Hunter is vastly over-rated.

I'm not saying he's bad, or nobody should hire him - it's just that if you actually look at his track record in Toronto, he didn't really accomplish anything great.

In his defence, it's still too early to evaluate him on his draft record, but let's just say it's not looking fantastic at this point.

I don't give him credit for drafting Matthews. I don't give him much credit for drafting Marner (9 of the first 10 selections were fantastic - only Arizona pooped the bed).

After that, his record is pretty weak sauce. Toronto fans ranted and raved about how his keen eye for evaluating junior talent would give us a clear edge at the draft table. Yeah, I'm just not seeing it. Sorry.
- Atomic Wedgie

I'm not familiar with Hunter at all and I do not follow the draft at all. I think it's crazy to have to draft these 18 year old kids. It's very difficult to draft these players so young. No idea how they will turn out. I'm tougher on hockey people in terms of trading and FA signings.

Jeez guy......what is it year 3 of the rebuild? Try going 12 years and then talk about talent. The leafs went from literally having NOBODY from Ontario, to having legit talent now and coming up. Far cry from the teachers union days

- kindlyrick

Take a look at his actual draft record:

http://www.hockeydb.com/i...aft/teams/dr00008490.html

We are only talking 3 drafts: 2015-2017.

2015: yes, Marner was a great pick. But honestly, take a look at the top 10:

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/nhl2015e.html

Any one of the top ten (except for Strome) would have been fine. After that, it gets murky. We had the #24 pick, but traded down (and again) to get Dermott and Bracco. Dermott looks OK, but we could have had Aho or Carlo with that pick. Bracco looks like a classic guy of too good for the AHL, not good enough for the NHL. After that, it's all a bunch of crap.

2016 is even worse. My mom would have taken Matthews first. After that, it's a terrible draft. They took Yegor Korshkov with the 31st overall pick - this was a guy who had already been passed up in the draft once (actually, IIRC, twice). They could have selected him with a 5th round pick. Woll is still a prospect. Grundstrom may be an NHLer.

2017 - really too soon to tell.

As per my post above, I've never said he's terrible.

It's just if you talk to a certain subset of Toronto fans, they will tell you that Hunter was the master of evaluating junior talent - he was 100X smarter than anyone else on the draft floor.

The record tells a different story.

How was Garth not qualified? He owned a calculator and a business administration degree.
- eichiefs9

Garth may want a refund on that degree.

Apparently there's an interview out there (I haven't seen it - I've just seen an article that references it) where Stamkos' agent told him (Stamkos) that there was no advantage to signing a new contract prior to hearing offers from other teams. Take five days, hear all the offers, and then decide.

Hard to argue with that.

I'm guessing this thing will come down to the wire. Where it lands, I have no idea.
- Atomic Wedgie

(frank)ing this. everyone upset that he's doing this is just being all emotional and thinking that people are supposed to make business decisions with the feelings of people they dont even know as a top priority. and that is just stupid

And my original point was that if JT didnt have a positive convo with Lou a month ago, then i highly doubt they'd be this close to July 1 with the risk of letting him go for nothing. I'd imagine Lou would be getting something in return at this point. As we both agree, in the interest of Brissons client (JT), its only right to listen to whats out there, and the isles can prob match any dollar amount with that extra year.
- kindlyrick

Just my opinion, but I think you are over-estimating what an NHL team would pay for his rights.

With a 6-day negotiating period, there's just very little incentive for any team to give up anything valuable.

So if you are talking about a 3rd or 4th rounder, if I'm the Isles, I'd rather retain the rights and hope for the best (that's under the assumption that JT is giving Lou the cold shoulder at the moment).

How was Garth not qualified? He owned a calculator and a business administration degree.
- eichiefs9

Thats why he's still there Chief, making decisions.

Yeah, they're gonna need some work with the mess Snowjob left them. Pellegrini right now is like how much are we paying the 4th line?????
- kindlyrick

I cannot wait for the draft. Hopefully it's really good for the Isles. I'll DVR it and watch it all summer.

Take a look at his actual draft record:

http://www.hockeydb.com/i...aft/teams/dr00008490.html

We are only talking 3 drafts: 2015-2017.

2015: yes, Marner was a great pick. But honestly, take a look at the top 10:

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/nhl2015e.html

Any one of the top ten (except for Strome) would have been fine. After that, it gets murky. We had the #24 pick, but traded down (and again) to get Dermott and Bracco. Dermott looks OK, but we could have had Aho or Carlo with that pick. Bracco looks like a classic guy of too good for the AHL, not good enough for the NHL. After that, it's all a bunch of crap.

