Mark Spizzirri: GAMEDAY: Coyotes vs. Red Wings; tough week ahead for Detroit

Cleary - Andersson - Bertuzzi
Miller - Emmerton - Samuelsson

I hate these 3rd and 4th lines so much. I wish Tatar, Andersson, and Nyquist was a line every night. Samuelsson feels less competitive than he used to be. Bert, even though he can score in the shootouts, hasn't had the grit since his recent stream of injuries. Miller has always been a soso player to me. Even though Cleary played well last playoffs, I didn't like spending money on him when we have solid players with healthy scratches. Emmerton is like a younger Miller. Maybe I don't know what I am talking about, but I would much rather have Filps back over Alfie, and Brunner over Cleary. I liked our team much more last season, so I hope these guys can start producing and proving their worth. Brunner and Filps are both doing well where they are.

I have to agree. Not only have Bertuzzi-Andersson-Cleary been useless offensively, but they've combined for -11. They've been on the ice for nearly every goal against (as have Quincey-Smith). I love Bertuzzi and Cleary just as much as the next guy, but they can't keep up.

Right now, the third line on both ends is totally unreliable. I imagine just about everyone would like to see Nyquist and Tatar playing Andersson's wings, but Babcock and Holland call the shots. I hope they prove us all wrong, but it's hard not to question their thinking lately.

What do I know? We're three games in, and it's a sucky sample size. I'm not the coach or the GM, and the Wings are definitely better off that way.

Cleary - Andersson - Bertuzzi
Miller - Emmerton - Samuelsson

I hate these 3rd and 4th lines so much. I wish Tatar, Andersson, and Nyquist was a line every night. Samuelsson feels less competitive than he used to be. Bert, even though he can score in the shootouts, hasn't had the grit since his recent stream of injuries. Miller has always been a soso player to me. Even though Cleary played well last playoffs, I didn't like spending money on him when we have solid players with healthy scratches. Emmerton is like a younger Miller. Maybe I don't know what I am talking about, but I would much rather have Filps back over Alfie, and Brunner over Cleary. I liked our team much more last season, so I hope these guys can start producing and proving their worth. Brunner and Filps are both doing well where they are.
- Crbr9

Totally agree. There is a boat load of washed up players playing when young budding stars are sitting. Bertuzzi, Samuelsson, Cleary, Emmerton, Miller and Eaves are all not as good as the young Tatar, Nyquist and Anderson line. This will all take care of itself in time but it is a shame watching washed up guys when young talent is ready.

I have to agree. Not only have Bertuzzi-Andersson-Cleary been useless offensively, but they've combined for -11. They've been on the ice for nearly every goal against (as have Quincey-Smith). I love Bertuzzi and Cleary just as much as the next guy, but they can't keep up.

Right now, the third line on both ends is totally unreliable. I imagine just about everyone would like to see Nyquist and Tatar playing Andersson's wings, but Babcock and Holland call the shots. I hope they prove us all wrong, but it's hard not to question their thinking lately.

What do I know? We're three games in, and it's a sucky sample size. I'm not the coach or the GM, and the Wings are definitely better off that way.
- Craola

One more thing, I would even try Tatar with Dats and Zetterberg, the guy is a pure sniper, put him in a positon to succeed and he will. I like #8 for his compete and grit but talent wise TT is a better scoring option. But then again I am just a fan of the game. Babcock really likes older players but one day he will have to get these young guys into the lineup.

during this string of games 2 things need to happen

-PP needs to get going
-the bottom 3 lines need to produce more.

One more thing, I would even try Tatar with Dats and Zetterberg, the guy is a pure sniper, put him in a positon to succeed and he will. I like #8 for his compete and grit but talent wise TT is a better scoring option. But then again I am just a fan of the game. Babcock really likes older players but one day he will have to get these young guys into the lineup.
- flyerdude17

babock wont do that. he will play these vets til the end.

I'd have to agree with the comments so far. Although there have been times the 4th line has impressed me with their hard work, its not ideal for me. I do agree that Babs and KH probably know more than me but my desire would be for nyquist and tatar to be in. I do not think it's fair to judge tatar on the 4th line because that's not where he is effective. I dont mind the top two lines.... but i'd like to see

nyquist - andy - tats
Miller - emmerton - Sammy/Bert

(naturally with eaves and helm healthy, andy would drop to fourth line center and eaves on the 4th line wing)

I still believe alfie and weiss are an upgrade. Fil was always good but never lived up to hype and wasnt strong on the puck at all. I agree Cleary was a bad move just because the log jam and he isn't what he used to be. Brunner wasn't worth what he got paid, lets all remember he started with 10 goals last year and cooled down so this isn't new. Also just because the guy takes 10 shots a game doesn't mean he is effective when he is getting pushed off the puck wayyy too easily. I liked him don't get me wrong but he is very soft on the puck and I'm okay with letting him go.

Let's hope that the young guns can crack the line up soon if Sammy or Bert or Cleary pull a groin or something they need to step in and make it count.

just. fawking. terrible.

I know it's early, but my cripes - a little bit of urgency would be nice.

