Sheng Peng: Striking Stats: Kings 3/4 Season Round-Up Where does LA's power play need to improve? Pearson and Brown have outscored Carter in these key categories. Why does Sutter love Forbort? And blame Budaj?

i know it wasn't meant to be an end all, be all comment, but zatkoff's performance by itself and/or a combination of that plus some normalization in offensive numbers for kopitar, toffoli, and other top 6 players are probably the reason for being on the outside looking in right now.

Too slow. Not nearly enough team speed throughout all 4 lines and all 3 Dpairs. Might very well be the slowest team in the league. Not gonna fair well over the course of 7 games against speedy, talented teams like the Wild/Hawks. Look at how the Pens won last year. Elite team speed throughout the lineup. Speed kills.

^^^ gtfo...

And (frank) you Jeff Zatkoff. what a fraud.

Their 21st Overall Save % of .905 can be laid at the feet of the Muzzin-Martinez pairing. When those two are NOT on the ice, the team's SV% is .924. When they ARE on the ice, it drops all the way to .875. I'm not making that up. See for yourself:

https://puckalytics.com/#...&TOIMin=50&Team=LOS&Pos=D

Since it requires a lot of manual adding up and dividing to arrive at those numbers, just look at the SV% column, where you can see that Muzzin and Martinez are well below 90.5% (and right around the .875 that I said), while everyone but LaDue is way above it (and right around the .924 that I said). You can see without doing any math that those two are clearly dragging the team SV% way down.

Since that includes all situations, out of curiosity and diligence, I also calculated just the 5-on-5 values. Those are .936 when Muzzin and Martinez are NOT on the ice and .887 when they ARE. In other words, it's no better than before.

That pairing has been killing the team all season long and Sutter, the other coaches and even Lombardi have done absolutely nothing to address it. Instead of piling on and making a scapegoat out of Zatkoff, who played in only 10 games, perhaps we should hold more accountable those who have played in all or most of the 65 games and contributed to the mediocre 4-6-2 record since the last time that Zatkoff even played.

Too slow. Not nearly enough team speed throughout all 4 lines and all 3 Dpairs. Might very well be the slowest team in the league. Not gonna fair well over the course of 7 games against speedy, talented teams like the Wild/Hawks. Look at how the Pens won last year. Elite team speed throughout the lineup. Speed kills.
- SimpleJack

People have been saying that for awhile now. Kings were never a fast. But they forecheck hard on speedy teams and wear them down. The team simply just needs to freakin score more. And keep Muzzin and Amart apart.

Their 21st Overall Save % of .905 can be laid at the feet of the Muzzin-Martinez pairing. When those two are NOT on the ice, the team's SV% is .924. When they ARE on the ice, it drops all the way to .875. I'm not making that up. See for yourself:

https://puckalytics.com/#...&TOIMin=50&Team=LOS&Pos=D

Since it requires a lot of manual adding up and dividing to arrive at those numbers, just look at the SV% column, where you can see that Muzzin and Martinez are well below 90.5% (and right around the .875 that I said), while everyone but LaDue is way above it (and right around the .924 that I said). You can see without doing any math that those two are clearly dragging the team SV% way down.

Since that includes all situations, out of curiosity and diligence, I also calculated just the 5-on-5 values. Those are .936 when Muzzin and Martinez are NOT on the ice and .887 when they ARE. In other words, it's no better than before.

That pairing has been killing the team all season long and Sutter, the other coaches and even Lombardi have done absolutely nothing to address it. Instead of piling on and making a scapegoat out of Zatkoff, who played in only 10 games, perhaps we should hold more accountable those who have played in all or most of the 65 games and contributed to the mediocre 4-6-2 record since the last time that Zatkoff even played.
- Osprey

(frank) Jeff Zatkoff!! they couldn't trust him to play the 2nd of b2b because he was porous. Don't need your stats, simply watched the games. He let in several SOFT goals. If Jeff could've made the saves on the softies he let in, maybe the Kings win a few of those and are 3 pts on the good of the 8th seed.

(frank) Jeff Zatkoff!! they couldn't trust him to play the 2nd of b2b because he was porous. Don't need your stats, simply watched the games. He let in several SOFT goals. If Jeff could've made the saves on the softies he let in, maybe the Kings win a few of those and are 3 pts on the good of the 8th seed.
- Stu17

Hes not saying that Zatkoff wasn't bad. Just that the teams save % is trash. And hes simply saying that they used Zatkoff as a scapegoat for the teams poor save %. It wasn't great with Budaj in net either.

