Vegas is laughing to the finals. I cannot respect a “hockey person” that sees zero value in Reaves. It baffles me.
- Grinder47

You must not value anyone in the Vegas organization then.

Low on games played indicates he's playing when other players are injured. His team worst ATOI indicates they don't want him on the ice when he is forced to suit up. To put this perspective every other player except the injured Carrier who is a "physical energy forward" has a minimum 3 more minutes of ATOI!

As for the "it doesn't show up in analytics crowd" that couldn't be further from the truth. Afraid to carry the puck and scared off making good passes? Shows up in posessesion metrics. Hits? Shows up in stats. Do the deep dive on a player like Ryan Reaves and show the proof that when he's on the ice the other team performs worse, if it's true there are numbers to support it. Fact not fiction please.

You must not value anyone in the Vegas organization then.

Low on games played indicates he's playing when other players are injured. His team worst ATOI indicates they don't want him on the ice when he is forced to suit up. To put this perspective every other player except the injured Carrier who is a "physical energy forward" has a minimum 3 more minutes of ATOI!

As for the "it doesn't show up in analytics crowd" that couldn't be further from the truth. Afraid to carry the puck and scared off making good passes? Shows up in posessesion metrics. Hits? Shows up in stats. Do the deep dive on a player like Ryan Reaves and show the proof that when he's on the ice the other team performs worse, if it's true there are numbers to support it. Fact not fiction please.
- Xyriin

Just a question.

What does the bold text actually mean?

If you want to do that with Reaves, why not do that with every player, every shift, every game?

How's does analytics prove that a player has value in a game? Shots on goal don't win games. Shots against don't lose games. Hits don't win or lose games. Possession metrics don't actually win games. Do you know what wins games? So who gets credit for winning games, individuals? If a player being on the ice makes his team better, in what way would that be that helps win a game? What tactics are these players following? Coaches directions - is there a stat for that? No fiction please.

You must not value anyone in the Vegas organization then.

Low on games played indicates he's playing when other players are injured. His team worst ATOI indicates they don't want him on the ice when he is forced to suit up. To put this perspective every other player except the injured Carrier who is a "physical energy forward" has a minimum 3 more minutes of ATOI!

As for the "it doesn't show up in analytics crowd" that couldn't be further from the truth. Afraid to carry the puck and scared off making good passes? Shows up in posessesion metrics. Hits? Shows up in stats. Do the deep dive on a player like Ryan Reaves and show the proof that when he's on the ice the other team performs worse, if it's true there are numbers to support it. Fact not fiction please.
- Xyriin

Reaves takes one shift, Forechecks, even if he misses a hit on the defensemen they know freight train that could have put them out of the series just missed them. Rest of the game they are hurrying plays and on edge checking who is on the ice.

Where’s that stat?

Reaves sits on the bench, teammates feel a foot taller. Where’s that stat?

You must not value anyone in the Vegas organization then.

Low on games played indicates he's playing when other players are injured. His team worst ATOI indicates they don't want him on the ice when he is forced to suit up. To put this perspective every other player except the injured Carrier who is a "physical energy forward" has a minimum 3 more minutes of ATOI!

As for the "it doesn't show up in analytics crowd" that couldn't be further from the truth. Afraid to carry the puck and scared off making good passes? Shows up in posessesion metrics. Hits? Shows up in stats. Do the deep dive on a player like Ryan Reaves and show the proof that when he's on the ice the other team performs worse, if it's true there are numbers to support it. Fact not fiction please.
- Xyriin

You must not value anyone in the Vegas organization then.

Low on games played indicates he's playing when other players are injured. His team worst ATOI indicates they don't want him on the ice when he is forced to suit up. To put this perspective every other player except the injured Carrier who is a "physical energy forward" has a minimum 3 more minutes of ATOI!

As for the "it doesn't show up in analytics crowd" that couldn't be further from the truth. Afraid to carry the puck and scared off making good passes? Shows up in posessesion metrics. Hits? Shows up in stats. Do the deep dive on a player like Ryan Reaves and show the proof that when he's on the ice the other team performs worse, if it's true there are numbers to support it. Fact not fiction please.
- Xyriin

I don't know who you are or where you came from but I like your style. You should post here more often.

Reaves takes one shift, Forechecks, even if he misses a hit on the defensemen they know freight train that could have put them out of the series just missed them. Rest of the game they are hurrying plays and on edge checking who is on the ice.

Where’s that stat?

Reaves sits on the bench, teammates feel a foot taller. Where’s that stat?
- Grinder47

I don't believe missed hits is a stat.

Why would they make plays quicker because a guy that plays 6 mins a night missed a hit?

Just a question.

What does the bold text actually mean?

If you want to do that with Reaves, why not do that with every player, every shift, every game?

How's does analytics prove that a player has value in a game? Shots on goal don't win games. Shots against don't lose games. Hits don't win or lose games. Possession metrics don't actually win games. Do you know what wins games? So who gets credit for winning games, individuals? If a player being on the ice makes his team better, in what way would that be that helps win a game? What tactics are these players following? Coaches directions - is there a stat for that? No fiction please.
- Aussiepenguin

To me there's something just not right about an expansion team in the Cup final. Having said that, I want Fleury to hoist. Get it done MAF.

