puck skill has allowed them to crack NHL top-4's, even if they haven't translated their point production to the pros.

Guys who couldn't put up the points in junior tend to be like Mark Fistric, Ryan Parent, Luke Schenn and the like.

Yeah would have trouble trading Schenn and either laughton or 1st let alone both....no thank you
- nonpoint22

Seems like the reverse of the the Richards trade (as an aside, Kesler was drafted in the #23 spot before Richards in that great 2003 draft.), where we traded player seemingly past his prime for top young assets...NO THANKS! Glad to let others pay that price. We're not in a position like L.A. was...we need D.