Niskanen and Engelland are fine. Martin and Michalek slotted for a top 4 role and playing like 6th and 7th defensemen is the problem. You can't overcome that kind of deficiency when you rely on people in that role (top 4 defense), and they no show.
- Gunner Staal

Maybe just a bad mix? Martin looks bad. Michalek is a proven guy. Seems like you guys could use a grossman type

That leadership also lifted a Stanley Cup just three years ago. One bad series or more specifically one bad game doesn't change that.
- Jsaquella

And thats why flurry will still be held in high esteem even after this playoffs and next year everyone will pick the pens to go far...

If I'm Laviolette, I keep the lineup exactly as is, until injured guys return, or an injury occurs. Flyers are coming off back to back games where they scored 8 goals, no reason to change anything. Laviolette generally keeps the same lineup when possible after wins. I would be surprised if he made any changes tomorrow night.

nice work Bill!! I'd rather the Flyers beat the Pens with Neal in the lineup, but he does deserve to be suspended (as did Weber) but the point about they usually announce the fine without announcing a hearing seems almost a gaurantee that he will be suspended. I wish the game was tonight too, but I really don't think it's going to matter.

There's no other reason than spite for any team to claim him at this point. He's a UFA in July, so it really doesn't hurt the Flyers moving forward, there's no cap in the playoffs, and if Dave Isaac's report is correct, the Flyers would use Bacashihua before Leighton anyhow.
- Jsaquella

Personally, I don't see how Isaac is correct on that.

And thats why flurry will still be held in high esteem even after this playoffs and next year everyone will pick the pens to go far...
- flyers4487

do you think he was possibly over worked this year? He started 67 games this year.

Maybe just a bad mix? Martin looks bad. Michalek is a proven guy. Seems like you guys could use a grossman type
- Just5

I defended Martin for a while, but he has put me in a position where I can no longer do so. Last year he was pretty good. When he is on his game, he is like a very poor man's version of Nick Lidstrom. I use that comparison because they both are not very physical, their gap control is almost always spot on, they make little deft plays that largely go unnoticed but put the next guy with the puck in a great position, and can both eat minutes.

Obviously Martin is nowhere close to Lidstrom, I only compare their styles, not their execution. Lidstrom also has a bomb for a shot compared to Martin's weak shot.

This year Martin's gap control has been shoddy at best, his awareness on the ice has plummeted (all your breakaways this series have been his man I believe). Instead of making the crafty tiny unnoticed plays, he has panicked and given the puck away. When a guy like him loses composure, his physical hockey skills are not good enough to compensate. Lastly I think the trend towards a more clutch and grab game does not help a guy like Martin at all.

If I'm Laviolette, I keep the lineup exactly as is, until injured guys return, or an injury occurs. Flyers are coming off back to back games where they scored 8 goals, no reason to change anything. Laviolette generally keeps the same lineup when possible after wins. I would be surprised if he made any changes tomorrow night.
- PLindbergh31

I dont think swapping Shelley with Rinaldo hurts the team. In fact it may help the team since Rinaldo gets a penalty every time he hits the ice.

I dont think swapping Shelley with Rinaldo hurts the team. In fact it may help the team since Rinaldo gets a penalty every time he hits the ice.
- stveshdy

Meh, it's not like Shelley is a disciplined player either. He can't keep up with the pace of play, and could be exposed if he gets caught on the ice against some of the Penguins skilled guys. Rinaldo up until recently was playing 10+ minutes a game in checking line role.

The only way I consider Shelley is if the Penguins dress McIntyre.

The Penguins goalie for game 4.

Meh, it's not like Shelley is a disciplined player either. He can't keep up with the pace of play, and could be exposed if he gets caught on the ice against some of the Penguins skilled guys. Rinaldo up until recently was playing 10+ minutes a game in checking line role.

The only way I consider Shelley is if the Penguins dress McIntyre.
- PLindbergh31

They werent even dressing him in any regular season games. You guys saw the first game he dressed for in months.

Meh, it's not like Shelley is a disciplined player either. He can't keep up with the pace of play, and could be exposed if he gets caught on the ice against some of the Penguins skilled guys. Rinaldo up until recently was playing 10+ minutes a game in checking line role.

The only way I consider Shelley is if the Penguins dress McIntyre.
- PLindbergh31

I'm not lobbying for Shelley but I can understand if the move was made. Rinaldo has a target on his back everytime hes been on the ice in this series.

Thats all my Shelley talk for one day. Anything more would be ridiculous.

They werent even dressing him in any regular season games. You guys saw the first game he dressed for in months.
- Gunner Staal

Well with Adams, Neal, and Asham suspended who is going to play? Vitale for Asham, Tangradi for Neal, who plays in Adams spot?

Hopefully the Penguins dress 7 dmen. I love me some Lovejoy!

Well with Adams, Neal, and Asham suspended who is going to play? Vitale for Asham, Tangradi for Neal, who plays in Adams spot?

Hopefully the Penguins dress 7 dmen. I love me some Lovejoy!
- PLindbergh31

Dustin Jeffrey if I had a guess.

Meh, it's not like Shelley is a disciplined player either. He can't keep up with the pace of play, and could be exposed if he gets caught on the ice against some of the Penguins skilled guys. Rinaldo up until recently was playing 10+ minutes a game in checking line role.

