Not tanking. The Flyers are not tanking, which is what you are advocating for. THe proper way to run an organization? Right?

Yes, the flyers were mediocre. Please don't do this. They were not consistent all year, and barely made it into the playoffs. And how much above mediocre were they really?

Finally, you have no proof that that sixers tried to lose. We could maybe deduce that, but I would argue they never lost a game on purpose, just didn't field a team that could win consistently. No player went on that court, and threw a game. So therefore, they were trying to win. Regardless of what management was doing.
- ChuckinKnucks

There is no sense in arguing with people who simply think the Sixers' strategy was just to lose as many games as possible. They don't want to understand what actually happened. They just want to apply their narrative.

The fans were mostly fine with it. The people most upset were the ones who hardly watched the team.

Is there really anyone here who would take the Flyers last 20 years over the Pens last 20 years?
- PhillySportsGuy

Anyone would take winning cups over not winning cups, nobody should argue that. However, if the Flyers go on to win multiple cups over the next 10 years, I would prefer that.

I just said it was bad business in my opinion. If they have a good enough fan based to do it, great for them.

Can't speak from the basketball side as I haven't followed it in years. Not from Philly but was a Sixers fan growing up because I liked Julius Erving and was a big fan of Barkley.

You brought up players who are not good 5v5: Ghost.


- hockeyal

No I didn't. Gostisbehere is a good 5 on 5 player.

If you made a list of all 1st round picks of their vintages and ranked them base don your favorite performance metric for their position: scoring, possession, NHL games played would probably be a big one, fair to say they would rank in the bottom 10%. And I'm being generous. It's an indication of how badly the team was depleted of talent by GM Homer that Laughton is even on the team. He is a reserve forward (i.e. #13/14) talent. Morin will never play in the NHL. It would have been the compassionate thing to do to sign him for two years, but the Flyers can't admit when there is no more upside. You are entitled to characterize taking AHL level talent with a 1st round pick as not "a bust". I disagree.


- hockeyal

There is plenty of talent on this team that Holmgren bought in. Laughton is not a reserve forward in this league. I think making the statement that Morin will not play in the NHL is asinine. If he didn't get injured he would've been a full time NHL player this upcoming season.

Agree with you on Laughton. But not Morin. Look at the careers of every other D man drafted in his 1st round. Not even close. He is bottom of that group by a mile. And this isn’t even considering he will miss most of next year. Hate to say it but he’s a first round bust by any objective measure.
- Djapana

Morin was always going to be a long term project but the injuries have certainly done his timeline no favors either.

I still believe he can contribute to this team but it's not often you see a prospect take this long before they make it in the NHL.

Agree with you on Laughton. But not Morin. Look at the careers of every other D man drafted in his 1st round. Not even close. He is bottom of that group by a mile. And this isn’t even considering he will miss most of next year. Hate to say it but he’s a first round bust by any objective measure.
- Djapana

Morin has been hurt and in my opinion should have played in the NHL out of camp ahead of Sanheim.

There is no sense in arguing with people who simply think the Sixers' strategy was just to lose as many games as possible. They don't want to understand what actually happened. They just want to apply their narrative.
- PhillySportsGuy

My question would be will they watch the sixers ever again? Because you are always going to have remnants from this "Process". I don't want to completely right off a favorite team of mine, because they took the road less traveled.

Anyone would take winning cups over not winning cups, nobody should argue that. However, if the Flyers go on to win multiple cups over the next 10 years, I would prefer that.

I just said it was bad business in my opinion. If they have a good enough fan based to do it, great for them.

Can't speak from the basketball side as I haven't followed it in years. Not from Philly but was a Sixers fan growing up because I liked Julius Erving and was a big fan of Barkley.
- FlyerFan16

I would argue it's good for business. Having 3 years of poor attendance for the chance to sell out almost every game for the next 15 years and establish bonds with fans that could last a lifetime would definitely be worth it.

You brought up players who are not good 5v5: Ghost.

If you made a list of all 1st round picks of their vintages and ranked them base don your favorite performance metric for their position: scoring, possession, NHL games played would probably be a big one, fair to say they would rank in the bottom 10%. And I'm being generous. It's an indication of how badly the team was depleted of talent by GM Homer that Laughton is even on the team. He is a reserve forward (i.e. #13/14) talent. Morin will never play in the NHL. It would have been the compassionate thing to do to sign him for two years, but the Flyers can't admit when there is no more upside.

You are entitled to characterize taking AHL level talent with a 1st round pick as not "a bust". I disagree.
- hockeyal

Morin will never play in the NHL? Could you apply your soothsaying ability to something that can make us a some money?

What does it matter who I am? I have no validation unless I have been posting for the last 10 years?
- ChuckinKnucks

Yes

Are you saying that adding a 30 goal LW doesn't make the Flyers a better team? Are they now prevented from making a move to add a center?

If he is on the ice when the Flyers score 50 goals and their opponents score 80, he doesn't make the Flyers better. Scoring and Corsi stats DO lie.



Flyers have Provorov, Gostisbehere, MacDonald, Haag, Gudas and Sanheim.

Where does De Haan fit in there?
- MJL

Pairings. teams that WIN, pair players with complementary talents. So the Flyers have found that when they pair AMac with Provorov, or with Ghost, or with Sanheim, they all play up to their potential and are assets to the team (stats tell the story). Haag and Gudas are not reliable enough to do that. Long term, IMO, Haag WILL, maybe even by the end of 18-19. But with the guys on the roster NOW, how do you make pairings that are a net plus against good teams?