What a limp, half-assed performance by everyone. The only one who looked like he gave a poop was Dekeyser, well Howard too. We need Helm to inject some damn energy into the group....Pav even looked disinterested.

What a limp, half-assed performance by everyone. The only one who looked like he gave a poop was Dekeyser, well Howard too. We need Helm to inject some damn energy into the group....Pav even looked disinterested.
- MartyBurk

too worried about the Tigers game.

Franzne, Alfredsson=no goals

powerplay hasnt scored yet.

the younger skaters are looking better then the vets at this point. besides the top line that is

Wings looked like total crap. They deserved to lose. Phoenix played hard for a full 60 minutes and applied good pressure for most of the game. They also forechecked. Once again... the Wings can't score more than two goals.

Makes me wonder how long this stupid idea of Cleary, Bertuzzi and Samuelsson on the bottom six will last. They suck ! No energy, no speed.. NO Goals.

Babcock better get the young guys in the lineup and generate some energy, speed and GOALS. The line combinations are terrible. I'm still not completley sold that getting Alfredsson for one year at 5 million was a great idea. He had a terrible giveaway that generated one of the Phoenix goals.

Wings looked like total crap. They deserved to lose. Phoenix played hard for a full 60 minutes and applied good pressure for most of the game. They also forechecked. Once again... the Wings can't score more than two goals.

Makes me wonder how long this stupid idea of Cleary, Bertuzzi and Samuelsson on the bottom six will last. They suck ! No energy, no speed.. NO Goals.

Babcock better get the young guys in the lineup and generate some energy, speed and GOALS. The line combinations are terrible. I'm still not completley sold that getting Alfredsson for one year at 5 million was a great idea. He had a terrible giveaway that generated one of the Phoenix goals.
- Vladdie_Kon1

I like Alfie and i'm glad they got him but he's not being used properly. His line with Weiss and Franzen have zero chemistry. Yes it's early but I don't seen anything from that line that gives me hope it could be good so far and Alfie seems to go better with Datsyuk and Z...not to mention Abdelkader seems to screw up the many scoring chances those two create for him. Alfie also shouldn't play the point on the PP, instead he should be along the top of the circles for the one timer just like most of his time in Ottawa.

Franzy was so lazy and lost tonight. That 2nd PP unit is a complete joke. Babcock needs to seriously change up the lines because the only thing going right now is the 1st line. That defense pairing of Smith and Quincey isn't good either. Babcock doesn't have that many options with Holland's dumb moves of keeping too many past their prime vets and no cap space.

One more thing, I would even try Tatar with Dats and Zetterberg, the guy is a pure sniper, put him in a positon to succeed and he will. I like #8 for his compete and grit but talent wise TT is a better scoring option. But then again I am just a fan of the game. Babcock really likes older players but one day he will have to get these young guys into the lineup.
- flyerdude17

Preach it!

I would love to see either Tatar or Nyquist get an extended chance with Datsyuk or Zetterberg. The main argument I've seen is that you need to include some grit with the finesse, and sure I agree with that in general but why not at least try it out for a game or 2 to see if it clicks. They've each had a shift or half a period here and there with either, but nothing long enough to get something good going. They've both played a decent amount with the wings by now, but it's almost always been with scrub wingers or minimal ice time, would love to see them get a legitimate shot with some top NHL talent.

That's a pipe dream it seems, but at least let them roll as the third unit. They look a hell of a lot more dangerous than Cleary/Bertuzzi/Samuelsson.

ill tell u one thing
Franzen sucks the life outta this team. floating around, skating like hes day dreaming. put Nyquist or Tatar with Weiss and Alfred.

samuelsson,bertuzzi and so on. too many lazy old (frank)ers on this team who provide no energy or worth ethic.

ill tell u one thing
Franzen sucks the life outta this team. floating around, skating like hes day dreaming. put Nyquist or Tatar with Weiss and Alfred.

samuelsson,bertuzzi and so on. too many lazy old (frank)ers on this team who provide no energy or worth ethic.
- wingz4life

agreed.

Abbey / Datsyuk / Zetterberg
Eaves / Weiss / Alfredsson
Nyquist / Andersson / Tatar
Franzen / Emmerton / Miller
(out --> Cleary/Samuelsson / Bertuzzi)

Defence can stay the way it is.

we need goals, but I think Tootoo should be back in to get some energy going.

Here are the line combinations I like. Would like to see Babcock give this a try.

Datsyuk - Zetterberg - Alfredson
Eaves - Weiss - Franzen
Nyquist - Andersson - Tatar
Abdelkader - Emmerton - Miller

Out => Cleary/Samuelsson / Bertuzzi
IR => Helm, Tootoo

Defense stays the same as is.

Since Helm is out I can't put him on the same line with Eaves and Miller (which is what I would make the 4th line). I like the idea of Giving Eaves a shot on the second line because his speed adds some energy and gives him a chance to score. Babcock's and Holland's loyalty to the old Vets is very frustrating as it's hurting the team. This team can roll 4 good lines without Sammy, Bert, and Cleary in the lineup. We could use any of them in the case of injury. This team needs to utilize it's SPEED to improve their transition game. Also... the defense needs to add more offense if this team is going to go anywhere in the playoffs.