Going into the season with the inability to score a big free agent and with the losses of those that went elsewhere we knew two things would have to happen to be a playoff team. Youngsters would have to step up and veterans would have to lead and hope Father Time hadn't caught up with them. None of it happened to the NECESSARY DEGREE. Clearly there were bright spots, just not enough to stem the slide.
- section32

You're right. They needed some players to step up. Some did, some didn't. The Coach didn't do a good job. None of that is about character or makeup. Nor was there a lack of talent. They dug a hole in a shortened Season, and there wasn't enough time to get out of it. And they had a lot of injuries. They still were not that far from a playoff spot.

It's hard to judge Hartnell on a short season with an injury. But he was lack luster at times. Didn't have a ton of jam. And where did G finish last year? Ahead of this year, no?
- section32

Hartnell had a foot injury and wasn't 100%.

In 11/12 Giroux had 28 g and 65 A for 93 points

Giroux's current point totals projected to an 82 game Season is 22 g and 60 A for 82 points. Not a huge difference.

You're right. They needed some players to step up. Some did, some didn't. The Coach didn't do a good job. None of that is about character or makeup. Nor was there a lack of talent. They dug a hole in a shortened Season, and there wasn't enough time to get out of it. And they had a lot of injuries. They still were not that far from a playoff spot.
- MJL

I agree with about 90% of what you said. When capable players don't step up I question character. Either that or they aren't capable. When you see inconsistent effort from players who have shown to be capable, I also question character.

Giroux is a point a game player, tied for 13th in the NHL in scoring. Horrible Season he had. Hartnell got hurt, and never fully recovered until late. Coburn didn't play well. Having a subpar Season, or getting injured, is not a character problem. Especially when all the players mentioned have played at high levels in the past. Really don't know where you get this stuff from.
- MJL

Conditioning resurfaced as an issue for Hartnell this year, along with the effects of the broken foot. He made three references to conditioning-related stuff today, two direct and one indirect. To his credit, it's something he seems serious about addressing so that it doesn't happen next season.

Regarding effects of lockout: "You sit around for a few months, you get disheartened and frustrated. Your workouts aren’t great, you miss days. Sometimes it's tough to [motivate]."

In regard to those who did play during the LO, specifically in terms of some of Chicago's top players: " I’s not like they missed a beat, you know, for the conditioning and timing and things like that."

In regard to what Flyers player need to do to get ready for next season: "Go home and watch these playoffs with fire in [my eyes], get to the gym to work out, to skate, to do things that I can do to make the team better."

I agree with about 90% of what you said. When capable players don't step up I question character. Either that or they aren't capable. When you see inconsistent effort from players who have shown to be capable, I also question character.
- section32

Or they're young and need more time to mature. Or players are placed in roles that they shouldn't be placed in, due to a shortage in an area in the makeup of the team.

I agree with about 90% of what you said. When capable players don't step up I question character. Either that or they aren't capable. When you see inconsistent effort from players who have shown to be capable, I also question character.
- section32

Lets look at Briere. By all the things you hear about him, he seems to be a great leader / locker room guy. Clearly turns it on in the playoffs every year. But why is it just the playoffs? That is a complacency issue to me. And that brings into question character. And that is all the reason you need to amnesty him.

Lets look at Briere. By all the things you hear about him, he seems to be a great leader / locker room guy. Clearly turns it on in the playoffs every year. But why is it just the playoffs? That is a complacency issue to me. And that brings into question character. And that is all the reason you need to amnesty him.
- section32

So now you are questioning Briere's character? The fact that he raises his game in the playoffs when the games mean the most, and there is more on the line. Is a credit to his character, not a negative.

Conditioning resurfaced as an issue for Hartnell this year, along with the effects of the broken foot. He made three references to conditioning-related stuff today, two direct and one indirect. To his credit, it's something he seems serious about addressing so that it doesn't happen next season.

Regarding effects of lockout: "You sit around for a few months, you get disheartened and frustrated. Your workouts aren’t great, you miss days. Sometimes it's tough to
- bmeltzer[motivate]."

In regard to those who did play during the LO, specifically in terms of some of Chicago's top players: " I’s not like they missed a beat, you know, for the conditioning and timing and things like that."

In regard to what Flyers player need to do to get ready for next season: "Go home and watch these playoffs with fire in [my eyes], get to the gym to work out, to skate, to do things that I can do to make the team better."

The Hartnell conditioning thing is disheartening. Knowing we have deficient personnel compared to the prior year you make a decision to coast? That's not veteran leadership. We are all products of our choices. This season was full of bad ones at many opportunities. It was an epic fail on many fronts starting at the top.

So now you are questioning Briere's character? The fact that he raises his game in the playoffs when the games mean the most, and there is more on the line. Is a credit to his character, not a negative.
- MJL

Not when you go into the playoffs with a very lack luster regular season. It makes you look like you are "mailing it in" for 82 games.

The Hartnell conditioning thing is disheartening. Knowing we have deficient personnel compared to the prior year you make a decision to coast? That's not veteran leadership. We are all products of our choices. This season was full of bad ones at many opportunities. It was an epic fail on many fronts starting at the top.
- section32

The conditioning issue is partially due to the fact that quite a few of the veterans, like Hartnell, Timonen and Coburn didn't play during the lockout. Then they had a week long "camp" and Hartnell was injured by game 3.

There's a difference between being in shape and being in game shape.

