He's been $5.25M/year good?

At best, I'd say he's earning $2.5M on the attacking side of the puck, and defensively he probably shouldn't be in the league at all. Marc-Andre Bergeron would have provided the same for under $1M.
- Tomahawk

i dunno if MAB is the best example, but i understand your point.

edit: would it be apropos to use a Jeff Schultz/ luke schenn analogy for those plyrs?

i dunno if MAB is the best example, but i understand your point.
- isaiah520

I though (can't shoot) Streit was a better skater then he's shown.

The same reason they paid him the what? $27 mill for 2 years?
Because there fan base will stop buying tickets if they move him, the Preds culture is all about defense, not much else.
- puckhead17

from a financial standpoint how does paying $27 million impact their ability to pay him the $70 except in a negative way? some teams can't afford it like we can. if they bring back giroux in the trade (or any top tier player) the fans won't stop buying tickets and they clear the rest of his contract. there is a better canve they move him than there is of them keeping him, in my opinion (which means nothing, but i think they will)

I though (can't shoot) Streit was a better skater then he's shown.
- puckhead17

no, avg skater. thought he'd be able to get more shots thru, however...

i dunno if MAB is the best example, but i understand your point.
- isaiah520

Big shot, .5 points-per-game pedigree, good offensive instincts, nice outlet passer, can run a PP... deficient in his own zone, smaller body, wrong side of 30... that's MA Bergeron.

On the plus side, MA Bergeron is faster, younger, cheaper, and could have been signed to a 1-year deal. On the down side, Bergeron's a bit smaller and weaker than Streit.

Even Liles... on that contract that he has, is a more affordable analog to Streit.

But Streit was the biggest name, and a former captain, so he won by default.

Firing Laviolette and replacing him with Berube 3 games into the season tells me the franchise is no where near as serious as they should be in creating a top notch professional sports team.

Firing Laviolette and replacing him with Berube 3 games into the season tells me the franchise is no where near as serious as they should be in creating a top notch professional sports team.

Sure Berube has heaps of assistant coach experience and some AHL head coaching experience but with this team of limping veterans and unproven 1st round draft picks is in need of is a real teacher.

I don't see Berube as that type of coach.
- Pixote Andolini

but i think that plan was put into place well in advance. it was obvious they were examining contingencies in the off season...is that an even deeper indictment of the org?

from a financial standpoint how does paying $27 million impact their ability to pay him the $70 except in a negative way? some teams can't afford it like we can. if they bring back giroux in the trade (or any top tier player) the fans won't stop buying tickets and they clear the rest of his contract. there is a better canve they move him than there is of them keeping him, in my opinion (which means nothing, but i think they will)
- hogweed

You can't compare there "southern blah" market with this one, no comparison, he was signed under the old CBA, if Giroux was up for cash at the same time he's probably getting a similar contract or close to it, David Poile doesn't care what Weber is getting, he's paying he $ Rinne $7 million a year & this summer he drafted another D man & signed 3 3rd liners & Stalberg, they will never move him, or they would have never matched the offer, the culture of that team is defense & that's it & the poster child of the teams culture doesn't go anywhere

but i think that plan was put into place well in advance. it was obvious they were examining contingencies in the off season...is that an even deeper indictment of the org?
- isaiah520

I hate to repeat it, but they were 1-6 playing the hated Penguins & they coasted in the 2nd period, and even he said they stopped working, this is more serious then "we're getting better" & "we'll get it right"
When does a player say "screw the lack of confidence" & get to work?
What does this GM really do with a group that's on the 2nd coach already & there was still no motivation on Thursday night?

I hate to repeat it, but they were 1-6 playing the hated Penguins & they coasted in the 2nd period, and even he said they stopped working, this is more serious then "we're getting better" & "we'll ger it right"
- puckhead17

well that may be so, but it's an issue w/ the org in general that extends beyond the coach, which was the original point...i think

either way, the nxt GM has to tell Ed, " i got this, not you "

Schenn led the league in hits 2 years in a row B4 the lockout
Homer was drooling
- puckhead17

The real time statistician at the Air Canada Centre is hopped up on meth.

This year, the Leafs are averaging about 2.5 times the amount of turnovers at home compared to on the road.

Real time stats should be considered fake time stats.

How about calling up Akeson- he is that player they are seeking via trade- a fast skating closer.

You can't compare there "southern blah" market with this one, no comparison, he was signed under the old CBA, if Giroux was up for cash at the same time he's probably getting a similar contract or close to it, David Poile doesn't care what Weber is getting, he's paying he $ Rinne $7 million a year & this summer he drafted another D man & signed 3 3rd liners & Stalberg, they will never move him, or they would have never matched the offer, the culture of that team is defense & that's it & the poster child of the teams culture doesn't go anywhere
- puckhead17

i'm not comparing the markets except to say move are scrutinized more by more people here than they would be there. poile might not care but he doesn't write the checks, does he? i bet the owner cares a lot about who gets paid what

from a financial standpoint how does paying $27 million impact their ability to pay him the $70 except in a negative way? some teams can't afford it like we can. if they bring back giroux in the trade (or any top tier player) the fans won't stop buying tickets and they clear the rest of his contract. there is a better canve they move him than there is of them keeping him, in my opinion (which means nothing, but i think they will)
- hogweed

At the very least, don't you think that upfront payment would pisss of Nashville enough to kill any trade possibility with the Flyers for Weber?