The only way I consider Shelley is if the Penguins dress McIntyre.
- PLindbergh31

Shelly has no problem keeping up with the play. That is a myth. What Rinaldo was doing in the regular Season doesn't matter now. He is playing between 4-6 minutes a game. And hasn't played in the 3rd period of 2 out of 3 games. Compared to Rinaldo, Shelly is far more disciplined. Shelley is a veteran that knows how to keep his cool and what his role would be. Rinaldo unfortunately can't get any benefit of the doubt from the officials, and is far more of a risk to blow his cool. Even having to be restrained on the bench by Berube on one occasion in game 3. Shelley is a better choice in my opinion in this situation, due to his experience. The only negative I could see to it is that the lineup change could be construed the wrong way.

The Penguins goalie for game 4.
- Scottie Upshall

Man does Fluery look like a goalie that has zero confidence.

I'm not lobbying for Shelley but I can understand if the move was made. Rinaldo has a target on his back everytime hes been on the ice in this series.

Thats all my Shelley talk for one day. Another more would be ridiculous.
- stveshdy

It just doesnt make sense to me. Even though he has had a target on his back.. he is 10 times the all around player Shelley is. I would be pretty surprised if Rinaldo doesnt dress tomorrow.

It just doesnt make sense to me. Even though he has had a target on his back.. he is 10 times the all around player Shelley is. I would be pretty surprised if Rinaldo doesnt dress tomorrow.
- jak521

I'll be surprised also if Rinaldo doesn't play. But the potential change suggestion has zero to do with who is the better player.

Shelly has no problem keeping up with the play. That is a myth. What Rinaldo was doing in the regular Season doesn't matter now. He is playing between 4-6 minutes a game. And hasn't played in the 3rd period of 2 out of 3 games. Compared to Rinaldo, Shelly is far more disciplined. Shelley is a veteran that knows how to keep his cool and what his role would be. Rinaldo unfortunately can't get any benefit of the doubt from the officials, and is far more of a risk to blow his cool. Even having to be restrained on the bench by Berube on one occasion in game 3. Shelley is a better choice in my opinion in this situation, due to his experience. The only negative I could see to it is that the lineup change could be construed the wrong way.
- MJL

So a guy who averaged 3-5 minutes a game in the regular season is gonna play more in the post season? I dont fully understand the rationale for posting Rinaldo's TOI. Rinaldo is a much better checking line forward than Shelley. Unfortunately.. guys of their ilk are gonna see diminished roles in the playoffs.. especially when teams have the amount of PP's and PK's they have seen so far in this series.

It just doesnt make sense to me. Even though he has had a target on his back.. he is 10 times the all around player Shelley is. I would be pretty surprised if Rinaldo doesnt dress tomorrow.
- jak521

I dont question the fact that I think Rinaldo is better all around. The problem in the playoffs is that Rinaldo is playing less minutes (which is fine) but hes taken too many penalties during those shifts. As soon as he jumps over the boards the refs whistle him 2 minutes for skating.

I'll be surprised also if Rinaldo doesn't play. But the potential change suggestion has zero to do with who is the better player.
- MJL

Oh I know.. I shouldnt have even mentioned it considering it is painfully obvious.

I understand that he has a target on his back...

The only negative I could see to it is that the lineup change could be construed the wrong way.
- MJL

this is the first thing i thought of...but would it really be that off base or seen as the flyers being the aggressors?

it's been the pens, NOT the flyers that have made the aggressive moves so far. they still are dressing a dude who can really throw them (Engellend) and are now probably going to call up a big nasty guy in place of Neil, pending suspension, that will be looking to stick it to the flyers and make a name for himself with the Pens fans.

i agree that Rinaldo is far more unpredictable than Shelley is at this point, and i bet the refs and the pens would see that the flyers are making that change for that specific reason, while still taking precautions to protect their players on the ice.

So a guy who averaged 3-5 minutes a game in the regular season is gonna play more in the post season? I dont fully understand the rationale for posting Rinaldo's TOI. Rinaldo is a much better checking line forward than Shelley. Unfortunately.. guys of their ilk are gonna see diminished roles in the playoffs.. especially when teams have the amount of PP's and PK's they have seen so far in this series.
- jak521

I didn't say anywhere that Shelley would play more then Rinaldo has been. The rationale is simple. Due to how little Rinaldo has been playing, not being used in 3rd periods. Having a lesser player then Rinaldo in for one game isn't going to make much of a difference. Other then the reasons I referred to in previous posts in this thread.

Flyers are up 3-0 to the Penguins, and people have beefs over whose better Rinaldo or Shelly. Who cares, they both will be sitting when JVR gets healthy.

I dont question the fact that I think Rinaldo is better all around. The problem in the playoffs is that Rinaldo is playing less minutes (which is fine) but hes taken too many penalties during those shifts. As soon as he jumps over the boards the refs whistle him 2 minutes for skating.
- stveshdy

So put in Shelley who MAY see... MAYBE... 2 minutes of ice time? I dont get the rationale. Rinaldo was part of and still rotates with the checking line that has done a hell of a job shutting down Malkin. I dont want Shelley anywhere near the ice when Malkin is out there.