Provorov-Haag? Provorov-Gudas? Ghost-Gudas? Sanheim-Haag playing 20 minutes+?

Provorov-AMac/new guy
Sanheim-AMac/new guy
Ghost-Haag/Gudas

Without new guy, no matter how many scorers they sign and if their PP2 gets marginally better, they still are a 1st round exit team.

I don't know if anyone else feels this way, but I can't seem to get the fact out of my head that we were so close to drafting Wahlstrom. I wanted him so badly. He would be the sniper we needed for the future, I really wanted Hexy to trade up to snag him.

My question would be will they watch the sixers ever again? Because you are always going to have remnants from this "Process". I don't want to completely right off a favorite team of mine, because they took the road less traveled.
- ChuckinKnucks

I have yet to meet any Sixers fan that is boycotting the team due to their method of rebuilding. Tbh, I don't know any Sixers fans who say the whole thing wasn't worth it.

Why did EDM have to overpay Draisaitl? Would be a great trade target if he was 1.5 mil cheaper.
- hereticpride

I think that makes him a great trade target. If he was signed to a reasonable contract their asking price would probably be above what others would consider reasonable.

The Flyers needed a center so they pay more than anyone else was willing to long term for a wing. That is a Homer move if I ever saw one. That was my point about JVR. Another potential scorer who doesn't play defense, and who has had trouble playing a full season through his career is not a solution to the Flyers core issues.

Saying Lehtera is good enough to play 4th line center until a kid can step up, or saying he is better that Laughton, isn't high praise, and has nothing to do with whether he is worth $4.7M (to play on the 4th line). They need a veteran D like de Haan who will let the puck movers do their thing, and make the ones who don't ever get near their own goal or behind their own net less of a liability.
- hockeyal

We'll have to see what happens to between now and October. I fully expect them to address the 3C position between now and then. They also need to address the PK. They could do both with one player. I will be disappointed if they don't address those needs.

They also still have the option to move G back to C.

Some real characters came out of the woodwork today.

Yes
- SuperSchennBros

Well, you still have a love affair with Brayden Schenn, so does that knock you down a few pegs in the HockeyBuzz posting realm? Maybe we are more on an even playing field than you first thought?

didn't know we had so many experts on running/building a professional sports team in here

Some real characters came out of the woodwork today.
- bighandsome91

I blame that bastard JVR.

I think that makes him a great trade target. If he was signed to a reasonable contract their asking price would probably be above what others would consider reasonable.
- bighandsome91

The money is just too high for me. If he was making less my very best offer would be Simmonds & Sanhiem (and if they re-sign Simmonds we get a draft pick out of the deal too.) But 8.5 is just too much.

Pairings. teams that WIN, pair players with complementary talents. So the Flyers have found that when they pair AMac with Provorov, or with Ghost, or with Sanheim, they all play up to their potential and are assets to the team (stats tell the story). Haag and Gudas are not reliable enough to do that. Long term, IMO, Haag WILL, maybe even by the end of 18-19. But with the guys on the roster NOW, how do you make pairings that are a net plus against good teams?

Provorov-Haag? Provorov-Gudas? Ghost-Gudas? Sanheim-Haag playing 20 minutes+?

Provorov-AMac/new guy
Sanheim-AMac/new guy
Ghost-Haag/Gudas

Without new guy, no matter how many scorers they sign and if their PP2 gets marginally better, they still are a 1st round exit team.
- hockeyal

So De Haan is the guy that brings it all together?

I would argue it's good for business. Having 3 years of poor attendance for the chance to sell out almost every game for the next 15 years and establish bonds with fans that could last a lifetime would definitely be worth it.
- PhillySportsGuy

It's a gamble, could lose fans that never come back, but winning usually cures that. It will be a bigger problem if they don't become a consistent contender. That applies to both the Sixers and the Flyers.

Morin will never play in the NHL? Could you apply your soothsaying ability to something that can make us a some money?
- Sinisalo4vr

Myers, Friedman, and Willcox have all outplayed him. So unless you are anticipating that the Flyers trade away some roster guys, hard to see him ever cracking the lineup, assuming he is ever healthy again, which is far from a given. He has as much chance of sticking with the team (or any team) as Goulbourne.

So De Haan is the guy that brings it all together?
- MJL

He has proven to be that guy: a good solid defender on a horrible defensive team.

I don't know if anyone else feels this way, but I can't seem to get the fact out of my head that we were so close to drafting Wahlstrom. I wanted him so badly. He would be the sniper we needed for the future, I really wanted Hexy to trade up to snag him.
- ChuckinKnucks

I got my hopes up when he fell to the Islanders. I was thinking two more picks and he could be a Flyer.

Some real characters came out of the woodwork today.
- bighandsome91

You know what, you are correct. They did come out, and will continue to come out. I come here daily to read this site, because I respect most of the poster's opinions. However, when I open the comments and some of the first posts have to do with the Brayden Schen trade, and how horrible the sixers are for tanking. It gets me a little ticked off.

What do either of those things have to do with JVR? the future dev. camp that is happening right now? or the next moves that the flyers may make?

If you don't want to allow other people's opinions on this site, then so be it. If you want it to be/stay a Good Ole Boys Club, thats fine then stay in your cliques, and maybe take some of MJL advice and don't read my posts.

I feel like I have to pass some sort of test to post to the site, what is up with that?

Have a good one brother!