Matt Karash: Are the stars aligning for a Jeff Skinner for Marc Staal trade?

Anyone in 'Canes land interested in Mark Giordano + for your 1st? What is the asking price for McBain? Is there a possibility for a Gio + for your 1st & McBain and if so, what else do we have to add to make it happen?

I'm at the point now where I'd actually be shocked if this trade doesn't happen now.

Unfortunately, I have zero confidence right now that Rutherford won't overplay his hand on this. Something like Skinner AND Ryan Murphy for a player who I think is ostensibly a Cane no matter what in 2 seasons.

I'm all for adding Marc Staal to the lineup, and not just because he's a Staal but because he's exactly the kind of defenseman the Canes need. I really wish it was possible to do so without dealing a player like Skinner, but I fear that Rutherford may have already set a precedent to other teams with his press conference comments last week - basically where he stated he was willing to trade a a top 6 forward to get a talent d man and even went as far as insinuating that the forward would be Skinner.

WHAT!?
Are you guys serious right now? Trade Skinner?

Anyone in 'Canes land interested in Mark Giordano + for your 1st? What is the asking price for McBain? Is there a possibility for a Gio + for your 1st & McBain and if so, what else do we have to add to make it happen?
- TandA4Flames

McBain is almost certainly going to be dealt this offseason. Again, maybe as part of a package deal for Staal.

However, I don't see anyway the Canes part with their first round pick. Would have to be for a major haul.

Then the Canes could truly be the laughing stock of the league.

E is the only very good Staal. Marc is decent Jordan is and will always be a good 3rd line center and Jared shouldn't even be in the NHL.

Be careful of becoming a sideshow. The Sedin's can't produce at all in the playoffs. I'd expect the result to be worse with the Staal's.

Eric > Skinner > Marc > Jordan > Jared

McBain is almost certainly going to be dealt this offseason. Again, maybe as part of a package deal for Staal.

However, I don't see anyway the Canes part with their first round pick. Would have to be for a major haul.
- Gossler1

That's what I figured.

What do you have for any potential buyouts or salary dump trades?

Then the Canes could truly be the laughing stock of the league.

E is the only very good Staal. Marc is decent Jordan is and will always be a good 3rd line center and Jared shouldn't even be in the NHL.

Be careful of becoming a sideshow. The Sedin's can't produce at all in the playoffs. I'd expect the result to be worse with the Staal's.

Eric > Skinner > Marc > Jordan > Jared
- Sell My Monkey

The Jared call up was a late season move. It was a hat tip to a guy who had been working hard in the AHL and a nice gesture to the brothers after a tough season. I wouldn't read anything more into it than that. I don't think the Carolina front office actually believes he belongs in the NHL.

How about a trade of two guys who struggled last season?

Skinner for Myers from Buffalo?

McBain is almost certainly going to be dealt this offseason. Again, maybe as part of a package deal for Staal.

However, I don't see anyway the Canes part with their first round pick. Would have to be for a major haul.
- Gossler1

I think Gossler nailed it. McBain is likely gone for something either as part of a package or otherwise just jettisoned. He just hasn't worked out, and the patience is gone.

I also agree on the #1 pick. I think it is pretty much untouchable because it is high enough to get a probable 2013-14 roster contributor playing for a reasonable price. The Canes are suddenly pushing closer to the cap ceiling, so trading a pick that should become a relatively cheap top 6 forward for an expensive veteran just doesn't work math-wise and having given up last year's #1 in the JStaal deal, the organization desperately needs to restock some quality youth.

How about a trade of two guys who struggled last season?

Skinner for Myers from Buffalo?
- kingcong39

I think Myers as a future could be interesting to Rutherford (big young, top 4 "possible" dman), but there are 2 problems.

1) At $5.5M/year, he isn't priced as a developing young defenseman. He is priced as a sure thing that you can plug into your top pairing to win regularly agains the other team's best. From what I have seen and read about Myers, he played nowhere close to this level in 2013. The games I saw he looked not much better than your typical, young with potential but very clearly still learning dman. Those aren't worth $5.5M/year. I realize that you can say some of the same with Skinner, but as a skilled forward you are looking more for skilled scoring which he did for stretches this year.