People have been saying that for awhile now. Kings were never a fast. But they forecheck hard on speedy teams and wear them down. The team simply just needs to freakin score more. And keep Muzzin and Amart apart.
- poisondhearts37

Yeah, and it's held true for a while.

I think your 2014 team, the last time you guys were truly elite, was able to win the Cup because of the added speed/skill factor. Adding guys like Pearson, Voynov, and Gaborik(who isn't nearly as effective these days) put you guys over the top.

Since then you haven't really upgraded the speed/skill department any further. And it's taking its toll IMO.

Hes not saying that Zatkoff wasn't bad. Just that the teams save % is trash. And hes simply saying that they used Zatkoff as a scapegoat for the teams poor save %. It wasn't great with Budaj in net either.
- poisondhearts37

I understand what he's saying. I'm saying he was bad. He rarely gave the team a chance to win and he hardly instilled confidence in them either. Plains and simple he was bad.

Sheng Peng: Striking Stats: Kings 3/4 Season Round-Up
Where does LA's power play need to improve? Pearson and Brown have outscored Carter in these key categories. Why does Sutter love Forbort? And blame Budaj?
- Sheng Peng

Love the last sentence on McNabb's breakdown

I understand what he's saying. I'm saying he was bad. He rarely gave the team a chance to win and he hardly instilled confidence in them either. Plains and simple he was bad.
- Stu17

100% agree. But even with a more decent back up the teams overall save % is still like .905

Too slow. Not nearly enough team speed throughout all 4 lines and all 3 Dpairs. Might very well be the slowest team in the league. Not gonna fair well over the course of 7 games against speedy, talented teams like the Wild/Hawks. Look at how the Pens won last year. Elite team speed throughout the lineup. Speed kills.
- SimpleJack

You went full retard. Never go full retard.

You went full retard. Never go full retard.
- tkecanuck341

That's what you say when someone says something retarded, not when someone says something that makes perfect sense and really can't be refuted.

Their 21st Overall Save % of .905 can be laid at the feet of the Muzzin-Martinez pairing. When those two are NOT on the ice, the team's SV% is .924. When they ARE on the ice, it drops all the way to .875. I'm not making that up. See for yourself:

https://puckalytics.com/#...&TOIMin=50&Team=LOS&Pos=D

That pairing has been killing the team all season long and Sutter, the other coaches and even Lombardi have done absolutely nothing to address it. Instead of piling on and making a scapegoat out of Zatkoff, who played in only 10 games, perhaps we should hold more accountable those who have played in all or most of the 65 games and contributed to the mediocre 4-6-2 record since the last time that Zatkoff even played.
- Osprey

I appreciate the stat, I would've included it if I had found it. Thanks! It makes sense, considering how much worse their plus-minus is compared to the team's.

However, I don't necessarily agree with your conclusion -- fully trusting that stat also suggests the team's 95.63 Save % with Matt Greene on the ice means something.

But Muzzin-Martinez have struggled in their last month or so, that I agree. Though I think Lombardi/Sutter addressed it properly. Both gave who I think are above-average defensemen some rope to get better and Sutter finally split them up when they didn't improve. I believe you have a lesser opinion of them though.

In terms of scapegoating Zatkoff, as least from my side, it's just as much a finger pointed at Lombardi for signing the wrong back-up (which happens) and letting it fester (which I don't think should've happened). I look at what Toronto did to Enroth, waiving him after just four games -- at the time, I thought they were being too harsh on Enroth -- and they were, just as we are on Zatkoff. Four games or 10 games is no fair way to judge a goalie. But it's the nature of the back-up position: You need sterling play in small sample sizes, otherwise, it can change the course of a season.

Just that the teams save % is trash. And hes simply saying that they used Zatkoff as a scapegoat for the teams poor save %. It wasn't great with Budaj in net either.
- poisondhearts37

As I mentioned, Budaj's .917 ranked 12th out of 35 qualified goalies. That's pretty good. If LA's overall save % was that high, they'd be seventh in the league in that category and most assuredly in the playoffs.

That's what you say when someone says something retarded, not when someone says something that makes perfect sense and really can't be refuted.
- SimpleJack

Except it's not true.

Carter, Pearson, Lewis, Kempe, & Dowd are all above average speed. Gaborik has slowed a bit from his 20-something self, but he's still above average. Iginla has actually surprised me with his speed for a 39 year old. I wouldn't call him exceptionally fast, but he's certainly not slow. That's half of the forwards that are not "slow" as you say.

Just because the Kings play a heavy grind game doesn't mean they're slow. Their system just doesn't rely on speed to be successful, unlike some of the defensively irresponsible run-and-gun teams in the East.

Yeah, and it's held true for a while.

