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Lind

https://canucksarmy.com/2018/07/03/first-look-canucks-make-big-mistakes-in-free-agency-again/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter



- LeftCoaster

So here is the thing. It was 3 signings (4 including Sven, or 5 including the non official signing of Archibald). How I would enterpret these signings (I am more critical than most) is that the Roussel signing is actually very good, the term is just a bit off (this is the price you pay free agents to join an essentially bottom 5 team for the past X amount of years). The Schaller signing is not bad, its low risk, medium reward, depth, and can easily be waived/dealt. The Beagle signing is a bit dumb, based on the fact that he turns 33 to start the contract, and will be 37 when it ends. Again, the AAV isn't an issue when it comes to Beagle, it is the term, but that is essentially the price Benning has to pay for a free agent, to join a sh*tty team, and who also just won a Stanley cup. All in all, it wasn't a disaster, it isn't going to cripple the Canucks for 4 years, its essentially a stop-gap until more kids are able to arrive and make a difference.

https://canucksarmy.com/2018/07/03/first-look-canucks-make-big-mistakes-in-free-agency-again/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter



- LeftCoaster

This isn't news to you is it? I could have understood these signings if they had traded Baertschi and Granlund instead of re-signing them. Or if Sutter and Gagner had been moved at the draft for picks. It is one more example (piled on to the plethora that exist) of management saying one thing and doing the exact opposite.

This isn't news to you is it? I could have understood these signings if they had traded Baertschi and Granlund instead of re-signing them. Or if Sutter and Gagner had been moved at the draft for picks. It is one more example (piled on to the plethora that exist) of management saying one thing and doing the exact opposite.
- 1970vintage

Hey Vintsy,

I was pretty much in the same mindset as you, pretty irritated at these signings, but bodies have to be dealt this summer, and Benning has admitted to it. I would assume Baertschi was dangled on the trade market, but nothing worth trading for. Archibald is (reportedly) on a two-way contract, so that's one less Canucks forward position locked. Granlund and Baertschi don't have clauses, and I believe neither do Sutter or Gagner, so who knows what may happen between now and October. It wouldn't surprise me to see one of Delzotto/Hutton/DP moved as well (depending on Hughes decision).

Yakupov heading to KHL

So here is the thing. It was 3 signings (4 including Sven, or 5 including the non official signing of Archibald). How I would enterpret these signings (I am more critical than most) is that the Roussel signing is actually very good, the term is just a bit off (this is the price you pay free agents to join an essentially bottom 5 team for the past X amount of years). The Schaller signing is not bad, its low risk, medium reward, depth, and can easily be waived/dealt. The Beagle signing is a bit dumb, based on the fact that he turns 33 to start the contract, and will be 37 when it ends. Again, the AAV isn't an issue when it comes to Beagle, it is the term, but that is essentially the price Benning has to pay for a free agent, to join a sh*tty team, and who also just won a Stanley cup. All in all, it wasn't a disaster, it isn't going to cripple the Canucks for 4 years, its essentially a stop-gap until more kids are able to arrive and make a difference.
- Codes1087

The only thing these guys will be "sheltering" is other (worse) veteran players.

This isn't news to you is it? I could have understood these signings if they had traded Baertschi and Granlund instead of re-signing them. Or if Sutter and Gagner had been moved at the draft for picks. It is one more example (piled on to the plethora that exist) of management saying one thing and doing the exact opposite.
- 1970vintage

Mixed messages, the mantra of management.

Yakupov heading to KHL
- VANTEL

Where he belongs.

So here is the thing. It was 3 signings (4 including Sven, or 5 including the non official signing of Archibald). How I would enterpret these signings (I am more critical than most) is that the Roussel signing is actually very good, the term is just a bit off (this is the price you pay free agents to join an essentially bottom 5 team for the past X amount of years). The Schaller signing is not bad, its low risk, medium reward, depth, and can easily be waived/dealt. The Beagle signing is a bit dumb, based on the fact that he turns 33 to start the contract, and will be 37 when it ends. Again, the AAV isn't an issue when it comes to Beagle, it is the term, but that is essentially the price Benning has to pay for a free agent, to join a sh*tty team, and who also just won a Stanley cup. All in all, it wasn't a disaster, it isn't going to cripple the Canucks for 4 years, its essentially a stop-gap until more kids are able to arrive and make a difference.
- Codes1087

The signing's themselves aren't that big of a deal IMO as this team was never going to be competitive this season.

For me it's just another example of this mgmt group's ineptitude.
I understand that they got it in their head that Beagle is the player they wanted but at some point good teams take a step back and say, the player/market wants too much for this guy. Lets look a different player who can provide the same thing.

As much as these contracts can be bought out, the reality is the team is more likely to continue giving signed vets ice-time over kids.

