Crosby is a better scorer, but I think Toews is arguably more valuable than Crosby because of his 2-way game...
- CBHawks88

I was hoping for a Hawk Pens final because I wanted to see how Toews fared head to head.

I think $8.7M over 8 years should be a good target, as that would match what Crosby will be getting during that time.
- WEWANTCUP

Crosby had the fortune of signing his deal before the new CBA. He's making $10M a year for the first 4-5 years of that deal, before it steps down considerably. His cap hit is lower than Malkin (9.5), but the overall dollars are more.

It's times like this where you're glad you have a finance major running your cap. I'm sure they will find ways to get creative, with sign-on bonuses, up front money, etc etc.

Hard to speculate exactly what the cap will be in 2015-16 when their new deals kick in, but Allan Walsh (player agent) tweeted something out that the projected cap then would be approaching 80M. If so, that SHOULD (fingers crossed) cover the increases 19/88 will receive, assuming they each get 9-9.5

Of course, that doesn't leave a whole lot of room for improvements elsewhere.
- eburgio

So - according to Walsh:

2013-2014 = $64MM
2014-2015 = $72MM (increase of 12%+)
2015-2016 = $80MM (another 11%)

Or something like that.

Where are the comparable increases in HRR coming from? Canadian TV is renegotiated after next year, but still, those are big increases.

Hope they happen, for our sake: it would be nice to keep as much of this team together as possible.

I was hoping for a Hawk Pens final because I wanted to see how Toews fared head to head.
- paulr

I think he would have won, when's the last time Toews lost a matchup? Anyone see Krejci after game 1 and Toews was all over him? Neither did I. But Crosby's prolific reg. season production does count for something

How do they justify getting more than Crosby though is my thing? I'm probably the biggest Toews fan on the board, but I couldn't see justifying paying him more than Sid. I'm still going to hold out hope that they take less for the good of the team. I actually thought they got a great deal after the first cup, 6.3 was a lot for two guys only in their third year
- rollpards19

Here Here !!!! Totally agree with you. 6.3 was a ton of money for 2 22yr old kids that weren't amongst the scoring leaders in the league. I love both of these guys believe me, but that kind of money for that age was not right and totally affected the cap issues on this team. This may be the last year of this core group and depending on who performs will determine who stays and who goes. I guess I'm totally spoiled with 2 cups in 4 years but I still would have like to have seen some bigger changes made, ie getting more physical, a legit #2 center, and a true QB for the PP. A 1-3-1 with Keith on top still scares me.

I was hoping for a Hawk Pens final because I wanted to see how Toews fared head to head.
- paulr

I wanted a Hawks-Pens Final for payback for what they did to us in 1992!

I wanted a Hawks-Pens Final for payback for what they did to us in 1992!
- WEWANTCUP

Payback was the look on Jagr's face after game 6

How do they justify getting more than Crosby though is my thing? I'm probably the biggest Toews fan on the board, but I couldn't see justifying paying him more than Sid. I'm still going to hold out hope that they take less for the good of the team. I actually thought they got a great deal after the first cup, 6.3 was a lot for two guys only in their third year
- rollpards19

Justify it by saying they led their team to two Cups - Crosby only one.

So far, for each.

Crosby is a better scorer, but I think Toews is arguably more valuable than Crosby because of his 2-way game...
- CBHawks88

I'd think long and hard about trading Toews for Crosby, but he's the only guy I'd think about it for. Toews is probably the second best defensive top 6 center (bergeron) and arguably the best 5v5 goal scorer in the NHL. He's only getting better offensively too. According to GVT (like WAR in baseball, very well thought out) Toews was the most valuable player in the league, but Crosby had the most value per game. I'd still say Crosby is a touch better

I wanted a Hawks-Pens Final for payback for what they did to us in 1992!
- WEWANTCUP

The Hawks would have won 4-0 .



Pittsburgh would not of even scored a goal.


HNIC and TSN crews would have had their heads explode.

Crosby had the fortune of signing his deal before the new CBA. He's making $10M a year for the first 4-5 years of that deal, before it steps down considerably. His cap hit is lower than Malkin (9.5), but the overall dollars are more.

It's times like this where you're glad you have a finance major running your cap. I'm sure they will find ways to get creative, with sign-on bonuses, up front money, etc etc.
- eburgio

Agreed, plus I heard somewhere last summer that the Pens were having a hard time ensuring Crosby's contract due to his injury history, so maybe that had something to do with Crosby renewing his contract for the same cap hit as his last.

