in fairness tho saying they havent met since is also incorrect.

the tweak to how HRR was worded (thats all it was, nothing more) was pulled off the table as soon as the NHLPA objected. sneaky, meh, not really, they made a change in the proposal and it didnt fly, nothing more

this happened thursday afternoon.

they met later that evening to discuss pensions. so it didnt halt negotiations at all.

my guess is its just some reporter trying to make a big story out of an anthill.
- Dozzer

hard to believe..

my guess is its just some reporter trying to make a big story out of an anthill.
- Dozzer

That's how I feel about a lot of the optimism talk.

What is the logic behind your stance?

Before the cap -

Teams like the Habs won many in a row, then Isles, then the Oil, Pens won a couple..

After the Cap, Nobody repaets..
- bixll

No one has repeated since the 90's (detroit and pens - detroits payroll wasn't that much higher compared to the league), the other teams you are talking about won in the 80's and previous decades...when teams weren't spending huge money and payrolls were relatively the same....that argument holds no water.
Before the cap, I believe there were 3-5 teams at or above about 60 million....only one of them won a cup.
Again, having a cap system doesn't ensure a competitive balance

That's how I feel about a lot of the optimism talk.
- markmark

yeah, i am sure thats the case as well.

i expect there will be a season tho.. i just think these negotiations will be a tug of war right up until the very last possible moment.

i do think the players are asking too much by way of pensions tho.. if anything topples this all down it will be the PA not backing off of this.

blaming the owners isn't an excuse for the players?
- bobbyisno1

Sure. As I suspected, nothing.


FYI I haven't blamed the owner entirely for this. But you keep the excuses coming.

hard to believe..
- bixll

hits hits hits gotta get more hits hits hits

modern day journalism is quickly becoming a farce.

in fairness tho saying they havent met since is also incorrect.

the tweak to how HRR was worded (thats all it was, nothing more) was pulled off the table as soon as the NHLPA objected. sneaky, meh, not really, they made a change in the proposal and it didnt fly, nothing more

this happened thursday afternoon.

they met later that evening to discuss pensions. so it didnt halt negotiations at all.

my guess is its just some reporter trying to make a big story out of an anthill.
- Dozzer

There were no face to face meetings. They each met with 3rd person mediator.

There were no face to face meetings. They each met with 3rd person mediator.
- Fakepartofme

yes there was.. small group meeting.. nothing large

http://www.nydailynews.co...lockout-article-1.1232937

The league and union had a second small-group session Thursday night to discuss pensions but did not reconvene for a large-group negotiation or talk to the media.

No one has repeated since the 90's (detroit and pens - detroits payroll wasn't that much higher compared to the league), the other teams you are talking about won in the 80's and previous decades...when teams weren't spending huge money and payrolls were relatively the same....that argument holds no water.
Before the cap, I believe there 3-5 teams about 60 million....only one of them won a cup.
Again, having a cap system doesn't ensure a competitive balance
- Fakepartofme

Without a cap, how do you provide this balance then?? What would prevent the rich teams from dominating.. It is not working that great in Baseball.. Is it??

in fairness tho saying they havent met since is also incorrect.

the tweak to how HRR was worded (thats all it was, nothing more) was pulled off the table as soon as the NHLPA objected. sneaky, meh, not really, they made a change in the proposal and it didnt fly, nothing more

this happened thursday afternoon.

they met later that evening to discuss pensions. so it didnt halt negotiations at all.

my guess is its just some reporter trying to make a big story out of an anthill.
- Dozzer

They did not met last night.

in fairness tho saying they havent met since is also incorrect.

the tweak to how HRR was worded (thats all it was, nothing more) was pulled off the table as soon as the NHLPA objected. sneaky, meh, not really, they made a change in the proposal and it didnt fly, nothing more

this happened thursday afternoon.

they met later that evening to discuss pensions. so it didnt halt negotiations at all.

my guess is its just some reporter trying to make a big story out of an anthill.
- Dozzer

Pretty sure it was a bigger deal than that since Fehr immediately called ,for new vote on DOI

They did not met last night.
- burn

see my post above.

they did meet.

just didnt have a media scrum.

