This board is degrading into a snipefest lately
- riozzo

People should be free to express whatever opinions they have. As long as it's not personal. The lecturing of what people post is absurd.

I can't stand PowerEnforcers constant conspiracy theories. Sometimes I post a funny response to him (usually a picture of a tin foil hat) but mainly I let it go. I also get tired of Vandermeers constant drive to stock the Hawks with goons. Sometimes I'll debate him, but never will I tell him he shouldn't post it. That's his view. I think it's wrong, but it's his view, I'm cool with it....though I do think we do need to be tougher...Hawks have been a soft team for a long time now.

I also have been defending Q on this board, though of late that's getting harder and harder. I'm not telling people they shouldn't be so negative about him because he coached the Hawks to 3 Cups. I think he should stay, but others don't believe that. Maybe they are right....i don't think they are, but who knows?

Not really a rental, Brassard is under contract for another year. Ian Cole is the one whose contract ends this year
- TexasHawk

Fair enough, but if they don't win a cup in these next 2 years the trade is a bad one, my point is every year all these teams make trades and only one team is considered successful

Here comes more lectures of how people should act toward Super Stan. Further, are you joking? Stan's mind numbing idiotic trades have been dissected to death. It is far more than HE SUCKS.

No one said the Vermette trade was bad. But it's not hard to trade for an impending UFA as long as you're willing to give up value. Big deal, he moved a 1 and prospect for him. Great job Stan, you're awesome.

The real test of Stan was sustaining the program, which he is failing to do. For every Vermette deal, there is a Danault deal, contracts of Bickell that necessitated giving away Teuvo, the Daley deal, the Kimo deal, huge contracts combined with no trade clauses, trading Leddy for trash, the Rundblad idiocy, etc., etc.......i am not even bringing up trades from last summer, which I am actually waiting to make my final judgment on, but he traded Hammer for a guy who is often times scratched and Panarin has almost twice the points as Saad. He has given away vast amounts of resources for low productive players or simply put players who don't even belong in the NHL.
- kwolf68

Anyone can look at things from the past and say they suck now because they failed.

Bickell had (frank)ing undiagnosed MS
Leddy was unaffordable, and we got a high end prospect in Pokka that people were high on at the time. He didn't work out. It happens.
Getting Daley was views positively, then Q wouldn't use him in his system, so he was sent packing after failing miserably here. He had no value at that point anymore.
Danault had barely played for us at the point he was traded. Yeah, we should have kept him. Not a great move, but not many were that mad when it happened because it was viewed as loading up for the playoffs.
Kimmo was bad and Stan should feel bad.
Nobody in the universe would have though Saad would struggle this hard coming back.

Where the hell did I say that? If someone thinks Bowman is great fine, post it...have at it. I don't care. I am not going to lecture you on what you should post. Perhaps I'll debate against it, but I am NOT telling you that you should not post it. Good grief.
- kwolf68

Nobody told you not to post it. Not sure why you keep repeating that.

Also, meh. Isn't this a no brainer trade they should have made? I mean it takes no brilliance to make a trade at the deadline involving a pick, prospect and a player you were going to move on from, right?

Not sure why it even rates a mention.
- HawkintheD

@TSNBobMcKenzie

PIT-OTT deal involving Brassard is ultra-complicated, so much so that Brassard will likely first be traded to a team other than PIT. Then flipped to PIT. Hearing that third team is likely VGK. Potential for layers of salary retention.

It's also become very complicated.

People should be free to express whatever opinions they have. As long as it's not personal. The lecturing of what people post is absurd.

I can't stand PowerEnforcers constant conspiracy theories. Sometimes I post a funny response to him (usually a picture of a tin foil hat) but mainly I let it go. I also get tired of Vandermeers constant drive to stock the Hawks with goons. Sometimes I'll debate him, but never will I tell him he shouldn't post it. That's his view. I think it's wrong, but it's his view, I'm cool with it....though I do think we do need to be tougher...Hawks have been a soft team for a long time now.

I also have been defending Q on this board, though of late that's getting harder and harder. I'm not telling people they shouldn't be so negative about him because he coached the Hawks to 3 Cups. I think he should stay, but others don't believe that. Maybe they are right....i don't think they are, but who knows?
- kwolf68

This

As a hawk fan I'm great full to have enjoyed the three cups in 6 years. Stan was in charge for let's say 2 he made mistakes along the way but at the time of the twin contracts they were easily in the top 10/15 in the league and were excepted to push the salary bar. The cap wasn't suppose to go flat so I can cant really say they were bad contracts (yes you can argue .5/1m high) but the union needed them to raise the bar. Stan has been criticized and rightfully so for the timo trade and for the length/ salary and nmc in seabrooks contract but how many true fans would give up those three cups for a slightly better or even real good team now?

