Jared Crozier: Game Day: Ottawa @ Chicago; Karlsson rumours won't go away

trade him this year if you move him.

$6.5M caphit for 2 playoff runs is a lot more valuable than 1.

including ryan in the deal will scare all but a couple teams away. seems like a bad idea.

Trading Karlsson is stupid idea period.

Unless he return is something we would be dumb to say no too and even then I doubt fans would forgive PD

trade him this year if you move him.

$6.5M caphit for 2 playoff runs is a lot more valuable than 1.

including ryan in the deal will scare all but a couple teams away. seems like a bad idea.
- Tumbleweed

There were just talking about this on team 1200. One reiterated what you were saying.

The other argued that you frame the argument that Bobby ryan is included, no ifs ands or buts, and if teams are afraid than you say you wont do the deal, at all.

Logistically, I don't think that makes a whole lot of sense.
Adding a nother 7+ in cap hit is going to affect the dea, just from a salary position, you'd need to take something back. That doesn't even take into account Ryan as an anchor, even a team like Toronto would need to bury him, which would effect the return. Really makes no sense.

Don't include Ryan. Although with Melynk, who knows what'd happen.

He's lost a step and wont be worth the $10m a season hes going to command as a UFA. Sell now and get this rebuild started.

There were just talking about this on team 1200. One reiterated what you were saying.

The other argued that you frame the argument that Bobby ryan is included, no ifs ands or buts, and if teams are afraid than you say you wont do the deal, at all.

Logistically, I don't think that makes a whole lot of sense.
Adding a nother 7+ in cap hit is going to affect the dea, just from a salary position, you'd need to take something back. That doesn't even take into account Ryan as an anchor, even a team like Toronto would need to bury him, which would effect the return. Really makes no sense.

Don't include Ryan. Although with Melynk, who knows what'd happen.
- david22

I agree completely, no team can take almost 20 million in cap space without giving back terrible contracts. If they do trade Karlsson, there should be no stipulations(Ryan) just picks and prospects. Again none of us are Melnyk we don’t know what trade he’s concocting.

He's lost a step and wont be worth the $10m a season hes going to command as a UFA. Sell now and get this rebuild started.
- Holy_Makinaw99

Is he having a down year, or have the injuries caught up with him?

Trading him only to watch him come back after a long off season to 5+ years of peak Karlsson would hurt.

The Ryan stipulation is what really steers me away from it all. That is a heck of a cap hit for 4 years on a meh player.

If it's a reset, why not picks, Johnson or Namestnikov, Koekkoek and some choice between Raddysh, Foote, Cirelli etc?

The Ryan stipulation is what really steers me away from it all. That is a heck of a cap hit for 4 years on a meh player.

If it's a reset, why not picks, Johnson or Namestnikov, Koekkoek and some choice between Raddysh, Foote, Cirelli etc?
- OzBolts

If we are trading with Tampa, PD would be stupid not to get Hedman in return... at that point it is useless for Tampa to trade.

Almost any scenario that Karlsson leaves Ottawa, means PD should be fired. Fans would never forgive him

Is he having a down year, or have the injuries caught up with him?

Trading him only to watch him come back after a long off season to 5+ years of peak Karlsson would hurt.
- david22

But on the other hand, if you re-sign Karlsson to something like 8 years and $100M and then find out that he just can't do what he used to, that's a team crippling contract. How much time do you have to figure out if it's just a down year or if he's damaged goods? Next season is too late, the cat will be out of the bag and his trade value will be gone.

Any potential Karlsson trade would be the toughest we've seen in years. Dorian can't afford to lose this one. If Melnyk has even a notion that he might be able to force Ryan into the deal then it's going to be a disaster.

I don't envy Ottawa fans, there's no easy answer here.

Can a team give-up the assets needed to make a trade for Karlsson this season and not cripple their playoff chances?

Can a team give-up the assets needed to make a trade for Karlsson this season and not cripple their playoff chances?
- aaron12

(completely hypothetical)

Point ++ for Karlsson?

Leaves a hole at forward for Tampa...

hey... Ryan's available!


(I also realize tampa likely isn't trading Point, but i think they'd trade him before sergachev)

(completely hypothetical)

Point ++ for Karlsson?

Leaves a hole at forward for Tampa...

hey... Ryan's available!


(I also realize tampa likely isn't trading Point, but i think they'd trade him before sergachev)
- david22

Right, who would trade a player like Sergachev? Who could possibly be that stupid?

If we are trading with Tampa, PD would be stupid not to get Hedman in return... at that point it is useless for Tampa to trade.

Almost any scenario that Karlsson leaves Ottawa, means PD should be fired. Fans would never forgive him
- Maverick1818

The scenario that I have heard more than once which is Sergachev, Point and some pick or picks, is one where i think Tampa can still win some Cups, and the Sens are not really throwing in the towel like when TOR traded Kessel, because we will actually improve at forward, and we will have a bright future on the blue line. (And I am not 100% certain that Karlsson will ever be the same again, so we also dodge the bullet on a $100M contract that sucks almost right away)

I don't think Tampa has the pieces to make a deal work with Ottawa for Karlsson. Sergachev and Point are great players, but they are both just starting points.