Justify it by saying they led their team to two Cups - Crosby only one.

So far, for each.
- StLBravesFan

Hey man I love Toews, but Crosby has been near unstoppable (discounting his brain rolling around his skull) in recent regular seasons. Another problem is barring injury Toews is probably going to be right around 90 points with Selke caliber defense this year, and thats the most valuable a hockey player can be

I'd think long and hard about trading Toews for Crosby, but he's the only guy I'd think about it for. Toews is probably the second best defensive top 6 center (bergeron) and arguably the best 5v5 goal scorer in the NHL. He's only getting better offensively too. According to GVT (like WAR in baseball, very well thought out) Toews was the most valuable player in the league, but Crosby had the most value per game. I'd still say Crosby is a touch better
- rollpards19

I love me some Captain Serious, but holy hell...when Crosby is on his game, he's darn near unstoppable. Now granted, he's not as strong defensively as #19, but he's good at the dot. He's strong in the corners.

I'm not sure I would trade Toews and his TWO cups for Crosby and the personal accolades, but had you asked me 2 years ago my tune may have been different

You're right Roll...I edited my post after looking up his career stats. Good player, but a pricey bottom 6 guy in the cap era. Kelly will make 3M thru 2015-16 season.
- ArlingtonRob

All good Rob. That's the problem with giving the lower talent guys significant money (and my fear for Bickell). Sometimes things just go right, but they don't have the overall skill to maintain that level of play. And in the cap days, overpaying your role players is the kiss of death

I was hoping for a Hawk Pens final because I wanted to see how Toews fared head to head.
- paulr

Would have been a wild one, first team to score 5 wins.

I love me some Captain Serious, but holy hell...when Crosby is on his game, he's darn near unstoppable. Now granted, he's not as strong defensively as #19, but he's good at the dot. He's strong in the corners.

I'm not sure I would trade Toews and his TWO cups for Crosby and the personal accolades, but had you asked me 2 years ago my tune may have been different
- eburgio

Haha look at the post above

Haha look at the post above
- rollpards19

Ha. I saw it. Had I not been distracted and got this out a shade earlier, i might've been forced to type jinx

Would have been a wild one, first team to score 5 wins.
- Beaver-Warrior

Hawks actually play defense though

He certainly wasn't more valuable in the regular season. Sure he was more valuable in the 20 game playoff season this year, that doesn't mean he is a more valuable player and harder to replace than Stalberg, but that wasn't the discussion
- rollpards19

That's revisionist history. Frolik was a far more important player for the Hawks from opening night to the cup winning goal, which he assisted on, btw.

I like Stalberg but Frolik became a far better and more important player last year.

Payback was the look on Jagr's face after game 6
- CBHawks88

Still not enough....I would have loved to have swept the Pens in the Final instead!

All good Rob. That's the problem with giving the lower talent guys significant money (and my fear for Bickell). Sometimes things just go right, but they don't have the overall skill to maintain that level of play. And in the cap days, overpaying your role players is the kiss of death
- rollpards19

One big reason I'm not sorry to see Bolland and Frolik move on. Agree on Bickell, but right now I'm still smiling and hoping for the best moving forward.

How do they justify getting more than Crosby though is my thing? I'm probably the biggest Toews fan on the board, but I couldn't see justifying paying him more than Sid. I'm still going to hold out hope that they take less for the good of the team. I actually thought they got a great deal after the first cup, 6.3 was a lot for two guys only in their third year
- rollpards19

I agree. Those 2 definitely earned every penny of their 6.5 but at the time a lot of people thought they would be signing for around 5.5. A lot of us were a little surprised by the 6.5. These top players must know it is hard to fill out a competitive roster when so much is tied up in only 4 or 5 players, don't they? I would be happy as hell making 8. Still a lot of money and can still manage the cap for other players

For those who have been wondering.

Mark Lazerus ‏@MarkLazerus

#Blackhawks prospect Stephen Johns will finish his senior year at #NotreDame: "I made a commitment to myself, my family and Coach Jackson."

For those who have been wondering.
- Beaver-Warrior

So what are the ramifications if he goes back to school?.....does he become a FA?.....remains property of the Hawks?......anyone?

Justify it by saying they led their team to two Cups - Crosby only one.

So far, for each.
- StLBravesFan

I have to believe Crosby's one is a product of injuries and the salary cap. I will be surprised if he wins another one in a Pens uniform if they don't win next year. 35 million wrapped up in five players after 2013-14. They better have a decent farm if they hope to continue their success.