And for those of you who say that the press and bolts are so well run and have amazing gms tell me again how any cups do they have?

The other teams and players learned from the twins contracts that they needed to take less to have better teams. Maybe the press or bolts win a cup or two but let's see how's well there team/ cap look after winning 3 cups.........

Anyone can look at things from the past and say they suck now because they failed.

Bickell had (frank)ing undiagnosed MS
Leddy was unaffordable, and we got a high end prospect in Pokka that people were high on at the time. He didn't work out. It happens.
Getting Daley was views positively, then Q wouldn't use him in his system, so he was sent packing after failing miserably here. He had no value at that point anymore.
Danault had barely played for us at the point he was traded. Yeah, we should have kept him. Not a great move, but not many were that mad when it happened because it was viewed as loading up for the playoffs.
Kimmo was bad and Stan should feel bad.
Nobody in the universe would have though Saad would struggle this hard coming back.
- JRoenick97

Regarding Saad, if you will read my post I have NOT taken Stan to task on that, but early returns are not good. I think that one turns around. So all my "incessant negativity" I am still willing to let that one (and even the Murphy deal) play out a bit.

The rest of your post was absolute spin. Pokka was never going to be good, he couldn't skate. Leddy should have been traded way before the day before the season began. Same as the Sharp trade...waited too long, lost the market, got screwed. Don't forget they got 2 other players for him. Never to be heard from in Chicago lore again.

Loading up for the playoffs? By bringing in healthy scratch scrubs? I guess our opinion of loading up is different.

The MS thing with Bickell is completely irrelevant. Sad as that is, moving his deal (for whatever reason) cost the Hawks a terrific young player. You can NOT celebrate every good player Stan acquires and then explain or justify every good player he has to dump.

I will give Stan credit where I believe credit is due...

His absolutely good moves?
-Getting Leddy was great (this move subsequently washed away)
-Getting Oduya for a pair of 2s was very good
-Adding richards and vermette were nice pickups
-Frolik for Skille (I think) was super
-Drafting of Saad
-Early returns on his drafts of Hayden and Cat look good.

Stan's good trades are years out. He hasn't made a good trade in like 3 or 4 years....Panik for Morin had potential, but that one has turned into nothing (sorry don't like Duclair at all).

I can admit where he has done well, sadly, of late it's been mostly hard misses.

This
- riozzo

Yeah, the thing is nobody is actually doing that. Having a different opinion that someone is not a lecture. Pointing out that all the negatives someone said doesn't make a GM a bad GM when you leave out literally any positives.

Regarding Saad, if you will read my post I have NOT taken Stan to task on that, but early returns are not good. I think that one turns around. So all my "incessant negativity" I am still willing to let that one (and even the Murphy deal) play out a bit.

The rest of your post was absolute spin. Pokka was never going to be good, he couldn't skate. Leddy should have been traded way before the day before the season began. Same as the Sharp trade...waited too long, lost the market, got screwed. Don't forget they got 2 other players for him. Never to be heard from in Chicago lore again.

Loading up for the playoffs? By bringing in healthy scratch scrubs? I guess our opinion of loading up is different.

The MS thing with Bickell is completely irrelevant. Sad as that is, moving his deal (for whatever reason) cost the Hawks a terrific young player. You can NOT celebrate every good player Stan acquires and then explain or justify every good player he has to dump.

I will give Stan credit where I believe credit is due...

His absolutely good moves?
-Getting Leddy was great (this move subsequently washed away)
-Getting Oduya for a pair of 2s was very good
-Adding richards and vermette were nice pickups
-Frolik for Skille (I think) was super
-Drafting of Saad
-Early returns on his drafts of Hayden and Cat look good.

Stan's good trades are years out. He hasn't made a good trade in like 3 or 4 years....Panik for Morin had potential, but that one has turned into nothing (sorry don't like Duclair at all).

I can admit where he has done well, sadly, of late it's been mostly hard misses.
- kwolf68

These weren't my "spin" it was literally the overall feel of the trades at the time that they happened. NYI guys were actually bummed to lose Pokka, but they got Leddy. Q was barely using Leddy here either.

