Interesting option. I think Nashville would agree to that.

Schenn bros for Weber is fair given the money situation.
- psoneill

nashville can say you gave up Lupul Sbisa, 2 firsts and a 3rd for a 34 year Pronger. If you really want Weber and not have us match, it will be both Schenns and 2 firsts. Not saying I want to see the Schenns go

If I'm Holmgren I don't offer anything. Match or don't match. The Flyers team is pretty set. Nashville is the desperate team here.
- stveshdy

They would have to move some pieces though. This puts them against the cap without signing Jake or MAB. If you have to move something anyway, why not at least get the picks back.
Actually, I would rather get Nashville's picks coming back.
Like nashville 's for 2014.

Thank you, thank you, thank you. It is unbelievable how people have distorted the numbers. People keep talking in terms of $27m for one year. But, it is $27m paid over 12 months that covers two years of services. In terms of asset value, Weber is Nashvilles most valuable asset. This is a classic case of asset retention. A small shareholder loan and subsequent recapitalization puts everything on a solid footing. If the current owners feel squeezed, it is even more important for them to recapitalize the team for subsequent sale. From a pure business perspective it would be ludicrous for Nashville not to match.

The only reason they don't match is if Holmgren makes them a very strong offer, much better than four first round picks.
- spatso

Fact is, Nashville would have to pay $13mm upfront. For a team that reported lost $7mm last year, that means being $20mm in the hole before a game is played. Now, factor in a lockout. Then factor in that Nashville's reported ticket revenue was $26mm in a season where they got to the second round of the playoffs.

Also, the second $13mm payment comes due next July 1st. if the Preds have the same losses they had this year, which is probably an optimistic estimate, they're faced with dropping another $13mm on July 1st on top of those losses.

It's not a distortion of the numbers. It's possible a loan could tide them over, but it's also possible that the bean counters will argue that with the CBA uncertainty added to potential losses that they can't match.

Weber at 6M per year in 7 years will be a joke. That's what I mean by way less. Huge investment in the beginning, but advantageous long term. Will they invest? I would. It's Shea Weber.
- Habs Rule

If Weber is as good in seven years as he is now, then $6 million will be a joke. But there is no guarantee. If I'm a fan pretending to be an owner, I take that risk. However, if I'm actually on the hook to write the checks, I would take a week to really think it over.

I think a lot of us are dismissing something right off the bat. Flyers brass are more than capable at crunching numbers. They are more likely to know the limits of the Preds purse than us. There is a specific reason the first 6 years are so high. WAIT.. be patient, and most of all DONT BUDGE.
- jak521

No question. You think the Flyers don't have an idea of what Nashville can spend. The Flyers are pushing them to the limits now they have to wait and see if the Preds are willing to risk everything.

Then, as Jsaq mentioned, why wasn't this deal already done a year ago, when they could have also still enticed Suter to stay? It just sounds so easy
- eayost

great point. if they have the money, why not have done it a year ago and still possibly have both. will the flyers be over the cap if they sign him?

how are they going to pay him 27 million when they don't even bring in that much in ticket sales?
- flyersfan51

Exactly the same way as the Flyers would.

They would have to move some pieces though. This puts them against the cap without signing Jake or MAB. If you have to move something anyway, why not at least get the picks back.
Actually, I would rather get Nashville's picks coming back.
Like nashville 's for 2014.
- nails

No way Nashville is going to give up their draft pick knowing its possible it could be in top 10 at least. The Flyers want Weber. They didn't sign him to offer sheet to have Nashville match. I think this helped give the Flyers an advantage but still need to work something out for Nashville to decide NOT to match

nashville can say you gave up Lupul Sbisa, 2 firsts and a 3rd for a 34 year Pronger. If you really want Weber and not have us match, it will be both Schenns and 2 firsts. Not saying I want to see the Schenns go
- sulshawn

no way -- Homer already said he's not giving away our core. they'll either get weber and lose the picks or he stays in nashville and the flyers team stays the way it is.