My fear is that Fehr sees the pensions issue as much more important than the actual players do.

A point I would agree with Fehr on, by the way.

So if NHLPA feels they deserve better pensions, but NHL feels they can't assume unfunded liabilities (both reasonable positions, imho), I don't know how they bridge that gap in 8 days.

A season does seem inevitable, though. Just a gut feeling.
- Atomic Wedgie

Yah, so far the PA's position has favoured the 50 guys making the big coin. How strong will those 50 stay on the issue of pension ...one that concerns them much less than it does others.

Pretty sure it was a bigger deal than that since Fehr immediately called ,for new vote on DOI
- Canada Cup

i am not gonna start arguing about this.

if you want to believe the over exaggerated and absurd that comes out of modern day media feel free.

not me tho.

yes there was.. small group meeting.. nothing large

http://www.nydailynews.co...lockout-article-1.1232937

The league and union had a second small-group session Thursday night to discuss pensions but did not reconvene for a large-group negotiation or talk to the media.
- Dozzer

According to 590 (Lang and Fowler- sp?) this morning, that meeting was not a face to face meeting.
So who knows, either way, no movement forward.

Without a cap, how do you provide this balance then?? What would prevent the rich teams from dominating.. It is not working that great in Baseball.. Is it??

- bixll

Lack of parity in baseball is significantly overstated. Just as many low revenue teams are in top half of standings as high revenue teams. GMs in baseball got smart.

They did not met last night.
- burn

Dude...you're making way more out of this than it needs to be. It has not halted, nor will it halt negotiations...

yes there was.. small group meeting.. nothing large

http://www.nydailynews.co...lockout-article-1.1232937

The league and union had a second small-group session Thursday night to discuss pensions but did not reconvene for a large-group negotiation or talk to the media.
- Dozzer

“@Real_ESPNLeBrun: Two sides won't meet tonight. Slated to meet with mediator in morning”

“@tpanotchCSN: No talks tonight, NHL says. Meetings resume tomorrow at 10 am.”
2013-01-03 9:06PM

I certainly am...

I want these 2 parties to sit down and realize just how much money they have pissed away......... How much they have hurt the game.... How many fans they have pissed off, and pushed away..... And, how mant years they just set the game of hockey back in the USA.

I certanly hope they don't play.
- bixll

C'mon Bixll, did you just give them both a timeout?

Pretty sure it was a bigger deal than that since Fehr immediately called ,for new vote on DOI
- Canada Cup

It's assinine to assume that's why Fehr called for another vote on DOI.

see my post above.

they did meet.

just didnt have a media scrum.
- Dozzer

See mine below.

i am not gonna start arguing about this.

if you want to believe the over exaggerated and absurd that comes out of modern day media feel free.

not me tho.
- Dozzer

Ok - find a replacement issue then. I needs me some arguing.


Edit - Pen is is here. We're covered.

Without a cap, how do you provide this balance then?? What would prevent the rich teams from dominating.. It is not working that great in Baseball.. Is it??

- bixll

Is it really working in Baseball?
Guess how many high payroll teams made the playoffs last season?
The same way you did prior to the cap.....or maybe even have a soft cap. I dont have a detailed answer for that...I just know based on the data...salary caps dont alway add competitive balance.

“@Real_ESPNLeBrun: Two sides won't meet tonight. Slated to meet with mediator in morning”

“@tpanotchCSN: No talks tonight, NHL says. Meetings resume tomorrow at 10 am.”
2013-01-03 9:06PM
- burn

So they're meeting this morning...yet it halted negotiations?

“@Real_ESPNLeBrun: Two sides won't meet tonight. Slated to meet with mediator in morning”

“@tpanotchCSN: No talks tonight, NHL says. Meetings resume tomorrow at 10 am.”
2013-01-03 9:06PM
- burn

as i said.. there was no media scrum

therefore.. most of these guys were probably sitting in their underwear in their hotel room eating pizza and tweeting.

anyways, whatever.. nothing major happened regardless.