Fleishmann was an every game player in MTL when he was traded. He was a fine bottom 6 player. Weise was supposed to be a "tough guy" who could help the bottom 6. Again, didn't fit in Qs system.

Yeah, the thing is nobody is actually doing that. Having a different opinion that someone is not a lecture. Pointing out that all the negatives someone said doesn't make a GM a bad GM when you leave out literally any positives.
- JRoenick97

.

My Point, this thing is breaking down to personal crap. I am worried that the long term solid contributors who I enjoy reading may disappear. And that is before VOPARash and his cousin the goalie

These weren't my "spin" it was literally the overall feel of the trades at the time that they happened. NYI guys were actually bummed to lose Pokka, but they got Leddy. Q was barely using Leddy here either.
- JRoenick97

LOL....ok. He traded Leddy for 3 bums. I don't care if "NY Guys hated it"....Stan (frank)ed that one up. Yet here you are explaining it away. I am sorry, but "Ny guys" doesn't NOT equate to actual on ice production of the return the Hawks got for Leddy.

I guess on a Minnesota board they are going, "Hawks fans hated trading Cam Barker for an unknown 18 year old D-man" to explain that dumbass trade Minnesota did. Funny thing about that trade is Kim Johnsan was the primary piece in that deal and his career was over soon after getting to Chicago due to concussion. LMAO....nice going Wild. In the end, the Hawks have absolutely nothing to show for what was maybe Stan's best trade ever. Only Stan can manage to bungle his best trade into one of his worst trades.

LOL....ok. He traded Leddy for 3 bums. I don't care if "NY Guys hated it"....Stan (frank)ed that one up. Yet here you are explaining it away. I am sorry, but "Ny guys" doesn't NOT equate to actual on ice production of the return the Hawks got for Leddy.

I guess on a Minnesota board they are going, "Hawks fans hated trading Cam Barker for an unknown 18 year old D-man" to explain that dumbass trade Minnesota did. Funny thing about that trade is Kim Johnsan was the primary piece in that deal and his career was over soon after getting to Chicago due to concussion. LMAO....nice going Wild.
- kwolf68

You're missing the point. Pokka was a high end D prospect at the time. Yeah, we know he didn't work out, but he was. Not spin, not just fan opinions, it was a fact.

You're missing the point. Pokka was a high end D prospect at the time. Yeah, we know he didn't work out, but he was. Not spin, not just fan opinions, it was a fact.
- JRoenick97

High end LMAO. At the time he was either the 3rd or 4th best Islanders D prospect in a horribly over-rated mass of D-men slugs in the Islanders system. Pulock has turned into a decent player from that group, but no one else has. "High End" is what the Hawks should have gotten, a can't miss type, not their 5th or 6th overall prospect, but their BEST prospect. Bowman and crew did a very poor job of scouting and making that trade.

Still, even if Pokka was as you say and still flamed, the Hawks should NOT have gotten a 28 year old AHLer in addition. WTF is the point of that? Maybe if Bowman makes the Leddy deal before the 11th hour he can get a 2nd decent prospect or a pick that would have at least had a better chance than a journeyman.

This is simple math. If your back is to the wall and you're desperate YOU LOSE VALUE. Stan did that to himself, he backed himself into the wall to the night before the season began. Can you at least admit that?

Let me report some good news.
Apparently Q in on #fallinfordahlin
Jean Francois Berube is supposedly your starting G tonight.

No one could make this sh!t up.
Forsberg has some good games, maybe finally getting his wheels underneath him.
Then he's Q'd.

Way to go Q.
Although I am a bit scared of Q getting a top 5 pick.

Let me report some good news.
Apparently Q in on #fallinfordahlin
Jean Francois Berube is supposedly your starting G tonight.

No one could make this sh!t up.
Forsberg has some good games, maybe finally getting his wheels underneath him.
Then he's Q'd.

Way to go Q.
Although I am a bit scared of Q getting a top 5 pick.
- savvyone-1

I think Forsberg should be in most every game, but they do have a back to back....Berube was likely to play 1 of the games anyway.

High end LMAO. At the time he was either the 3rd or 4th best Islanders D prospect in a horribly over-rated mass of D-men slugs in the Islanders system. Pulock has turned into a decent player from that group, but no one else has. "High End" is what the Hawks should have gotten, a can't miss type. They did a very poor job of scouting and making that trade.

