If that's the case (the Ducks took it away), then it has nothing to do with the players as they just got beat by a better team, and that happens in sports. I don't think the Flyers (right now) are a Cup contender, but I think they're also better than their record currently indicates. But that doesn't mean they'd be able to beat Pittsburgh/Boston/etc. in a best-of-seven series.
- jmatchett383

This is pretty much where I am. They shouldn't be as bad as their record is, but I also agree that they're not an elite team, by any stretch.

The frustrating part is, that they should be better. They should be able to squeeze at least a loser point out of a game like last night's.

I'm not saying people shouldn't be upset. But if you take the team that played last night compared to the team from the Montreal or Carolina game, it's a world of difference in a positive way.

Like I said, was the 3rd period a trainwreck? Absolutely. But let's pay no attention to how they dominated a top team for more than half a game and just rail away on every player on the team minus Mason.
- jmatchett383

What we saw was a team that was asleep against the Flyers in the First period...the woke up and then player thier hockey...and did it in our zone...exposing our weaknesses once again, crappy overall defense that is SOOOOOOOO overpaid, and creative balanced scoring, I am very tired of seeing G park his butt in the left face circle or boards and wait for something to happen...everyone in the leagye knows he is going to do that, so they just block passing lanes and cover guys and they play falls apart...anyone notice, g doesn't have a move (like Briere from behind the net to skate out to the left side...) to drive to the net and score, he has no power move, he has no scoring skill, passing skill, yes...boat loads of it...but there is a clear lack of a scoring move or moves on how he gets off the boards and gets to the net and changes the way teams play D against him and his line...

i doubt anyone is saying that the issues are only the 4th line. i think the argument is that since the 4th line is so utterly useless and can't be counted on for anything (compared to say detroit's 4th line most years that could actually shut down other teams, provide energy and score) the load falls up onto the the other players and the load is unevenly distributed, which contributes to the team's myriad issues
- hogweed

This is exactly what I'm saying. Don't know about anyone else, but that's what I'm saying.

This is exactly what I'm saying. Don't know about anyone else, but that's what I'm saying.
- AllInForFlyers

Nope, that sums up my feelings perfectly.

I'm going to just skip past this one because personal attacks aren't tolerated on the boards.
- AllInForFlyers

Its not a personal attack. I assumed you were 12 years old. You're not?

What we saw was a team that was asleep against the Flyers in the First period...the woke up and then player thier hockey...and did it in our zone...exposing our weaknesses once again, crappy overall defense that is SOOOOOOOO overpaid, and creative balanced scoring, I am very tired of seeing G park his butt in the left face circle or boards and wait for something to happen...everyone in the leagye knows he is going to do that, so they just block passing lanes and cover guys and they play falls apart...anyone notice, g doesn't have a move (like Briere from behind the net to skate out to the left side...) to drive to the net and score, he has no power move, he has no scoring skill, passing skill, yes...boat loads of it...but there is a clear lack of a scoring move or moves on how he gets off the boards and gets to the net and changes the way teams play D against him and his line...
- JW98FlyerFan

Claude Giroux has plenty of moves. Check YouTube. They are all there.

Unfortunately, he's not using many of them right now.

Giroux needs to get back to playing like he did last year, or ideally like he played in 2011-12.

I don't doubt he will come around, but I'd also like to see the Flyers use him more judiciously. He plays a lot of hard minutes, and if the Flyers had better-or at least more versatile-depth guys, he might not have to shoulder so much of the load.

This is an excellent blog about using star players

http://blogs.thescore.com...th-defensive-zone-starts/

They Flyers aren't paying Claude Giroux $8mm next season to play on the PK and take D-zone draws. Start using him more the way that the Sedins and Toews get used.,,but to do that you need effective depth guys
- Jsaquella

I have to say this is the one thing that makes me miss Clarke as GM. He had a knack for finding and acquiring great role playing forwards: Otto, Podein, Mactavish, Klatt, Mandeville, Zelepukin, Kapanen etc.. We could use some guys like that!

i thought this was more entertaining last night....


FLYERS meet CAP world

Its not a personal attack. I assumed you were 12 years old.
- flyers2001

Funny! Might want to continue your discussion with someone else, because a mod might feel differently.

I'm not interested in going down that path, so have a good one!

What we saw was a team that was asleep against the Flyers in the First period...the woke up and then player thier hockey...and did it in our zone...exposing our weaknesses once again, crappy overall defense that is SOOOOOOOO overpaid, and creative balanced scoring, I am very tired of seeing G park his butt in the left face circle or boards and wait for something to happen...everyone in the leagye knows he is going to do that, so they just block passing lanes and cover guys and they play falls apart...anyone notice, g doesn't have a move (like Briere from behind the net to skate out to the left side...) to drive to the net and score, he has no power move, he has no scoring skill, passing skill, yes...boat loads of it...but there is a clear lack of a scoring move or moves on how he gets off the boards and gets to the net and changes the way teams play D against him and his line...
- JW98FlyerFan

Has Giroux ever been a goal scorer though? He's a setup guy. That'll always be his strength. I think he's good for 25-35 goals a year and a bunch of assists, if he has teammates that are playing well.

I'm not absolving his play by any means. He does need to step up and take leadership and make better decisions with the puck at times. He also needs guys to be open and keep plays alive in the offensive zone to break down D-zone coverage, and the team has a hard time doing that, which relies on all players. Again, while he can be better, he has found open teammates this year in good scoring position and there just isn't a lot of finish.

Claude Giroux has plenty of moves. Check YouTube. They are all there.