Not gonna happen.

The real time statistician at the Air Canada Centre is hopped up on meth.

This year, the Leafs are averaging about 2.5 times the amount of turnovers at home compared to on the road.

Real time stats should be considered fake time stats.
- Atomic Wedgie

I dont like Schenn either but you guys cant seem to let him go...everybody knows you won the trade

At the very least, don't you think that upfront payment would pisss of Nashville enough to kill any trade possibility with the Flyers for Weber?

Not gonna happen.
- Atomic Wedgie

like the fans give 2 craps about what the team pays? you're conflating 2 different issues. the organization makes decisions from hockey perspective and a financial one. the fans want results, no mater the cost. if they traded weber for streit the fns would have a fit but if they got back giroux they would be excited to get a superstar forward; i doubt the fans would say "what about the money the owner spent on weber?" and the team would free up about $50 million over the next 4 years to play other players. if they made that trade would you care about the money or the player?

like the fans give 2 craps about what the team pays? you're conflating 2 different issues. the organization makes decisions from hockey perspective and a financial one. the fans want results, no mater the cost. if they got back giroux they would be excited to get a superstar forward; i doubt the fans would say "what about the money the owner spent?" and the team would free up about $50 million over the next 4 years to play other players.
- hogweed

again, if you offered for free, to Dave Poile, today for no exchange, for free, another teams top forward or top defenseman, he would still take the defenseman, that is the culture of there franchise, every year they struggle to score & they still could care less about up front, kind of like us in a reverse way.

Bill, I think you hit the nail right on the head by questioning the mix of players, rather than the individual skill level of the players.

For example Giroux and Voracek are both skilled players, however each is more of a playmaker than a shooter and if you are going to play them together you need a shoot first sniper on the other wing.

Schenn-VL-Simmonds looks good on paper, but none of them are creative playmakers and Schenn just looks much more comfortable at center.

A better forward lineup, without making wholesale changes, could be:
Hartnell-VL-Giroux: Giroux may not want to play RW, but this would be a well balanced and effective trio
Read-Schenn-Simmonds: Good combo of speed, grit and skill and it allows Schenn to play his natural position
McGinn-Couturier-Voracek: Good 2-way line and Voracek will help bring out Couturiers offensive game. McGinn could be replaced by Talbot when protecting a lead late in games.
Raffl-Talbot-Rinaldo: a 4th line that has some talent, some grit and is defensively responsible.

The D is a bigger concern, because another puck mover is badly needed and it looks like Kimmo Timonen has finally reached the end of his career. There are teams that are looking for defensive defensemen out there, perhaps a deal can be worked out to acquire a puck mover for Coburn, a prospect like Ghost or Cousins and a 3rd round pick. That would leave us with:
New puck mover-Grossmann
Timonen-Gustafsson
Streit-Schenn

The D would still need upgrading, but hopefully that would come in the offseason when both Kimmo and Mez come off the books.

like the fans give 2 craps about what the team pays? you're conflating 2 different issues. the organization makes decisions from hockey perspective and a financial one. the fans want results, no mater the cost. if they traded weber for streit the fns would have a fit but if they got back giroux they would be excited to get a superstar forward; i doubt the fans would say "what about the money the owner spent on weber?" and the team would free up about $50 million over the next 4 years to play other players. if they made that trade would you care about the money or the player?
- hogweed

also why would we ever offer Giroux for Weber?

How valuable to you guys is Jake Voracek ? is he an untouchable like G. I realize if he where to be moved already Holmgren would take a lot of heat but would you do Larsson plus Jagr ( You guys loved him here ) or Brunner because Jagr is likely to be done after this year ? thoughts ?

the week ahead...


http://www.sportsology.in...An-Interesting-Week-Ahead

How valuable to you guys is Jake Voracek ? is he an untouchable like G. I realize if he where to be moved already Holmgren would take a lot of heat but would you do Larsson plus Jagr ( You guys loved him here ) or Brunner because Jagr is likely to be done after this year ? thoughts ?
- blizzzard

I can't see it really. The issue to me is that we switched gears in trading Carts and Richie, and if we now change gears again by trading pieces that were acquired in that deal it looks even more like a clown show in the front office. I love Jagr, but why trade to get him?

like the fans give 2 craps about what the team pays? you're conflating 2 different issues. the organization makes decisions from hockey perspective and a financial one. the fans want results, no mater the cost. if they traded weber for streit the fns would have a fit but if they got back giroux they would be excited to get a superstar forward; i doubt the fans would say "what about the money the owner spent on weber?" and the team would free up about $50 million over the next 4 years to play other players. if they made that trade would you care about the money or the player?
- hogweed

Pretty sure you can stop all trade scenarios for G. His NTC went into effect at signing with this new CBA.

I can't see it really. The issue to me is that we switched gears in trading Carts and Richie, and if we now change gears again by trading pieces that were acquired in that deal it looks even more like a clown show in the front office. I love Jagr, but why trade to get him?
- Hextall271

Yea that was my main concern is the amount you gave up for Jake and that first. I love his size speed and vision. Larsson still could be a number 1 guy in my mind if a team is willing to let him play 20 minutes a night every game. Pete is just bipolar with this kid and it's really hurting him.

also why would we ever offer Giroux for Weber?
- puckhead17

why wouldn't we? trading an elite player for another elite player who happens to also address a glaring need (now and in years to come) seems like a pretty decent idea