Still, even if Pokka flamed, the Hawks should NOT have gotten a 28 year old AHLer in addition. WTF is the point of that? Maybe if Bowman makes the Leddy deal before the 11th hour he can get a 2nd decent prospect or a pick that would have at least had a better chance than a journeyman.

This is simple math. If your back is to the wall and you're desperate YOU LOSE VALUE. Stan did that to himself, he backed himself into the wall to the night before the season began. Can you at least admit that?
- kwolf68

Not entirely.
Had to be helped by Q's asset management.
Just like with Daley.
When your head coach would rather the team keep Rozy the dinosaur at almost $2M (not going to look it up, I think his contract at the time was $1.8) instead, Stan's fate was sealed.
Stan's not blameless in this deal. But Q did jump right in to help out.
He's had a habit of doing that before and we're seeing it again (well, saw it again with Kempny and now with Murphy). Murphy will be the next guy up.

High end LMAO. At the time he was either the 3rd or 4th best Islanders D prospect in a horribly over-rated mass of D-men slugs in the Islanders system. Pulock has turned into a decent player from that group, but no one else has. "High End" is what the Hawks should have gotten, a can't miss type, not their 5th or 6th overall prospect, but their BEST prospect. Bowman and crew did a very poor job of scouting and making that trade.

Still, even if Pokka was as you say and still flamed, the Hawks should NOT have gotten a 28 year old AHLer in addition. WTF is the point of that? Maybe if Bowman makes the Leddy deal before the 11th hour he can get a 2nd decent prospect or a pick that would have at least had a better chance than a journeyman.

This is simple math. If your back is to the wall and you're desperate YOU LOSE VALUE. Stan did that to himself, he backed himself into the wall to the night before the season began. Can you at least admit that?
- kwolf68

Yes, he does have a tendency to wait too long to made trades that he pretty much has to make.

I think Forsberg should be in most every game, but they do have a back to back....Berube was likely to play 1 of the games anyway.
- kwolf68

Why?
Crawford has played many back-to-backs during his time.
If I were the Hawks, I would sure want to see if the guy could handle it.

Not entirely.
Had to be helped by Q's asset management.
Just like with Daley.
When your head coach would rather the team keep Rozy the dinosaur at almost $2M (not going to look it up, I think his contract at the time was $1.8) instead, Stan's fate was sealed.
Stan's not blameless in this deal. But Q did jump right in to help out.
He's had a habit of doing that before and we're seeing it again (well, saw it again with Kempny and now with Murphy). Murphy will be the next guy up.
- savvyone-1

LMAO.

I will admit Q's handling of the players bothers me. I didn't mind him "protecting" Leddy in 2013, because Leds was freaking what...19? 20? But if Q really kept Rosy over Leddy and that's part of that deal, then yea....Q needs to be sent to the principles office.

Not entirely.
Had to be helped by Q's asset management.
Just like with Daley.
When your head coach would rather the team keep Rozy the dinosaur at almost $2M (not going to look it up, I think his contract at the time was $1.8) instead, Stan's fate was sealed.
Stan's not blameless in this deal. But Q did jump right in to help out.
He's had a habit of doing that before and we're seeing it again (well, saw it again with Kempny and now with Murphy). Murphy will be the next guy up.
- savvyone-1

Which is weird because he seems to play the style Q likes. Leddy and Daley were more offensive. Now he's playing Oesterle over Murphy. So weird.

Why?
Crawford has played many back-to-backs during his time.
If I were the Hawks, I would sure want to see if the guy could handle it.
- savvyone-1

I can't really disagree. Maybe they are showcasing Berube for a big blockbuster trade.

Yes, he does have a tendency to wait too long to made trades that he pretty much has to make.
- JRoenick97

And in your spirit of bipartisan compromise, let me also state that Stan has NOT done that (waited too long) lately. That seems to be something he learned, hence the Saad trade to CBJ, the Hammer trade, the Saad trade from CBJ. Bowman was very proactive on those trades and I honestly still like them. Saad will rebound next year, I am sure and Murphy needs to freaking play and learn, coach his ass up. He's a good kid with some skill, quit benching him every 2nd game.

Now I get to head to hockey practice and hear all these Penguins fans talk about a 3-peat.

I want any other team to win the Cup this year. ANY. OTHER.

Now I get to head to hockey practice and hear all these Penguins fans talk about a 3-peat.

I want any other team to win the Cup this year. ANY. OTHER.
- kwolf68

I heard it last night at my game. That was before the trade. VGK-Tampa please