Let's say we had Seguin instead of Kessel right now. Who's to say he would've developed properly? Who's to say we wouldn't have "Schenn'ed" him, putting an enormous amount of pressure on him to succeed, with no insulation and team success to to surround him with like Boston? Kessel at least had a couple of good years under his belt to develop into the perennial 30-goal guy he is.

Then there's Hamilton and Knight. Good prospects, verdicts still out.

Would I rather have Seguin at this point? Seguin, the kid who's developing properly (even if as a winger), yeah, probably, but we'd still need a center or if not, a scoring winger so we'd be right where we are now:

Lupul JVR/Seguin JVR/Seguin
MacArthur Grabs Kulemin
...
Phaneuf Gunnarsson
...
Hamilton Gardiner

Does that team really look that much better? Would we really be so much further ahead in the rebuild?
- gravyface

That is what bothers me about a lot of the post on here, there are those that assume players would have developed the same under a different system with more pressure, and less support.

Who is to say what might of been. I think that you can't argue that Burke took the sure thing. He was trying to do something to raise to hope of a fan base that is growing more bitter with each year the Leafs miss the playoffs.

I find we are just as quick to celebrate the signing of a guy (Versteeg) as we are to tear the same decision apart when he doesn't work out right away.

I dis-agree with some of the decisions that Brian Burke makes, there is no doubt. At the end of the day, most GMs would bow to the pressure of an extremely passionate fan base and let them cloud their judgement. I have a great deal of respect for Burke for trying to make the team better in a way that may not be popular with everyone.

Let's say we had Seguin instead of Kessel right now. Who's to say he would've developed properly? Who's to say we wouldn't have "Schenn'ed" him, putting an enormous amount of pressure on him to succeed, with no insulation and team success to to surround him with like Boston? Kessel at least had a couple of good years under his belt to develop into the perennial 30-goal guy he is.

Then there's Hamilton and Knight. Good prospects, verdicts still out.

Would I rather have Seguin at this point? Seguin, the kid who's developing properly (even if as a winger), yeah, probably, but we'd still need a center or if not, a scoring winger so we'd be right where we are now:

Lupul JVR/Seguin JVR/Seguin
MacArthur Grabs Kulemin
...
Phaneuf Gunnarsson
...
Hamilton Gardiner

Does that team really look that much better? Would we really be so much further ahead in the rebuild?
- gravyface

This x 1000

Spatso,

Just because you had some hockey epiphany and decided to be a Sens fan, did it mean you also had to turn into a total ass. Did that come with the territory, or do I have the causal relationship backwards?

You are contributing nothing to this conversation that any other troll doesn't contribute to Leafs threads on a regular basis.
- GoneFullRetard

Funny, but for thr first time in a long time I am seeing a preponderance of evidence that my opinion is actually in the majority. I can say that I understood that Burke was the problem long before it became popular opinion. Now that his failings are being openly discussed I do feel somewhat vindicated for my long held beliefs.

Wonder how accurate the twitter explosion is that Burke has a deal in place for Luongo and we are just waiting on his 'ok' to waive. I do admit I felt something was up with Holzer's 1 way contract.
- Boosinicka

Phaneuf Gunner
Liles Gardiner
Holzer Franson

Komi
Lashoff

Not much D depth left after Schenn gone....

We have to move 2 forwards though.....and a goalie if we get Lou

Love to see Doan in the blue & white...



12 YEARS AGO!!!



Let someone else overpay for him.
- As_I_See_It

This

I like you, Robin. That's why it hurts so much to know I have to kill you.
- gravyface

I like everyone cept Dozzer and Leafman.

Phaneuf Gunner
Liles Gardiner
Holzer Franson

Komi
Lashoff

Not much D depth left after Schenn gone....

We have to move 2 forwards though.....and a goalie if we get Lou
- JIMI-JAMES

Komisarek, Mac/Frattin/Kadri, pick

Here we go with the bottom of the barrel arguments that logically suppose that we are okay because someone is worse than us.

In the end it is about the scoreboard. You win enough games you make the playoffs. You lose, you miss the playoffs, you draft and develop better players, you try and improve. Good teams figure out the cycle. Some teams fall into a pit and never seem to figure it out. The Leafs have missed for eight straight years. Are they not part of that hopeless crew that does not seem to be able to shoot straight? Some people think that Burke is the answer, I believe he is part of the problem.

Do you not think that after eight straight years of missing the playoffs we would have at least one elite roster player who had been drafted and developed by the Leafs.
- spatso

I like how you're conveniently cherry-picking arguments to troll with. Bravo, you've clearly been drafted and developed like a proper troll should. I guess I should say that you're part of a "proper development strategy" for trolls?

Back on topic: how'd that work out for Florida? Columbus? They can't wait to get rid of Nash and he can't wait to leave. We have an elite roster player; his name is Phil Kessel. He's scoring goals at the same pace as guys like -- you guessed it -- Rick Nash.

As I've said before, for every PIT and CHI there's a CBJ and FL; there is no magic formula for winning.

Besides the Kessel deal (which is still debatable), what else has Burke done that's not inline with a "proper rebuild"?

Phaneuf Gunner
Liles Gardiner
Holzer Franson

Komi
Lashoff

Not much D depth left after Schenn gone....

We have to move 2 forwards though.....and a goalie if we get Lou
- JIMI-JAMES

I want Lou but not his contract. Seems the way of the new NHL that teams get stuck with these obscene contracts. I guess it is the cost of doing business though. I am still bitter that we are paying Tucker to this day.. I know it's because he was bought out .. thought I better add that so not to get lambbasted..

I like everyone cept Dozzer and Leafman.








- robin_steele264

I also have nothing against you.....for now....

The idea that the trade set the rebuild back a couple years is dumb.