They would have to move some pieces though. This puts them against the cap without signing Jake or MAB. If you have to move something anyway, why not at least get the picks back.
Actually, I would rather get Nashville's picks coming back.
Like nashville 's for 2014.
- nails

Cause I dont feel the Flyers need to throw a life line out to Nashville. Either match the offer and deal with that massive contract of Weber or let him go. The Flyers can find other teams to trade with also to move players.

Not saying I would want to that happen, but it wouldn't surprise me.

Obviously, Homer wasn't including both Brayden and Couturier in a trade. I still think a defenseman would be included in a deal since Nashville lost Suter and would lose Weber and have 4 NHL ready D.

That would leave the possibilities of Coburn-Mez-Luke and Bourdon. Bourdon isn't enough. Mez is coming off back surgery. That leaves Coburn or Luke. I think Nsh would rather have a proven Coburn but would gladly like Luke.

The Flyers want Weber so Nashville is going to try and get as much as they can to NOT match the offer. Getting both Schenns and the draft picks would allow Nashville to accept the loss of Weber easier. Again, not saying I want this to happen as a Flyers fan, but it wouldn't surprise me. Also looked at what Flyers gave up for a 34 year Pronger in Lupul, Sbisa, and 2 first round picks and a 3rd. To say the Flyers would give both Schenns and 2 firsts to get a 26 year Weber (so Nashville doesn't match) isn't crazy
- sulshawn

It truly is a game of poker. Time will tell who has the better hand. If poille wasnt bluffing this offer would have been matched...Them taking the time to discuss means that they dont have the financial means to make this happen yet. In the end what they have to think about is it worth becoming the next phoenix just to keep weber.

Definitely. Losing Weber too would make it worse, but the absolute worst case scenario is keeping Weber but not making the playoffs. Weber alone won't keep butts in the seats--the team still has to win. It all goes back to Bill's point about whether the Preds can put together a solid supporting cast around Rinne and Weber.
- sheerrw

Looking at the 6 year numbers on JUST Rinne and Weber... is crazy.. add in say an addition 30 mill per year (super low ball) for the rest of the team...
64 over 6 years for weber.
42 over 6 years for Rinne.
30x6 over 6 years for the rest= 180

180+64+42=286 million in 6 years... for a team who would like bring in around only 156 million in ticket sales. I understand that ticket sales are not the only way bills get paid, but that is a scarrrrrrrrry figure.

No way Nashville is going to give up their draft pick knowing its possible it could be in top 10 at least. The Flyers want Weber. They didn't sign him to offer sheet to have Nashville match. I think this helped give the Flyers an advantage but still need to work something out for Nashville to decide NOT to match
- sulshawn

Their 2014 for Jake, Metz, and maybe bourdon? They might do that. That pick is another whole season away. It might not be a top 10 by then.

Exactly the same way as the Flyers would.
- spatso

Nashville has snider who can print money lol???

nashville can say you gave up Lupul Sbisa, 2 firsts and a 3rd for a 34 year Pronger. If you really want Weber and not have us match, it will be both Schenns and 2 firsts. Not saying I want to see the Schenns go
- sulshawn

that's a little different -- anaheim could afford Pronger....seems like Nashville can't or if they can, that's about it. plus, he's saying he wants out and no parts of another rebuild.....would you want to keep a player that is saying those things?

Exactly the same way as the Flyers would.
- spatso

The predators are owned by a group of six businessmen that chipped in to keep the team in Nashville. The Flyers are owned by one of the biggest media corporations in the world, and made nearly 3 times as much money as Nashville did in ticket revenue(reportedly $70mm to the Preds $26mm).

The Predators simply do not have the ability to mtch the Flyers financially.

Of all the Predators young forwards please list the ones that would make the Flyers top 2 and 3 lines if Vorecek is dealt? Also, do they have a good young 4th line guy that ould help the Flyers 4th line.
- jstross

I honestly can't see the Preds taking Voracek since he remains unsigned. I think Schenn under contract is more attractive and they ease up on their need for Couturier to be in the deal.

nashville can say you gave up Lupul Sbisa, 2 firsts and a 3rd for a 34 year Pronger. If you really want Weber and not have us match, it will be both Schenns and 2 firsts. Not saying I want to see the Schenns go
- sulshawn

I would politely wish them the best of luck.