2) Because of the issues above, no way would Skinner go the other way in the deal.

Ah no.......we don't need to add another Staal brother to the little country club.Especially not at the expense of Skinner.

Matt, I think the blog poses a potentially mutually beneficial scenario, both for the Rangers and Canes. The Rangers need to start exploring what Marc Staal's future intentions are this year, and if he is unwilling to sign long term, than they need to take that as a sign of his possible intentions and explore a getting a good deal earlier enough where they can get a good return.

I have though about the same exact deal on several occassions, and I think those two players could potentially serve as the main principles in a deal, but the Rangers need to focus on building their defensive core a little if they really are thinking about moving Marc Staal.

How about a trade of two guys who struggled last season?

Skinner for Myers from Buffalo?
- kingcong39

More potential for the 'Canes to lose that trade IMO. BUF would have to add.

Seems like the Canes top 6 forward plan for the next few years is going to look like:

Semin-Staal-Tlusty
Ruutu-Staal-2013 1st Round Pick (likely a power forward type)

That leaves Skinner and his +$5mil salary stuck on the third line. A third line that would have to be built around his unique set of skills. Currently, the Canes have 0-1 players who could probably play well with Skinner on that third line.

As much as I love Skinner and would like to see him as a Cane for life, I think the writing may be on the wall here. Canes could trade for Marc, save about a million dollars for the next year or two in the process and then go about using their reamaining cap space to spend on bulking up the 3rd and 4th lines. A much easier/cost effective thing to find in free agency than a top 2 dman.

I really like Marc Staal, but trading skinner isn't a good idea. Not unless the return is Staal +.

I really like Marc Staal, but trading skinner isn't a good idea. Not unless the return is Staal +.
- mykokes

It is amazing how opinions differ, because I think the Canes would have to throw in a little sweetner to get Staal, only because I put more value in lock-down defensemen (which I think Staal) is, then I put in to talented forwards that somewhat on the smallish side.

Staal does not to stay healthy, however.

It is amazing how opinions differ, because I think the Canes would have to throw in a little sweetner to get Staal, only because I put more value in lock-down defensemen (which I think Staal) is, then I put in to talented forwards that somewhat on the smallish side.

Staal does not to stay healthy, however.
- Pete V

it's hard to say. While I tend to agree with you on these two players' values, Skinner's upside is tremendous. Small player, but his skating ability is absolutely incredible. Put him on a line with someone like Clowe though, and he gets protected and has a linemate capable of putting up numbers with him.

I think Staal is one of the best d-men in the league, while Skinner has the potential to be a top-flight forward. If not, a solid top-6 contributor.

both have injury issues.

it's hard to say. While I tend to agree with you on these two players' values, Skinner's upside is tremendous. Small player, but his skating ability is absolutely incredible. Put him on a line with someone like Clowe though, and he gets protected and has a linemate capable of putting up numbers with him.

I think Staal is one of the best d-men in the league, while Skinner has the potential to be a top-flight forward. If not, a solid top-6 contributor.

both have injury issues.
- Blackstrom2

I think your post actually captures the essense of why it may be a decent deal. Neither team would killed in the deal. Actually a decent hockey trade if the Rangers were worried about retaining him as an UFA.

Smarter move may be to move Jordan Staal. He would get you a bigger return. Skinner has a small and unimpressive body of work beyond a promising rookie season. I think he will continue to develop into a star, but if the only reason you are looking to move him is because he doesn't fit onto J Staal's wing, then I might question Staal's offensive accumen to be on the second line more so than Skinner's.

To Edmonton, for instance, Staal would fetch a package in the ball park of Sam Gagner, Shawn Horcoff, and the #7 overall draft pick. You're probably laughing your ass off right now at the homerism of that proposal, but Gagner is a solid 2nd line centre that puts up points and would mesh well on a line with Skinner. He is an RFA so you could lock him up long-term. Horcoff is a solid two-way centre to play the third line. He has a big cap hit (which Carolina could handle), but only averages 3.5M in actual salary over two more years, an ok number for a solid 3rd line two-way centre. And the #7 overall is nothing to sneeze at. Who knows... package it up with Carolina's pick and you could tempt Colorado into turning over the #1 overall to land Seth Jones.