I don't like the trade, but it hasn't hurt, yet. It will suck if Seguin and Hamilton turn into first line players.
- GoneFullRetard

Ya, all these people saying the Kessel trade has set us back is not true. As far as I am concerned the best player in that trade is Kessel. He had what, 80 points last year? And this is on a crappy team. Seguin is good, and maybe he will be better down the road, but right now the Kessel trade is fine. It has not set us back. JFJ set us back like 10 years...

Funny, but for thr first time in a long time I am seeing a preponderance of evidence that my opinion is actually in the majority. I can say that I understood that Burke was the problem long before it became popular opinion. Now that his failings are being openly discussed I do feel somewhat vindicated for my long held beliefs.
- spatso

What a flowery pile of poop that was. Wow.

Phaneuf Gunner
Liles Gardiner
Holzer Franson

Komi
Lashoff

Not much D depth left after Schenn gone....

We have to move 2 forwards though.....and a goalie if we get Lou
- JIMI-JAMES

I said the D looks thin yesterday and got the ole 'lol oilers' response.

According to TSN all Canadian teams can be dropped from the Nash rumors.
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=400350

Phaneuf Gunner
Liles Gardiner
Holzer Franson

Komi
Lashoff

Not much D depth left after Schenn gone....

We have to move 2 forwards though.....and a goalie if we get Lou
- JIMI-JAMES

Ya, where did all our D-man depth go? A season ago Wilson was trumpeting "this is the best defence in the league..." What happened? Because it looks aweful weak (and soft) now...

According to TSN all Canadian teams can be dropped from the Nash rumors.
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=400350
- Bluenwhite1980

Is it just me, or does it seem wrong that a Canadian Kid wouldn't want to play in Canada?

Ok, right now the teams are sucking, but the chance to play in Canada over say San Jose??? As a Canadian, I would take the true north strong and free...

Parise and Suter went to Minny, where are all the Canadian Kids who want to come home and play in Canada!!!?????

Funny, but for thr first time in a long time I am seeing a preponderance of evidence that my opinion is actually in the majority. I can say that I understood that Burke was the problem long before it became popular opinion. Now that his failings are being openly discussed I do feel somewhat vindicated for my long held beliefs.
- spatso

Yes, Burke is a horrible GM....he had a top tiered team to work with when he took over and brought it down and has set us back for years. The team is moving backwards and it should be blown up asap before he causes any other problems. Fire him now and hire someone else, who will just be fired in 3-4 years....rinse/repeat.

Yes, Burke is a horrible GM....he had a top tiered team to work with when he took over and brought it down and has set us back for years. The team is moving backwards and it should be blown up asap before he causes any other problems. Fire him now and hire someone else, who will just be fired in 3-4 years....rinse/repeat.
- noename09

lol well done.

the burke haters are mostly hockey IQ specialists.

There has been stated interest in Doan from the Leafs, but before fans get their hopes up, they have to realize that Toronto is the wrong fit for a guy who got close to winning the Cup last season and wants to get another crack or two before his career is over with.
- mikeinbuffalo

groundbreaking

I like how you're conveniently cherry-picking arguments to troll with. Bravo, you've clearly been drafted and developed like a proper troll should. I guess I should say that you're part of a "proper development strategy" for trolls?

Back on topic: how'd that work out for Florida? Columbus? They can't wait to get rid of Nash and he can't wait to leave. We have an elite roster player; his name is Phil Kessel. He's scoring goals at the same pace as guys like -- you guessed it -- Rick Nash.

As I've said before, for every PIT and CHI there's a CBJ and FL; there is no magic formula for winning.

Besides the Kessel deal (which is still debatable), what else has Burke done that's not inline with a "proper rebuild"?
- gravyface

Agreed.

Look at it this way, if the Leafs had not had that aweful collapse last year and had made the playoffs, people would be hailing Burke a genius and Kessel a franchise player.

Right now, it is all negative. But once they put it together and make the playoffs teh whole atmosphere will change around this team...

Is it just me, or does it seem wrong that a Canadian Kid wouldn't want to play in Canada?

Ok, right now the teams are sucking, but the chance to play in Canada over say San Jose??? As a Canadian, I would take the true north strong and free...

Parise and Suter went to Minny, where are all the Canadian Kids who want to come home and play in Canada!!!?????
- Hockey_Reverend

Nothing wrong with getting used to live in the USA and wanting to play with a good team. Vancouver could fit the bill but he just doesn't feel it, so what? Blame the GMs with their silly NMC and limited NTC crap.

I know.

Just drives me crazy when the pessimists come out and say "Duh, Burk fail, no tanky-tanky".

If that was the winning strategy, every team in the league would be scrambling to sign Boyce Crabb Brent as their top line.Fact is, for every Pittsburgh and Chicago, there's a Florida or Columbus: perennial losers, still no team success after years and years bottom feeding.

We arguably lost two years worth of "tanking" but I still think you swap Kessel for Seguin (and lets not forget that signings like Beauchemin likely wouldn't have happened, so no Gardiner) and we're really not much further ahead, if at all.
- gravyface

hi, i'm the salary cap! what's your sign?

According to TSN all Canadian teams can be dropped from the Nash rumors.
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=400350
- Bluenwhite1980

good.
a horribly over rated player with a bloated contract who addresses absolutely no needs of the Leafs.

good.
a horribly over rated player with a bloated contract who addresses absolutely no needs of the Leafs.
- Barx

i do agree.

Wonder how accurate the twitter explosion is that Burke has a deal in place for Luongo and we are just waiting on his 'ok' to waive. I do admit I felt something was up with Holzer's 1 way contract.
- Boosinicka

Ummmmm, maybe I'm missing something here, but what does Holzer's contract have to do with Luongo?