I think your 2014 team, the last time you guys were truly elite, was able to win the Cup because of the added speed/skill factor. Adding guys like Pearson, Voynov, and Gaborik(who isn't nearly as effective these days) put you guys over the top.

Since then you haven't really upgraded the speed/skill department any further. And it's taking its toll IMO.
- SimpleJack

Voynov wasn't a 2014 addition.

Skating isn't the only way a team can play fast. The puck moves faster than any player, and when the Kings are on their game they have quick and efficient breakouts and neutral zone movement that often leads to odd man rushes. Skating speed is far from their main problem this year. There are games in which the passing makes me feel physically ill, some players are absolutely snake-bit when it comes to shooting (Kopitar has to lead to the league in posts this year), and the back end is hindered by an uncharacteristically weak year from guys like Muzzin/Martinez.

If you're going to knock the Kings, at least do it informed, not with some "they're slow" cliche.

Voynov wasn't a 2014 addition.

Skating isn't the only way a team can play fast. The puck moves faster than any player, and when the Kings are on their game they have quick and efficient breakouts and neutral zone movement that often leads to odd man rushes. Skating speed is far from their main problem this year. There are games in which the passing makes me feel physically ill, some players are absolutely snake-bit when it comes to shooting (Kopitar has to lead to the league in posts this year), and the back end is hindered by an uncharacteristically weak year from guys like Muzzin/Martinez.

If you're going to knock the Kings, at least do it informed, not with some "they're slow" cliche.
- PancakesPenner

this. sheng's written more than one article about the kings team speed. some games when they're clicking on breakouts and hitting guys in stride, its a thing of beauty. all too often this season, passes have misfired and guys aren't on the same page. chalk that up to the high level of turnover (all the UFA's signed now waived and kids from Ontario fitting in)?

maddening to me is the lack of urgency against the teams who are out of the playoffs. and please just waive gaborik and give someone else a real shot like brodz or mersch when healthy...or maybe even having kempe stay with kopi for more than a hot minute?

Except it's not true.

Carter, Pearson, Lewis, Kempe, & Dowd are all above average speed. Gaborik has slowed a bit from his 20-something self, but he's still above average. Iginla has actually surprised me with his speed for a 39 year old. I wouldn't call him exceptionally fast, but he's certainly not slow. That's half of the forwards that are not "slow" as you say.

Just because the Kings play a heavy grind game doesn't mean they're slow. Their system just doesn't rely on speed to be successful, unlike some of the defensively irresponsible run-and-gun teams in the East.
- tkecanuck341

Wow.

I had no idea you guys were in such denial when it comes to your weakness(team speed). Tell me, why do you think you guys play a heavy grind style?

Wake up. Iginla in slow. Your team is slow. And it's gonna be your downfall again. Have fun watching the rest of the contenders skate circles around you. If you even make the playoffs.

Wow.

I had no idea you guys were in such denial when it comes to your weakness(team speed). Tell me, why do you think you guys play a heavy grind style?

Wake up. Iginla in slow. Your team is slow. And it's gonna be your downfall again. Have fun watching the rest of the contenders skate circles around you. If you even make the playoffs.
- SimpleJack

Because it wins championships....and it beats the Blackhawks. They played the same system with mostly the same players in 2014, and took out Chicago in a seven-game series. Two of the fastest players on the current roster (Dowd, Kempe) weren't on that team either. Notable missing players from 2014: Jarret Stoll, Justin Williams, Mike Richards, Dwight King, Robyn Regehr, Willie Mitchell....all "slow" players. If anything, the Kings have gotten faster since then.

There's a reason that the Kings win the underlying stats battle every year and are favorites of analytics fanboys like Tanner. Their system works. Lombardi acquired players that fit into the system, he didn't build the system around the players.

Wow.

I had no idea you guys were in such denial when it comes to your weakness(team speed). Tell me, why do you think you guys play a heavy grind style?

Wake up. Iginla in slow. Your team is slow. And it's gonna be your downfall again. Have fun watching the rest of the contenders skate circles around you. If you even make the playoffs.
- SimpleJack

I don't think it's a speed thing but skillset thing. I've always said that the Blackhawks have insane skill and that has allowed them to mesh together throughout this season. They win games they shouldn't due to their skill. Let's face it, other then Carter and maybe Pearson, nobodies able to put the puck into the net for L A. The Kings actually have become a little faster although Muzzin and McNabb seem to be in cement shoes a lot of the time.

Wow.

I had no idea you guys were in such denial when it comes to your weakness(team speed). Tell me, why do you think you guys play a heavy grind style?