Fact is, Nashville would have to pay $13mm upfront. For a team that reported lost $7mm last year, that means being $20mm in the hole before a game is played. Now, factor in a lockout. Then factor in that Nashville's reported ticket revenue was $26mm in a season where they got to the second round of the playoffs.

Also, the second $13mm payment comes due next July 1st. if the Preds have the same losses they had this year, which is probably an optimistic estimate, they're faced with dropping another $13mm on July 1st on top of those losses.

It's not a distortion of the numbers. It's possible a loan could tide them over, but it's also possible that the bean counters will argue that with the CBA uncertainty added to potential losses that they can't match.
- Jsaquella

No business accountant would allow them to surrender their most valuable asset for minimal return. The impact on the overall net value of the team would be immense if Weber walks and there is no big return coming back. The bean counters, as you say, will be the first to say they have to match.

Looking at the 6 year numbers on JUST Rinne and Weber... is crazy.. add in say an addition 30 mill per year (super low ball) for the rest of the team...
64 over 6 years for weber.
42 over 6 years for Rinne.
30x6 over 6 years for the rest= 180

180+64+42=286 million in 6 years... for a team who would like bring in around only 156 million in ticket sales. I understand that ticket sales are not the only way bills get paid, but that is a scarrrrrrrrry figure.
- jak521

they would have to double the price of tickets to stay afloat. I also dont see a canadian business guy willing to to bank 130 million dollars in debt for a team thats worth 160. you dont become a millionaire by making stupid rash decisions.

The predators are owned by a group of six businessmen that chipped in to keep the team in Nashville. The Flyers are owned by one of the biggest media corporations in the world, and made nearly 3 times as much money as Nashville did in ticket revenue(reportedly $70mm to the Preds $26mm).

The Predators simply do not have the ability to mtch the Flyers financially.
- Jsaquella

All the more reason for Nashville to hold on to their most valuable asset.

Cause I dont feel the Flyers need to throw a life line out to Nashville. Either match the offer and deal with that massive contract of Weber or let him go. The Flyers can find other teams to trade with also to move players.
- stveshdy

Those picks coming back might be the best offer they get.
Flyers will be over the cap barrel and other teams aren't going to give as much value back because they know the flyers must make a move.
Honestly, if they were to send mez back, there is almost enough cap room for doan still, and that is without sending Shelley packing, finding a taker for lilja, or printers LTIR once the season starts.

that's a little different -- anaheim could afford Pronger....seems like Nashville can't or if they can, that's about it. plus, he's saying he wants out and no parts of another rebuild.....would you want to keep a player that is saying those things?
- flyersfan51

I disagree he says he wants out knowing that Nashville could match the offer and he could be there for anywheer for 1 to 14 years. I think he absolutely didn'tw ant to be in Nashville he would have forced a trade so Nashville couldn't have an opportunity to match any offer.

Additionally, the Preds could trade Weber after this year and get a bigger return than what compensation they'd receive from Philly.

Also its not that different because the similarities are the Flyers reallly really want Weber just like they did Pronger.

No business accountant would allow them to surrender their most valuable asset for minimal return. The impact on the overall net value of the team would be immense if Weber walks and there is no big return coming back. The bean counters, as you say, will be the first to say they have to match.
- spatso

Not quite. The accountants will likely look at the potential of $40mm in losses in two years time and wonder about the sustainability of a team that loses that kind of money.

No business accountant would allow them to surrender their most valuable asset for minimal return. The impact on the overall net value of the team would be immense if Weber walks and there is no big return coming back. The bean counters, as you say, will be the first to say they have to match.
- spatso

The Preds lost money with Suter and Weber. What's the drop off going to be if they lose both? How much worse will it really be? IF Nashville decides to match the offer good luck to them trying to build a team around TWO players who take up most of your money. The Flyers are in the driver seat here and need to just sit back and relax. Even if they dont get Weber, they still have a solid club and money to build.