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Forums :: Blog World :: Bill Meltzer: Meltzer's Musings: Are Flyers Better Off Than a Year Ago?
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jak521
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Buckle Up.
Joined: 02.19.2008

May 10 @ 8:35 AM ET
Without reading your blog...I would have to say no.

The Flyers still lost badly in the 2nd Round of the Playoffs. They were out played, overmatched, and out coached by the Boston Bruins and NJ Devils. They can take some solace in the fact that Boston won the Cup last season...let's hope the hated Devils don't do the same. Does the road to the Cup go through Philly? It appears so, Chicago, Boston...time will tell if NJD get it done.

Now let me go back and read your blog! The events leading up to Tuesday night's Game 5 loss still sting to say the least....

- puckhead7

The team is much younger this offseason.

We have guys like Coots, Schenn, Read, Gusty (to a degree), Wellwood (to a degree) and Rinaldo who all now have a NHL season under their belt. They will be better prepared and a bit more physically mature for next season.

We have two goalies (and I know this isnt going to be a fun topic) who are both more than capable of playing and winning games. Last year we had to blow the team up to bring in a goalie and change the dynamic of the team.

This year the big questions are what we do with Jagr Carle and Czechie. I believe the latter will be the one who is highest on the importance list.

Assuming Pronger stays on LTIR, Carle doesnt come back, Jagr doesnt come back... we have roughly 12.6 mil to work with. If you count JVR and Grossmanns new deals that number is 8.6 mil. If you give 4 mill a year (he made 2.25 this season) that brings you down to roughly 6.6 mil

So the lineup would look something like this.

Hartnell-G-Czechie
Read-Briere-JvR
Simmonds-Coots-Schenn
Wellwood-Talbot-Rinaldo/Sestito/

Coburn-Grossmann
Timonen-Meszy
Gusty-MAB

Bryz/Bob

That right there isnt a bad line up with out even making any additions.

To me, thats pretty good shape going into FA.


ggunky
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: I like cold beverages, NJ
Joined: 04.09.2008

May 10 @ 8:36 AM ET
* Should/can the Flyers re-sign Matt Carle? If not, can they afford an adequate replacement or even an upgrade? Keep Carle, if the cost is under 5.25 Mil

* How should the Flyers plan for their overall short-term and long-term future on the blueline beyond the Carle question? I touched on this topic in today's Camden Courier Post. They have a good Core in Mezzy, Coburn and Grossmann. If Carle isn't retained then the Flyers will need to trade to fill that void. (i don't see the Flyers getting into the crazy bidding war that will take place for Suter)

* Should/can the Flyers re-sign Jaromir Jagr to another one-year contract? No

* Should the Flyers sacrifice some offense to add a little more grit up front and improve the defensive prowess of their forward corps as a whole? Yes. I would like to see the flyers pick up a winger who has alot of grit to his game. Someone who could fill out a 3rd line with Cooter and Talbot.

* Should the Flyers commit big money and a long-term contract to restricted free agent Jakub Voracek? Big money? Not sure how much is big money. I was not a buyer when the Flyers traded for Jake. He has turned me around, I am a huge Jake fan! Yes resign Jake. How about 3 year 10.5 mil?

*Should the Flyers shop James van Riemsdyk as his new contract extension kicks in for next season? If Carle doesn't resign I think this is the guy who is traded to bring back a D-man to fill the void, so I guess I am saying it all depends on how the Carle situation plays out.

* Should the Flyers seek a different backup goaltender or should they stick with Sergei Bobrovsky one more season? Bob is good back-up but his $$ could be better used for a depth forward. I can go either way on this. If he stays, great, if not that is fine also.

* Should the Flyers attempt to move up in the draft? They will currently pick 20th, 21st, or 22nd depending on the outcomes of the rest of the playoffs. This is a Flyers strength, they seem to draft very well late in the first round, so I would be OK with them staying where they are.

stveshdy
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 06.28.2010

May 10 @ 8:36 AM ET
I don't think that he's better than Timonen when both are at their best. He's comparable to Timonen, but we've never seen Suter thrive without Weber.