I'm happy that the Canucks have options now to send both Gaudette and Pettersson down to the AHL if necessary. But what happens if a Lind, Dahlen, Gadjovich etc. look better than the vets this year or the next?

Contracts like the Schaller's are great (Archibald and Granlund as well), it gives the team options and can still insulate the youth. Beagle and Gagner make too much money to waive if they are outplayed and mgmt generally aren't willing to do something that will make them look bad.

I don't hate the Roussel contract, it is more in line with the value he will bring but I just don't like the player that much. I hope to be won over by him but I expect most the fan base will be over his antics by January.

https://canucksarmy.com/2018/07/03/first-look-canucks-make-big-mistakes-in-free-agency-again/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter



- LeftCoaster

No real plan... never was one. Sounds about right.

The only thing these guys will be "sheltering" is other (worse) veteran players.
- 1970vintage

my main gripe, is that I don't really buy into the narrative that veterans need to be brought in to shape/influence rookies. Edmonton had brought in soo many "veterans" to influence their kids and it never did squat. I would have preferred to walk away from Beagle once this so called "bidding war" started, but that's just my opinion. I do however think players need to be brought in to help "protect" or keep players accountable for taking runs (justifying the Roussel signing). Hartnell slapping Burmistrov and Stecher, or Lewis running Brock, are two embarrassing scenarios last year that need to be addressed.

https://canucksarmy.com/2018/07/03/first-look-canucks-make-big-mistakes-in-free-agency-again/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter



- LeftCoaster

After these signings, the Canucks are significantly worse off than they were just a few days ago

.

I've said Canucks media is pretty bad, this is just proof.

The signings give the Canucks depth and options. Legit players that can play minutes in the NHL. Van still has 12 million in cap space? The only player in the next 3 years to need a new contract that is any good is Boeser. Dahlen in 2 more. EP, OJ, Hughes if he signs 3 years from now.

The signing's themselves aren't that big of a deal IMO as this team was never going to be competitive this season.

For me it's just another example of this mgmt group's ineptitude.
I understand that they got it in their head that Beagle is the player they wanted but at some point good teams take a step back and say, the player/market wants too much for this guy. Lets look a different player who can provide the same thing.

As much as these contracts can be bought out, the reality is the team is more likely to continue giving signed vets ice-time over kids.

I'm happy that the Canucks have options now to send both Gaudette and Pettersson down to the AHL if necessary. But what happens if a Lind, Dahlen, Gadjovich etc. look better than the vets this year or the next?

Contracts like the Schaller's are great (Archibald and Granlund as well), it gives the team options and can still insulate the youth. Beagle and Gagner make too much money to waive if they are outplayed and mgmt generally aren't willing to do something that will make them look bad.

I don't hate the Roussel contract, it is more in line with the value he will bring but I just don't like the player that much. I hope to be won over by him but I expect most the fan base will be over his antics by January.
- belcherbd

That Canucks Army link does Roussel a few favors. He is considerably better than Dorsett in all metrics, and Dorsett showed a ton of good stuff last year prior to getting injured.

Out of all of the signings, I just hope that the do right by these kids. Play them and give them a legit shot at the opening night roster if they deserve it. Don't play veterans, or automatically gift wrap roster spots to UFA's if they don't deserve it. Sit veterans who are playing poopty. Reward kids who deserve it. Etc Etc

This isn't news to you is it? I could have understood these signings if they had traded Baertschi and Granlund instead of re-signing them. Or if Sutter and Gagner had been moved at the draft for picks. It is one more example (piled on to the plethora that exist) of management saying one thing and doing the exact opposite.
- 1970vintage

Gifting spots for young players that haven't shown a thing in the NHL isn't going to happen.

If you don't sign these players, and the kids aren't ready? What do you do then? Play a bunch of other guys that aren't ready?

Gifting spots for young players that haven't shown a thing in the NHL isn't going to happen.

If you don't sign these players, and the kids aren't ready? What do you do then? Play a bunch of other guys that aren't ready?
- manvanfan

keeping veterans in the lineup who are playing AHL calibre hockey or worse shouldn't be kept in the lineup either.

The signing's themselves aren't that big of a deal IMO as this team was never going to be competitive this season.

For me it's just another example of this mgmt group's ineptitude.
I understand that they got it in their head that Beagle is the player they wanted but at some point good teams take a step back and say, the player/market wants too much for this guy. Lets look a different player who can provide the same thing.

As much as these contracts can be bought out, the reality is the team is more likely to continue giving signed vets ice-time over kids.

I'm happy that the Canucks have options now to send both Gaudette and Pettersson down to the AHL if necessary. But what happens if a Lind, Dahlen, Gadjovich etc. look better than the vets this year or the next?