Plus, do we really want to trade him inside of the division?

I'd be looking to Philly. They have an abundance of really strong young players, who are ready now.

What does Ottawa need? A legitimate #1 center, a #1 d-man (to replace Karlsson), and a goalie.

Nolan Patrick, Gostibehere, Carter Hart, Travis Sanheim are all very legit young players/prospects. Mind you- Gost may be untouchable, as there isn't much on that back end to begin with.

Philly also has two first round picks (21 and 22) in this year's draft.

The scenario that I have heard more than once which is Sergachev, Point and some pick or picks, is one where i think Tampa can still win some Cups, and the Sens are not really throwing in the towel like when TOR traded Kessel, because we will actually improve at forward, and we will have a bright future on the blue line. (And I am not 100% certain that Karlsson will ever be the same again, so we also dodge the bullet on a $100M contract that sucks almost right away)
- wilkobecks

Based on his current condition, Karlsson for Sergachev would be a bad swap for Tampa. They would have to really believe that Karlsson's struggles are a temporary thing (and they don't have much to base that off). Keep in mind that Kucherov's contract is up at the same time as Karlsson's. I don't see it happening.

But on the other hand, if you re-sign Karlsson to something like 8 years and $100M and then find out that he just can't do what he used to, that's a team crippling contract. How much time do you have to figure out if it's just a down year or if he's damaged goods? Next season is too late, the cat will be out of the bag and his trade value will be gone.

Any potential Karlsson trade would be the toughest we've seen in years. Dorian can't afford to lose this one. If Melnyk has even a notion that he might be able to force Ryan into the deal then it's going to be a disaster.

I don't envy Ottawa fans, there's no easy answer here.

What I don't get is that if you're shipping Karlsson out then why do you need the Ryan money off the books? You're going for a reset, see if you can ship him out separately on the cheap - he played well in the playoffs last year, that fueled Danny Brier's career for years. But keep him or lose him, why do they need the money so bad if they're even doing a semi rebuild? Duchene won't cost >8 right? Who else is commanding elite level money in the near future?

Right, who would trade a player like Sergachev? Who could possibly be that stupid?
- Jeffmt

Nobody would do that. Unless you got a chance to get a potentially decent wing

Nobody would do that. Unless you got a chance to get a potentially decent wing
- datswho

Or maybe a small winger who you think could be a center (but you're wrong)?

EDIT: If it wasn't obvious, I was making a Montreal joke.

(completely hypothetical)

Point ++ for Karlsson?

Leaves a hole at forward for Tampa...

hey... Ryan's available!


(I also realize tampa likely isn't trading Point, but i think they'd trade him before sergachev)
- david22

agreed.

what if instead they inlcuded johnson and you guys included pageau?

so something like ek & pageau for johnson, dotchkin, foote, 1st, howden.

The scenario that I have heard more than once which is Sergachev, Point and some pick or picks, is one where i think Tampa can still win some Cups, and the Sens are not really throwing in the towel like when TOR traded Kessel, because we will actually improve at forward, and we will have a bright future on the blue line. (And I am not 100% certain that Karlsson will ever be the same again, so we also dodge the bullet on a $100M contract that sucks almost right away)
- wilkobecks

I'd just like to point out that completely throwing in the towel like Toronto did seemed to work out pretty well.

I don't think Tampa has the pieces to make a deal work with Ottawa for Karlsson. Sergachev and Point are great players, but they are both just starting points.

Plus, do we really want to trade him inside of the division?

I'd be looking to Philly. They have an abundance of really strong young players, who are ready now.

What does Ottawa need? A legitimate #1 center, a #1 d-man (to replace Karlsson), and a goalie.

Nolan Patrick, Gostibehere, Carter Hart, Travis Sanheim are all very legit young players/prospects. Mind you- Gost may be untouchable, as there isn't much on that back end to begin with.

Philly also has two first round picks (21 and 22) in this year's draft.
- Jordo

We have a #1C, his name is Matt Duchene and he works very well with our #1LW Mike Hoffman.

We also have Chabot who is progressing extremely well and Dahlin on the way (See what I did there )

I'd also say Andy is serviceable for two more years maybe 3 before any big decline.

We have a #1C, his name is Matt Duchene and he works very well with our #1LW Mike Hoffman.

We also have Chabot who is progressing extremely well and Dahlin on the way (See what I did there )

I'd also say Andy is serviceable for two more years maybe 3 before any big decline.
- Maverick1818

Three years? Isn't he having a big decline right now?

We have a #1C, his name is Matt Duchene and he works very well with our #1LW Mike Hoffman.

We also have Chabot who is progressing extremely well and Dahlin on the way (See what I did there )

I'd also say Andy is serviceable for two more years maybe 3 before any big decline.
- Maverick1818

The sens are not a cap team. So, if they insist on making him part of the deal, it will prove ownership is only interested in the bottom line. Any Senator fan should not be happy about this news