2016 is even worse. My mom would have taken Matthews first. After that, it's a terrible draft. They took Yegor Korshkov with the 31st overall pick - this was a guy who had already been passed up in the draft once (actually, IIRC, twice). They could have selected him with a 5th round pick. Woll is still a prospect. Grundstrom may be an NHLer.

2017 - really too soon to tell.

As per my post above, I've never said he's terrible.

It's just if you talk to a certain subset of Toronto fans, they will tell you that Hunter was the master of evaluating junior talent - he was 100X smarter than anyone else on the draft floor.

The record tells a different story.
- Atomic Wedgie

Noones gonna hit everytime, and obviously the later rounds are more of a crap shoot. But, after a few years of a rebuild, your team is on the right path. For YEARS they were the laughs, now you have something to build on. The front office is rife talent. By year 5, i believe the leafs will be in the mix for lord stanley.

As for Marner, he's an elite player, and quite honestly, im crying alligator tears for your team down the middle.......give it time. You dont even know what bad drafting is until you see the isles over the last decade.

Just my opinion, but I think you are over-estimating what an NHL team would pay for his rights.

With a 6-day negotiating period, there's just very little incentive for any team to give up anything valuable.

So if you are talking about a 3rd or 4th rounder, if I'm the Isles, I'd rather retain the rights and hope for the best (that's under the assumption that JT is giving Lou the cold shoulder at the moment).
- Atomic Wedgie

I disagree........any team that is willing to trade for his rights would prob only do so if they had a deal in principle with him. I never said he'd get a 3rd or 4th rounder in return. I actually said he'd get more in return for a team to trade for the right to sign him.

I disagree........any team that is willing to trade for his rights would prob only do so if they had a deal in principle with him. I never said he'd get a 3rd or 4th rounder in return. I actually said he'd get more in return for a team to sign him.
- kindlyrick

If you had a deal in principle with him, why would you trade for his rights?

If you had a deal in principle with him, why would you trade for his rights?
- Atomic Wedgie

When I say a deal in principle im talking about a dollar amount with a handshake. He could have the same handshake deal with another team. If you're a team looking to pay that kinda money for a top center in the league, do you risk losing him to another team, who might pay more at the 25th hour, or do you pay up for the right to sign him?

This is getting a bit much. There are 100 scenarios. Point is, if you want someone of his calibur, you dont hope you can snag him on July1. You pay up to do so.

Can anybody see this?

My posts are coming up blank.
- Atomic Wedgie

Best posts I've seen from you in quite some time.

I think it would be foolish for any UFA to not listen to whats out there, as they may be turning away a better deal. My opinion, is JT listens to whats out there and the isles basically match the dollar amount with term (having the extra year).
- kindlyrick

If from what Wedge posted... Teams can only offer JT a contract after July 1st & we lose the option of giving an 8th year, once July 1st hits. So all we can do is match a contract.

XxNYIxX

Just my opinion, but I think you are over-estimating what an NHL team would pay for his rights.

With a 6-day negotiating period, there's just very little incentive for any team to give up anything valuable.

So if you are talking about a 3rd or 4th rounder, if I'm the Isles, I'd rather retain the rights and hope for the best (that's under the assumption that JT is giving Lou the cold shoulder at the moment).
- Atomic Wedgie

So saying we would get "something" is overestimating the return?

honestly, I said it at the end of the year he took over for capuano. He was in charge of their pp for years and it was garbage, and he should have been let go at the end of that year and replaced by a coach with experience. Instead, he hand picked his staff, went with an unconventional idea and then showed zero ability to make adjustments or even understand why they were getting blown out.

IMO he shouldn't get another nhl job as a coach.
- Isles_since_6

Said the same thing on here and was told Dougie knows all. Dougie is a great coach and his knowledge is vast and not to question Dougie.

Said the same thing on here and was told Dougie knows all. Dougie is a great coach and his knowledge is vast and not to question Dougie.
- Cptmjl

This is all still true... it’s the players fault for not seeing his unique vision!!

XxNYIxX

If from what Wedge posted... Teams can only offer JT a contract after July 1st & we lose the option of giving an 8th year, once July 1st hits. So all we can do is match a contract.

XxNYIxX
- XxNYIxX

Theres a million different scenarios, but realize the isles as it stands now, have the upper hand in negotiating with that extra year.

This is all still true... it’s the players fault for not seeing his unique vision!!

XxNYIxX
- XxNYIxX

Said the same thing on here and was told Dougie knows all. Dougie is a great coach and his knowledge is vast and not to question Dougie.
- Cptmjl

Your not exaggerating at all are you

Your not exaggerating at all are you
- nyisles7

Actually not in the least.

Thats why he's still there Chief, making decisions.
- nyisles7

the new guy is like garth, what the (frank) were you thinking here? and wtf is this all about? you know so he never does anything remotely similar