Contracts like the Schaller's are great (Archibald and Granlund as well), it gives the team options and can still insulate the youth. Beagle and Gagner make too much money to waive if they are outplayed and mgmt generally aren't willing to do something that will make them look bad.

I don't hate the Roussel contract, it is more in line with the value he will bring but I just don't like the player that much. I hope to be won over by him but I expect most the fan base will be over his antics by January.
- belcherbd

Did you see Lind Gadj 3 months ago? Lind could not keep up in AHL , so I don't know he magically is going to make NHL in 4 months. The reality is they are both at least 2 years away if they make the NHL.

Dahlen is legit

Hey Vintsy,

I was pretty much in the same mindset as you, pretty irritated at these signings, but bodies have to be dealt this summer, and Benning has admitted to it. I would assume Baertschi was dangled on the trade market, but nothing worth trading for. Archibald is (reportedly) on a two-way contract, so that's one less Canucks forward position locked. Granlund and Baertschi don't have clauses, and I believe neither do Sutter or Gagner, so who knows what may happen between now and October. It wouldn't surprise me to see one of Delzotto/Hutton/DP moved as well (depending on Hughes decision).
- Codes1087

I’m not angry, more disappointed. Sure, maybe they will clear some roster spots between now and September, but I’m as skeptical as I have ever been of this organization. Everyone in the media talked about “where are the goals going to come from now that the twins have retired” (which, by the way, I think is BS). But these moves aren’t going to replace any of those goals. They are simply swapping out the same poopty production for an older, saltier player. Rousel for Gaunce, Beagle for Chaput (or whoever), Schaller for Motte (or whoever). Personally, I would rather have Gaunce’s poopty production than Beagle’s leadership (and poopty production)

my main gripe, is that I don't really buy into the narrative that veterans need to be brought in to shape/influence rookies. Edmonton had brought in soo many "veterans" to influence their kids and it never did squat. I would have preferred to walk away from Beagle once this so called "bidding war" started, but that's just my opinion. I do however think players need to be brought in to help "protect" or keep players accountable for taking runs (justifying the Roussel signing). Hartnell slapping Burmistrov and Stecher, or Lewis running Brock, are two embarrassing scenarios last year that need to be addressed.
- Codes1087

This is a false narrative.

Having tough guys on the ice doesn't stop Lewis from boarding Boeser. Lewis is in the NHL because that is the line he walks. Roussel isn't going to play his scrappy game differently against different teams either.

Burrows, Cooke, Dorsett, Ruutu all played the same way regardless of the opponent.

Did you see Lind Gadj 3 months ago? Lind could not keep up in AHL , so I don't know he magically is going to make NHL in 4 months. The reality is they are both at least 2 years away if they make the NHL.

Dahlen is legit
- VANTEL

I didn't say 4 months.

They likely are 2 years away, but every year there are players that surprise and earn spots in the NHL. Hopefully the Canucks are willing to make room...

This is a false narrative.

Having tough guys on the ice doesn't stop Lewis from boarding Boeser. Lewis is in the NHL because that is the line he walks. Roussel isn't going to play his scrappy game differently against different teams either.

Burrows, Cooke, Dorsett, Ruutu all played the same way regardless of the opponent.
- belcherbd

Boeser is not going to play with players who are going to drop the gloves on a nightly basis. Doughty never had anyone on the ice to drop the gloves with Tkachuk when he was taking runs. Most 1st line forwards, or 1st pairing defenders generally don't drop the gloves. Having players on your team, that are going to hold other players accountable for taking runs at your top guys, is ALWAYS going to be a thing, as long as fighting is not removed entirely from the game.

keeping veterans in the lineup who are playing AHL calibre hockey or worse shouldn't be kept in the lineup either.
- Codes1087

That would be they went out and signed players that can clearly play and stay in the NHL on much better teams then Van's

I’m not angry, more disappointed. Sure, maybe they will clear some roster spots between now and September, but I’m as skeptical as I have ever been of this organization. Everyone in the media talked about “where are the goals going to come from now that the twins have retired” (which, by the way, I think is BS). But these moves aren’t going to replace any of those goals. They are simply swapping out the same poopty production for an older, saltier player. Rousel for Gaunce, Beagle for Chaput (or whoever), Schaller for Motte (or whoever). Personally, I would rather have Gaunce’s poopty production than Beagle’s leadership (and poopty production)
- 1970vintage

I 100% understand where you are coming from. I honestly would have preferred to walk away from the Beagle signing as well.

The closest forwards on the Comets to being NHL ready are Dahlen almost ready
EP Ready
Zac MacEwen 1 more year.

The rest you need to put the breaks on.

I didn't say 4 months.

They likely are 2 years away, but every year there are players that surprise and earn spots in the NHL. Hopefully the Canucks are willing to make room...
- belcherbd

And Benning said he would find a spot if someone is ready