Not real eager to bet $7mm that he can be elite

- Jsaquella

I've only seen him without Weber during the Olympics an he played well. However that's not an 82 game season.
MJL
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Candyland, PA
Joined: 09.20.2007

May 10 @ 8:38 AM ET
I don't think that he's better than Timonen when both are at their best. He's comparable to Timonen, but we've never seen Suter thrive without Weber.

Not real eager to bet $7mm that he can be elite

- Jsaquella


I think that Suter is an upgrade over Carle, mainly because Suter can be a lead defenseman on the PP. And with Pronger likely done, that's a definite need. Carle is decent on the PP, but not nearly as good as Suter is. Suter is an equal to, if not better offensively then Timonen also. But I don't feel that he is an equal to Timonen defensively. And Suter is a finesse defenseman. So it's a tough call.
TommyDeVito
Ottawa Senators
Location: We're gonna skate to one song, and one song only.
Joined: 12.15.2010

May 10 @ 8:39 AM ET
Will the flyer's owner want to spend that 7 mill per on another defenseman when he still has to fork out Pronger's dollars? Pronger won't affect the cap on LTIR, but that money going into his bank account is still very real.

Add to that the fact that all of these young studs up front will need to be resigned in two-three years to more expensive deals and I'm not sure the UFA home run shot is a good idea for the franchise.

If I'm the flyers, I make a big push at the coyotes to grab ahold of one of their big 3 D prospects not playing in the NHL in Gormley, Murphy, or Rundblad.
Jsaquella
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Bringing Hexy Back
Joined: 06.16.2006

May 10 @ 8:40 AM ET
I've only seen him without Weber during the Olympics an he played well. However that's not an 82 game season.
- stveshdy


He is a very good defenseman, but he's not Weber, or Duncan Keith or Nick Lidstrom.

There's got to be other options than paying Suter like he's a superstar
jak521
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Buckle Up.
Joined: 02.19.2008

May 10 @ 8:41 AM ET
Yup, I'd move up to draft.Cody Ceci or Brendan Gaunce but yes I'd prefer sitting still
- ob18

The good news is that this years d-corps is pretty deep. Guys coming in at 20-25 are more likely a 10-15 in other drafts
ob18
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: That matters less than you hope it does
Joined: 07.20.2007

May 10 @ 8:43 AM ET
The good news is that this years d-corps is pretty deep. Guys coming in at 20-25 are more likely a 10-15 in other drafts
- jak521


That's mainly why I wouldn't want to move up, it doesn't appear needed.
Jsaquella
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Bringing Hexy Back
Joined: 06.16.2006

May 10 @ 8:43 AM ET
Will the flyer's owner want to spend that 7 mill per on another defenseman when he still has to fork out Pronger's dollars? Pronger won't affect the cap on LTIR, but that money going into his bank account is still very real.

Add to that the fact that all of these young studs up front will need to be resigned in two-three years to more expensive deals and I'm not sure the UFA home run shot is a good idea for the franchise.

If I'm the flyers, I make a big push at the coyotes to grab ahold of one of their big 3 D prospects not playing in the NHL in Gormley, Murphy, or Rundblad.

- TommyDeVito


With Pronger on LTIR, insurance will be paying a big chunk of his deal. Also, Ed Snider has rarely worried about spending money

Adding prospects isn't a bad idea, but they need somebody with experience to step in and play a lot of minutes.
LW2530
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Anyone have some change?, FL
Joined: 09.12.2006

May 10 @ 8:43 AM ET
* Should/can the Flyers re-sign Matt Carle? If not, can they afford an adequate replacement or even an upgrade? Keep Carle, if the cost is under 5.25 Mil


- ggunky


Pass on Carle. Can't be paying 2nd pair dmen 5-6 million.

Holmgren has to go the trade route as he does not like to draft dmen.
stveshdy
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 06.28.2010

May 10 @ 8:43 AM ET
He is a very good defenseman, but he's not Weber, or Duncan Keith or Nick Lidstrom.