I know trading Staal instead of Skinner is unlikely due to the backlash that would likely come from Eric Staal, but it's probably the smarter choice in the long run.

Smarter move may be to move Jordan Staal. He would get you a bigger return. Skinner has a small and unimpressive body of work beyond a promising rookie season. I think he will continue to develop into a star, but if the only reason you are looking to move him is because he doesn't fit onto J Staal's wing, then I might question Staal's offensive accumen to be on the second line more so than Skinner's.

To Edmonton, for instance, Staal would fetch a package in the ball park of Sam Gagner, Shawn Horcoff, and the #7 overall draft pick. You're probably laughing your ass off right now at the homerism of that proposal, but Gagner is a solid 2nd line centre that puts up points and would mesh well on a line with Skinner. He is an RFA so you could lock him up long-term. Horcoff is a solid two-way centre to play the third line. He has a big cap hit (which Carolina could handle), but only averages 3.5M in actual salary over two more years, an ok number for a solid 3rd line two-way centre. And the #7 overall is nothing to sneeze at. Who knows... package it up with Carolina's pick and you could tempt Colorado into turning over the #1 overall to land Seth Jones.

I know trading Staal instead of Skinner is unlikely due to the backlash that would likely come from Eric Staal, but it's probably the smarter choice in the long run.
- Centacre

JStaal is part of the the long-term core right now, so it won't happen, but for the sake of hockey talk since I can't debate Canes playoff games...

You just called Horcoff a 3rd line center and then suggested the Canes should be happy to have him in that role at a $5.5M cap hit. You can find better on the open market for half that - maybe less. That is a subtraction from the deal.

I actually like Gagner and could see him fitting offensively (key disclaimer) with Skinner. Problem is that Skinner needs some size/2-way complements with him and I think same could be said for Gagner. This pairing puts 2 offense-leaning undersized guys together. Sounds more like a great power play duo than a great 2nd line.

When you net it out, this deal is JStaal for Gagner with a decent adder in the #7 pick but also a decent minus in taking Horcoff's contract. We might actually take Horcoff for nothing in trade if/when Edmonton bites the bullet and buys out his contract.

Where do I sign up for this?

Where do I sign up for this?
- MidnightMarauder

I'll second the fact that I think this deal would be a slam dunk for the Rangers.

The Rangers can always go and fill a hole on D be splashing around some money in free agency. And, let's face it, Henrik can mask a lot of defensive woes.

When you take into account the fact that Marc Staal is experienced some decreased vision right now and is probably gone in 2 seasons, it's a pretty easy deal for the Rangers...

And of course, Rutherford will serve it right up to them on a silver platter.

I'll second the fact that I think this deal would be a slam dunk for the Rangers.

The Rangers can always go and fill a hole on D be splashing around some money in free agency. And, let's face it, Henrik can mask a lot of defensive woes.

When you take into account the fact that Marc Staal is experienced some decreased vision right now and is probably gone in 2 seasons, it's a pretty easy deal for the Rangers...

And of course, Rutherford will serve it right up to them on a silver platter.
- Gossler1

I think it is a pretty even up hockey trade, but I do think that the Rangers can really take advantage of the Canes desire to get this deal done. I would actually prefer expanding the deal, and adding Ryan Murphy and Chris Kreider. The Rangers need a right handed shot on the PP, and Murphy has the potential to fill that void, although his numbers have decreased a little over the last two years. I think Kreider and Murphy are two high ceiling prospects, that also both have some bust potential.

I fully understand, however, that the Canes wouldn't want to move Murphy.

I think it is a pretty even up hockey trade, but I do think that the Rangers can really take advantage of the Canes desire to get this deal done. I would actually prefer expanding the deal, and adding Ryan Murphy and Chris Kreider. The Rangers need a right handed shot on the PP, and Murphy has the potential to fill that void, although his numbers have decreased a little over the last two years. I think Kreider and Murphy are two high ceiling prospects, that also both have some bust potential.

I fully understand, however, that the Canes wouldn't want to move Murphy.
- Pete V

A more likely scenario would be McBain going with Skinner for a reasonably priced defensive third line forward coming back. I can't see Rutherford moving Murphy before seeing him play at least a full season in the NHL/AHL.