Unfortunately, he's not using many of them right now.
- johndewar

Well apparently he doesn't use them for 3.75M, so we are going to have to wait to see if the come with the 8.275M Giroux...

I have to say this is the one thing that makes me miss Clarke as GM. He had a knack for finding and acquiring great role playing forwards: Otto, Podein, Mactavish, Klatt, Mandeville, Zelepukin, Kapanen etc.. We could use some guys like that!
- BiggE

Holmgren had it once, when he had guys like Lappy & Betts healthy. Now it seems that they want an enforcer dressed every night, whether the opponent has one or not

Well apparently he doesn't use them for 3.75M, so we are going to have to wait to see if the come with the 8.275M Giroux...
- JW98FlyerFan

I don't know what's going on with Giroux and I'm not sure I fully buy the "he's not just confident" line.

I'm not doubting his talent or that he's an upper echelon player. I'm doubting his health.

Holmgren had it once, when he had guys like Lappy & Betts healthy. Now it seems that they want an enforcer dressed every night, whether the opponent has one or not
- Jsaquella

They must have been afraid of Ryan Getzlaf's male pattern baldness.

They must have been afraid of Ryan Getzlaf's male pattern baldness.
- johndewar

HE'S COVERED IN PROPECIA AND ROGAINE!!! DON'T TOUCH HIM!!

Until Giroux scores, this team isn't taking the next step. Does G have an Even Strength point? Then we'll worry about Hartnell, Couts, etc. The problem last night was scoring, giveaways, shots (or a lack thereof in the 3rd), and generally sloppy play. The minutes of the 4th line might be a factor as the season wears on and these guys start to get tired, but right now it's an excuse for a team whose top players aren't (and have not been) getting it done.

It starts with G.

HE'S COVERED IN PROPECIA AND ROGAINE!!! DON'T TOUCH HIM!!
- Jsaquella

Holmgren had it once, when he had guys like Lappy & Betts healthy. Now it seems that they want an enforcer dressed every night, whether the opponent has one or not
- Jsaquella

Even guys like Aaron Asham could score and be responsible in their own end; Andreas Nodl couldn't score but he was reliable defensively and could forecheck.

Eric Wellwood, guys like that...they're just hockey players. They're not great hockey players, elite players. But you could at least play them in a tie game in the third period, give your better players a quick rest, and not have to worry about them taking a needless penalty or get scored on.

i thought this was more entertaining last night....


FLYERS meet CAP world

- PhillaBully

Has Giroux ever been a goal scorer though? He's a setup guy. That'll always be his strength. I think he's good for 25-35 goals a year and a bunch of assists, if he has teammates that are playing well.

I'm not absolving his play by any means. He does need to step up and take leadership and make better decisions with the puck at times. He also needs guys to be open and keep plays alive in the offensive zone to break down D-zone coverage, and the team has a hard time doing that, which relies on all players. Again, while he can be better, he has found open teammates this year in good scoring position and there just isn't a lot of finish.
- eayost

You figure 20 goals in a season is about 1 every other game, so G should have 3 to 6 goals right now, taking the streakiness of scoring into consideration. He's been out on every PP we've had (usually losing the opening faceoff), so he's being given every opportunity to put a few home. I don't think anybody is asking he stay on pace with Ovi, Stamkos or Crosby, but he should have 1 by now.

You are a genius. Give yourself a pat on the back.

This team needed a culture change, plain and simple, back in 2011.
- KGBflyers10

Totally agree, unfortunately money saved was not used wisely and the NEW culture is not much better

Giroux needs to get back to playing like he did last year, or ideally like he played in 2011-12.

I don't doubt he will come around, but I'd also like to see the Flyers use him more judiciously. He plays a lot of hard minutes, and if the Flyers had better-or at least more versatile-depth guys, he might not have to shoulder so much of the load.

This is an excellent blog about using star players

http://blogs.thescore.com...th-defensive-zone-starts/

They Flyers aren't paying Claude Giroux $8mm next season to play on the PK and take D-zone draws. Start using him more the way that the Sedins and Toews get used.,,but to do that you need effective depth guys
- Jsaquella

A lot of posters, myself included were clamoring for a player like Adam Hall to take some of those hard minutes off of Giroux. Well they have Hall and they aren't using him as much as they should. So Giroux can get more offensive zone starts. Whose fault is that? I think the blame is being incorrectly placed on 4th line players such as Rosehill and Rinaldo. Hall is currently eing scratched. If anyone shoulkd be blamed for how Giroux is being used, it is the Coaching staff who should be blamed.

Until Giroux scores, this team isn't taking the next step. Does G have an Even Strength point? Then we'll worry about Hartnell, Couts, etc. The problem last night was scoring, giveaways, shots (or a lack thereof in the 3rd), and generally sloppy play. The minutes of the 4th line might be a factor as the season wears on and these guys start to get tired, but right now it's an excuse for a team whose top players aren't (and have not been) getting it done.

It starts with G.
- wolfhounds

- MBFlyerfan

flyers are the cat making baaad decisions all the time lol

Until Giroux scores, this team isn't taking the next step. Does G have an Even Strength point? Then we'll worry about Hartnell, Couts, etc. The problem last night was scoring, giveaways, shots (or a lack thereof in the 3rd), and generally sloppy play. The minutes of the 4th line might be a factor as the season wears on and these guys start to get tired, but right now it's an excuse for a team whose top players aren't (and have not been) getting it done.

It starts with G.
- wolfhounds

Quick someone take him to lombard street so he can score!