There's got to be other options than paying Suter like he's a superstar

- Jsaquella


Homer will explore every option possible. They have to upgrade but be smart about it.
MJL
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Candyland, PA
Joined: 09.20.2007

May 10 @ 8:45 AM ET
With Pronger on LTIR, insurance will be paying a big chunk of his deal. Also, Ed Snider has rarely worried about spending money

Adding prospects isn't a bad idea, but they need somebody with experience to step in and play a lot of minutes.

- Jsaquella


It's not a guarantee that Pronger's deal is insured.
MJL
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Candyland, PA
Joined: 09.20.2007

May 10 @ 8:45 AM ET
Pass on Carle. Can't be paying 2nd pair dmen 5-6 million.

Holmgren has to go the trade route as he does not like to draft dmen.

- LW2530


Carle isn't a 2nd pair D man. He is a #2 Defenseman who has proven time and again that he is a quality compliment to a #1 defenseman in a top pairing.
LW2530
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Anyone have some change?, FL
Joined: 09.12.2006

May 10 @ 8:46 AM ET
Carle isn't a 2nd pair D man.
- MJL


Without Pronger, he's not a first.
ggunky
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: I like cold beverages, NJ
Joined: 04.09.2008

May 10 @ 8:46 AM ET
Pass on Carle. Can't be paying 2nd pair dmen 5-6 million.

Holmgren has to go the trade route as he does not like to draft dmen.

- LW2530



I understand that, But he will need to be replaced with someone who can do what he does.

He isn't the best d-man in the world, but if the Flyers go into next season thinking Gus or MAB can replace his minutes then the Flyers will struggle.

Carle helps this teams transition game. He is a very good skater with solid first pass skills.

Don't just throw out "don't bring back Carle" without providing away to replace him.

MJL
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Candyland, PA
Joined: 09.20.2007

May 10 @ 8:47 AM ET
Without Pronger, he's not a first.
- LW2530


He's not a #1 and never will be. But he is most certainly a top pairing compliment and a #2 defenseman. Carle has played very well without Pronger.
Jsaquella
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Bringing Hexy Back
Joined: 06.16.2006

May 10 @ 8:48 AM ET
It's not a guarantee that Pronger's deal is insured.
- MJL


No, it's not, but it's a fairly safe assumption. Teams generally will insure anything longer than a couple years.
MJL
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Candyland, PA
Joined: 09.20.2007

May 10 @ 8:50 AM ET
No, it's not, but it's a fairly safe assumption. Teams generally will insure anything longer than a couple years.
- Jsaquella


According to what I've read on that, NHL teams rarely insure a contract. I could be wrong. And Pronger's deal may be insured. But it's not a safe assumption. The premiums are incredibly high on something like that. Most teams will insure a few top players, and that could include Pronger. But his age and other factors could make that cost prohibitive.

Edit:

I found this, so your probably right that Pronger's contract is insured for about 80%


"The NHL requires teams to insure roughly 80 per cent of the value of their top five player contracts through BWD Group, a New York insurance company. Rates have more than doubled from about 2 per cent in 2004 to more than 5 per cent of a contract’s value, Hubbard and others said."
JoeRussomanno
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: me bitter? F-no i think it's hilarious
Joined: 12.14.2011

May 10 @ 8:51 AM ET
* Should/can the Flyers re-sign Matt Carle? If not, can they afford an adequate replacement or even an upgrade? Keep Carle, if the cost is under 5.25 Mil

* How should the Flyers plan for their overall short-term and long-term future on the blueline beyond the Carle question? I touched on this topic in today's Camden Courier Post. They have a good Core in Mezzy, Coburn and Grossmann. If Carle isn't retained then the Flyers will need to trade to fill that void. (i don't see the Flyers getting into the crazy bidding war that will take place for Suter)

* Should/can the Flyers re-sign Jaromir Jagr to another one-year contract? No

* Should the Flyers sacrifice some offense to add a little more grit up front and improve the defensive prowess of their forward corps as a whole? Yes. I would like to see the flyers pick up a winger who has alot of grit to his game. Someone who could fill out a 3rd line with Cooter and Talbot.