Wake up. Iginla in slow. Your team is slow. And it's gonna be your downfall again. Have fun watching the rest of the contenders skate circles around you. If you even make the playoffs.
- SimpleJack

Hey Simplejack, do you really think if I went over to your blog and started spouting negativity I would last very long? JJ would boot me out and rightly so! Have some class and don't hit us when we're already down!

On the topic of team speed, I have to agree with SimpleJack. They're not a fast team and they've always had problems with teams that are. Now, most teams have gotten faster because they've learned that the way to counter strong, physical teams like LA is by going around them. Hitting and wearing a team down doesn't work so well if their players slip by your hits.

LA has gotten faster since their Cup years, but not enough to be called a fast team, especially relative to the improvements that other teams have made. Gaborik can be fast, but he's old and has to carefully choose when and where to be, so his jets are off most of the time. Kempe is young and plays with a lot more consistent jump, but he's not that fast of a player. He just may seem so relative to the rest of the team. Lewis and Dowd have some speed, but it's not like it's a problem for other teams, since it doesn't translate to production very often. Pearson is probably the best that they have, but he's one player. Perhaps they'd have more like him if they hadn't traded away so many prospects and picks.

Whether the players, themselves, are fast enough may not be the real issue, though. It may be mostly that the system that they play is not based on speed. It's based on physicality, shooting from anywhere and scoring through traffic and rebounds. They don't score off of the rush. They score off of the cycle. It's a slow system, which is maybe why slow players fit it like a glove in past years. The system isn't working like it once did, though, because teams have figured it out and Lombardi and Sutter have either not done enough quickly enough to adapt or have botched it.

Hes not saying that Zatkoff wasn't bad. Just that the teams save % is trash. And hes simply saying that they used Zatkoff as a scapegoat for the teams poor save %. It wasn't great with Budaj in net either.
- poisondhearts37

Thanks. Yes, I'm not saying that Zatkoff wasn't bad. It's just that Zatkoff playing at Budaj's level would've only gotten them into a wildcard spot, but if Muzzin and Martinez were defending at around the level of everyone else (~0.924), they'd be firmly in a top-3 divisional spot, perhaps even leading the division. In fact, I just calculated that an average of 0.924 would mean only 128 goals against. That would be the lowest total in the league and, instead of a -3 goal differential, they'd have a +33 goal differential, which would be the best in the Pacific and 7th-best league-wide. I'm not saying to not complain about the bad backup goaltender, but putting the focus there is settling for being a wildcard team and disregarding the issues that have kept them back from being more than that.

However, I don't necessarily agree with your conclusion -- fully trusting that stat also suggests the team's 95.63 Save % with Matt Greene on the ice means something.
- Sheng Peng

Well, it does mean something. It means that Greene is not any part of the reason why the team has the 21st-best SV%. His 7 goals allowed in 26 games are not what's dragging the team's SV% down. That doesn't mean that he needs more ice time--perhaps playing in fewer than half of the games and being sheltered in them is all that he can handle--or that he's not a liability in other ways, though.

This is where it helps to check other stats to see what's going on. Greene has the worst CA/60 among defenders and the second-worst CF%. Especially for someone playing sheltered minutes against the lowest quality of competition, those aren't good. He may not be technically hurting the team on the scoreboard, but that doesn't mean that he's helping them. Even if he's doing an admirable job keeping pucks out of his net, if he's spending most of his time in his own zone and isn't supporting the offense, then he can still be hurting the team, or, at least, that's what can explain him being in the doghouse of this particular coach.

But Muzzin-Martinez have struggled in their last month or so, that I agree.
- Sheng Peng

You don't get the stats that I showed from just one bad month, and I've been following these stats all season, besides. They've struggled defensively all season long.

In terms of scapegoating Zatkoff, as least from my side, it's just as much a finger pointed at Lombardi for signing the wrong back-up (which happens) and letting it fester (which I don't think should've happened).
- Sheng Peng

I definitely agree. I wasn't a fan of the signing in the first place, but letting the problem grow was the greater sin. After Quick went down and Zatkoff looked shaky in net, Lombardi should've made a move for a goaltender, around November/December. He didn't sign Zatkoff to be the season-long backup, after all. He signed him to play most of the season in the AHL and be a short term NHL backup in the event of injury. Lombardi should've acquired at least another Budaj-level goalie and then had him and Budaj compete against each other for playing time. That probably would've made Budaj better. Instead, with Zatkoff losing the trust of the coach, Budaj knew that he could let in stinkers and still get the next game and the next game after that. It also just looks like even more of bad call on Lombardi's part considering that he eventually did trade for goalie... after the damage was already done.

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