- Feds91Stammer

Did you answer that guy the other day about your chart?

Now that is

To me there's something just not right about an expansion team in the Cup final. Having said that, I want Fleury to hoist. Get it done MAF.
- MattStrat

What isn't right about it? Everyone had them as a bottom 5 team and they completely destroyed everyone's expectations.

Did you answer that guy the other day about your chart?

Now that is
- Aussiepenguin

I don't have any charts. GTFOH

To me there's something just not right about an expansion team in the Cup final. Having said that, I want Fleury to hoist. Get it done MAF.
- MattStrat

I have mixed emotions about it, but I kind of agree with this. I love the team game Vegas plays, but I'm still rooting for Tampa. I like their brand of hockey and Stevie Y built a great team through draft and development. Shrewd trades too.

I feel like Vegas was given a short cut even though a tremendous amount of credit goes to the GM and coach.

Do you people here actually think that Reaves would have moved the needle for the Pens in the playoffs?

Ok well done you're 1. And you know what, I don't remember you saying anything stupid about stats recently - coincidence?

Never hockey but earnt a living playing rugby league.
- Aussiepenguin

I'll give ya that. Rugby is pretty rough.

Do you people here actually think that Reaves would have moved the needle for the Pens in the playoffs?
- Rinosaur

Sadly I think some do.

Sadly I think some do.
- Feds91Stammer

I guess I really shouldn't be shocked.

I guess I really shouldn't be shocked.
- Rinosaur

Disappointed but not surprised I guess

Do you people here actually think that Reaves would have moved the needle for the Pens in the playoffs?
- Rinosaur

Well, we did dress 3 complete lines that failed to move the needle...

When your on the ice against someone who is known to hit, like Reaves, you do become aware of when your on with him. Thing is, hitting is hard, especially against guys with skill and better edge work. Easy to avoid, and the skill guys will get many touches with Reaves no where near.

Reaves should be praised for stepping in and scoring some timely goals and making the most of his ice time, not for some perceived intimidation factor.

The trade to acquire Reaves to the Pens was terrible, but also I don't think he got a fair shake. I think they could have gotten more out of him.

WITH THAT SAID...

-Reaves COULD have possibly given the Pens a SLIGHTLY better 4th line.
-Reave COULD have helped to curb the Shenanigans with both the Flyers and Caps.

What would Reaves have NOT done?
-Cured the injuries to Phil, Geno and Brass
-Stopped the Pens' from pinching too much/overplaying pucks, leading to odd-man rushes the other way.

Remember that Wilson did not play for three games, so the Pens had ability to take advantage of less physical play and didn't.

The Caps played better, wanted it more and they won. Reaves would not have changed the outcome.

Oh, and the Pens won two cups in a row where both years everyone thought they were too soft and felt physical teams could pound them into submission... those people were wrong.

This idea that Reaves would have made Sid or Geno feel more comfortable is pure bullpoop. They had no problem the two years before when teams were trying to beat them to a bloody pulp.

I think my entire point is I REALLY hope the commenters will stop saying stupid sh.it all next season about we are losing because of 1 player... Or even a 4th line as Ive laid out the last 4 teams alive 4th lines and they are ugly at best. We also had a writer that literally wasted 90% of blogs for a while on 1 player saying "thats why the penguins are losing".....

And to the other guy not sure his name... wouldnt Reaves value to Vegas be more the a 1st, 2nd, 3rd, round pick if thats the way you are thinking!? Because Tatar is HEALTHY and Reaves is playing over him...

Blackstrom props to you.... You kind of laid of exactly what I was saying and what Big Buff said about having Reaves on the ice. Ive never once said Id want Reaves in my top 9. Should he be in before Tatar... who knows but nobody is chirping Gallant for doing it? Maybe if Tatar is in the lineup Fleury doesnt have to be quite that good... how does a coaching mistake like that play into stats?

I think my entire point is I REALLY hope the commenters will stop saying stupid sh.it all next season about we are losing because of 1 player... Or even a 4th line as Ive laid out the last 4 teams alive 4th lines and they are ugly at best. We also had a writer that literally wasted 90% of blogs for a while on 1 player saying "thats why the penguins are losing".....

And to the other guy not sure his name... wouldnt Reaves value to Vegas be more the a 1st, 2nd, 3rd, round pick if thats the way you are thinking!? Because Tatar is HEALTHY and Reaves is playing over him...

Blackstrom props to you.... You kind of laid of exactly what I was saying and what Big Buff said about having Reaves on the ice. Ive never once said Id want Reaves in my top 9. Should he be in before Tatar... who knows but nobody is chirping Gallant for doing it? Maybe if Tatar is in the lineup Fleury doesnt have to be quite that good... how does a coaching mistake like that play into stats?
- pens4life-66

I've been calling Gallant an idiot for a long time.

Also if you don't know if Tatar should be in the lineup over Reaves I don't think hockey is for you.

I've been calling Gallant an idiot for a long time.

Also if you don't know if Tatar should be in the lineup over Reaves I don't think hockey is for you.
- Feds91Stammer

So you should be hired over Gallant!? Hes doing pretty well but "hockey isnt for him"

So you should be hired over Gallant!? Hes doing pretty well but "hockey isnt for him"
- pens4life-66

I'm 100% sure I am more familiar with Tatar's game than Gallant is.