* Should the Flyers commit big money and a long-term contract to restricted free agent Jakub Voracek? Big money? Not sure how much is big money. I was not a buyer when the Flyers traded for Jake. He has turned me around, I am a huge Jake fan! Yes resign Jake. How about 3 year 10.5 mil?

*Should the Flyers shop James van Riemsdyk as his new contract extension kicks in for next season? If Carle doesn't resign I think this is the guy who is traded to bring back a D-man to fill the void, so I guess I am saying it all depends on how the Carle situation plays out.

* Should the Flyers seek a different backup goaltender or should they stick with Sergei Bobrovsky one more season? Bob is good back-up but his $$ could be better used for a depth forward. I can go either way on this. If he stays, great, if not that is fine also.

* Should the Flyers attempt to move up in the draft? They will currently pick 20th, 21st, or 22nd depending on the outcomes of the rest of the playoffs. This is a Flyers strength, they seem to draft very well late in the first round, so I would be OK with them staying where they are.

- ggunky


funmaster18
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: All I need are some tasty waves, a cool buzz and I'm fine.
Joined: 03.15.2009

May 10 @ 8:54 AM ET
I figured Timonen was banged up, but had no idea he was playing through a torn knee ligament. This guy needs the cup next year. It would be a shame for him not to get one. With the right moves and adjustments, I have no doubt they will have an even better shot next year.
top shelf 15
Ottawa Senators
Joined: 11.23.2008

May 10 @ 8:56 AM ET
Great young forwards,and lots of them, they will sacrifice some of this depth for a decent young defender ,then sign suter.They have been in cap trouble before and always end up being a major player at FA .So i dont see this year as being any different than seasons past
PLindbergh31
Location: NJ
Joined: 02.01.2008

May 10 @ 8:57 AM ET
hindsight is always 20/20, but that Kubina trade looks simply dreadful right now. Wish they still had a 2nd round pick.
Hextall271
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Ersson-Ville, NB, NB
Joined: 01.18.2007

May 10 @ 8:58 AM ET
I'd love to see a guy like Erik Johnson. I'm thinking a good young guy, on a second contract, who can grow with the rest of the core of the team.

It might cost JvR or another young forward. But to me that is better than getting locked into another long term, big money deal.

Now, say Timonen retires. Then all bets are off.

- Jsaquella


I love Timonen, but he can't have much left in the tank. They have to start planning to rebuild the D. I know I will get attacked for this by some, but I really think Bryz will settle in next year and we should get a more consistent year from him IMO. I think TSN's McKenzie was off by saying he had a horrible playoff track record. In 07 with Anaheim, he had to step in for Giguere, and did a solid job. They probably don't get by EDM in the second round (I think it was) without him. In Phoenix, Det killed him, but I don't think we lost vs NJ because of him.

I say, draft a Dman, sign or trade for a couple more, and start rebuilding. I think the forwards are on the righ track personally.
Hextall271
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Ersson-Ville, NB, NB
Joined: 01.18.2007

May 10 @ 8:59 AM ET
hindsight is always 20/20, but that Kubina trade looks simply dreadful right now. Wish they still had a 2nd round pick.
- PLindbergh31


I posted that earlier. I'd like to hear if it was a shoulder or what and when the injury happened. It looks horrible now for sure.
MJL
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Candyland, PA
Joined: 09.20.2007

May 10 @ 9:01 AM ET
I love Timonen, but he can't have much left in the tank. They have to start planning to rebuild the D. I know I will get attacked for this by some, but I really think Bryz will settle in next year and we should get a more consistent year from him IMO. I think TSN's McKenzie was off by saying he had a horrible playoff track record. In 07 with Anaheim, he had to step in for Giguere, and did a solid job. They probably don't get by EDM in the second round (I think it was) without him. In Phoenix, Det killed him, but I don't think we lost vs NJ because of him.

I say, draft a Dman, sign or trade for a couple more, and start rebuilding. I think the forwards are on the righ track personally.

- Hextall271


You wont get attacked by me. I agree with you 100% on Bryzgalov.
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