Or they're young and need more time to mature. Or players are placed in roles that they shouldn't be placed in, due to a shortage in an area in the makeup of the team.
- MJL

And this is the crux of my point. Homer made a judgment of the youngsters preparedness to step in and didn't get the needed help because of it. And for the most part, they weren't ready.

Not when you go into the playoffs with a very lack luster regular season. It makes you look like you are "mailing it in" for 82 games.
- section32

Pretty much every player ramps it up and plays more inspired and committed Hockey in the playoffs then the regular Season. It goes back to the excuse you used to falsely accuse JVR. They're human. 82 games is a long Season. Must be a lot of players in the NHL and all sports with character flaws.

The conditioning issue is partially due to the fact that quite a few of the veterans, like Hartnell, Timonen and Coburn didn't play during the lockout. Then they had a week long "camp" and Hartnell was injured by game 3.

There's a difference between being in shape and being in game shape.
- Jsaquella

I can understand Kimmo taking a break. He was worn out after last year. But Coburn and Hartnell get no quarter.

And this is the crux of my point. Homer made a judgment of the youngsters preparedness to step in and didn't get the needed help because of it. And for the most part, they weren't ready.
- section32

You've got it backwards. Holmgren tired to add Parise, Suter, and Weber. So he obviously tried to get the help.

Pretty much every player ramps it up and plays more inspired and committed Hockey in the playoffs then the regular Season. It goes back to the excuse you used to falsely accuse JVR. They're human. 82 games is a long Season. Must be a lot of players in the NHL and all sports with character flaws.
- MJL

I think if you look at Danny's year statistically last year, it was much more than stepping it up a notch for the playoffs. He looked 5 years younger over night.

You've got it backwards. Holmgren tired to add Parise, Suter, and Weber. So he obviously tried to get the help.
- MJL

And failed and then stopped trying. There were other UFAs still out their prior to the lockout and then some still available once the season commenced. We just didn't have the personnel this year. And the youngsters just weren't ready to be the cavalry yet.

And failed and then stopped trying. There were other UFAs still out their prior to the lockout and then some still available once the season commenced. We just didn't have the personnel this year. And the youngsters just weren't ready to be the cavalry yet.
- section32

Specifically who was still available that you would of liked Holmgren to add? How many players did Holmgren add during the Season to try and get some help? So how did he stop trying?

The problem with looking at who to blame is that everyone is culpable to some extent.

The front office went after some big fish in the FA market. That led, in part to losing two solid pieces of the 2011-12 playoff team. Despite the failures in landing Shea Weber or Ryan Suter, the Flyers still had enough talent to be a playoff team this year.

Now, that talent didn't perform very well, in a lot of cases. Part of that was that younger players were asked to carry more of a load than they could handle. Part of it was due to injuries-in fact several Flyers who played overseas during the lockout showed up for camp after dealing with injuries suffered in Europe, including Briere, Giroux and Voracek.

The thing is, with all that, I feel that the coaching staff did a poor job adapting things to better fit the players on hand. The insistence on playing an aggressive attack system not only resulted in defensive breakdowns and many turnovers, it also created an energy drain that robbed the ability to press the cycling game and create offense.

Finally, when the injuries robbed the Flyers of most of their top 6 defensemen, they made a team wide commitment to playing a less aggressive, more responsible team defense that not only led to far fewer turnovers and odd man rushes, it also saw the offensive numbers climb a bit.

Specifically who was still available that you would of liked Holmgren to add? How many players did Holmgren add during the Season to try and get some help? So how did he stop trying?
- MJL

Nobody that was top tier. I was hoping Nolan didn't go back to the Yotes. Or Gomez after he was bought out. But he went into the season saying "I like this team".

I can understand Kimmo taking a break. He was worn out after last year. But Coburn and Hartnell get no quarter.
- section32

Had nothing at all to do with taking a break, there's insurance issues, travel issues and familial issues that lead to a decision to play overseas.

Not to mention that 3 key players that did play during the lockout weren't in game shape because they suffered injuries playing in Europe.

Nobody that was top tier. I was hoping Nolan didn't go back to the Yotes. Or Gomez after he was bought out. But he went into the season saying "I like this team".
- section32

What's wrong with saying "I like this team"? Maybe you're confusing that for saying the team has all the pieces it needs, or that he done looking to improve the team. Or that he thinks the team is a Cup contender as is.

What's wrong with saying "I like this team"? Maybe you're confusing that for saying the team has all the pieces it needs, or that he done looking to improve the team. Or that he thinks the team is a Cup contender as is.
- MJL

I took it as a "cup contender as is". Clearly injuries were too much, but even fully healthy they were not performing.

Nobody that was top tier. I was hoping Nolan didn't go back to the Yotes. Or Gomez after he was bought out. But he went into the season saying "I like this team".
- section32

I'm highly doubtful that a guy like Gomez makes the Flyers a better team this year.

I also doubt that Holmgren was being totally serious when he said, "I like this team"...You don't offer $200mm dollars in contracts over the summer when you are totally happy with the team. What did you expect him to say? "(frank) these guys. We got a better chance to win a softball game against the Haddonfield Police Department than get in the playoffs"

Accepting that statement at face value is naïve. If he was happy with the team he wouldn't have tossed an offer sheet at Shea Weber. The fact he wasn't able to make a deal isn't necessarily from lack of trying. Perhaps it was a situation like with Ryane Clowe, where the price remained too high.

Hey bundy's on NBC!!!

Hey bundy's on NBC!!!
- Just5

Standards are slipping