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Forums :: Blog World :: James Tanner: PLUS / MINUS: Late Summer Hockey Fix Edition
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DeflatedPucks
Pittsburgh Penguins
Location: NYC, NY
Joined: 04.29.2016

Aug 13 @ 1:28 PM ET
So what you're saying is D is not that important?
- walshyleafsfan

HB77
Edmonton Oilers
Location: PC is a genius for drafting mcdavid
Joined: 02.20.2007

Aug 13 @ 1:30 PM ET
- eichel is so good. And as you mentioned, Because so many people sleep on him, Pretty sure I can get away with grabbing him in the 2nd maybe even early 3rd in our 8 man league this year. I think He's gonna have a monster year. 75-85 I bet.

- Fargo is the greatest tv show ever and I'm not sure the it's even really all that close

- I'll bet ya anything babcok really does think hainsey will make Reilly a better player. There certainly might be some hyperbole in there, but don't think for a second that even the most progressive thinkers in the game still dont believe in defensive reliable stay at home Guys as valuable pieces and good teachers.


- the new arcade fire is pretty darn good. Not their best by any means (suburbs)but they don't make bad music so it could never be hated on too much

- cause at this point, Leon is another echelon. And deservedly so. He outscored nylander by almost 20. Had more than a ppg in the playoffs and was probably the best player on a team that has connor mcdavid, in said playoffs. He's just got more cache than nylander. But that could change

Good blog
GreatGigInTheSky
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: "Yeah, Garth is a tool"- Garf, ON
Joined: 06.12.2017

Aug 13 @ 1:31 PM ET
So what you're saying is D is not that important?
- walshyleafsfan


Only if you have crazy tongue skills and talented fingers.
Mrbs71
Joined: 03.08.2013

Aug 13 @ 1:35 PM ET
There's a reason why Cody Franson is and has always been an after thought in the NHL
- walshyleafsfan


Fair enough..lol

The fact that he brought the Leafs Dermott and Bracco may turn out to be his greatest contribution.
nbboy
Toronto Maple Leafs
Joined: 07.05.2010

Aug 13 @ 1:42 PM ET
I predict a top five finish in NHL scoring if Eichel's healthy all year. Damn that kids good!!
- LeftCoaster

I think everyone knows this is possible,including Leaf fans.I also think that a certain blogger on this site does him more harm then good and thats why we get so much back and forth bullpoop.
Tumbleweed
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: avid reader of the daily douche news
Joined: 03.14.2014

Aug 13 @ 1:51 PM ET
I hear you, dude. Mark Fraser and Cody Franson looked like studs one year as the third pairing, stats wise. Would you want them lining up against OV and Backstrom all night? Lol

I would rather Rielly on one leg with and eye patch on defending Tarasenko over Marincin but the stats would say otherwise.

- Mrbs71


depends. if you you use a stat like GAR, it'll tell Z, rielly and gardiner were good while everyone else the leafs used last year sucked.

if you use a tanner's methodology of using a random collection of stats including corsi rel, you'll get fooled into thinking someone like marinicin is good.
walshyleafsfan
Vancouver Canucks
Location: I really don't care about Nylander, I really hope he gets injured and is out - Makita
Joined: 07.14.2011

Aug 13 @ 2:07 PM ET
- eichel is so good. Because so many so many people sleep on him, Pretty sure I can get away with grabbing him in the 2nd maybe even early 3rd in our 8 man league this year. He's gonna have a monster year. 75-85 I bet.

- Fargo is the greatest tv show ever and I'm not sure the it's even really all that close

- I'll bet ya anything babcok really does think hainsey will make Reilly a better player. There certainly might be some hyperbole in there, but don't think for a second that even the most progressive thinkers in the game still dont believe in defensive reliable stay at home Guys as valuable pieces and good teachers.


- the new arcade fire is pretty darn good. Not their best by any means (suburbs)but they don't make bad music so it could never be hated on too much

- cause at this point, Leon is another echelon. And deservedly so. He outscored nylander by almost 20. Had more than a ppg in the playoffs and was probably the best player on a team that has connor mcdavid, in said playoffs. He's just got more cache than nylander. But that could change

Good blog

- HB77


Thing with Eichel is he has to show it. And on both sides of the puck. Otherwise he's a Stamkos or Tavares and not a superstar. He has to look interested occasionally.
PensWin87
Joined: 07.01.2017

Aug 13 @ 2:16 PM ET
War on Drugs sounds like a cross between David Grey and Bruce Cockburn
Trevrrrgavo
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: London, ON
Joined: 03.28.2013

Aug 13 @ 2:17 PM ET
Man, the Arcade Fire is a great band. I'm curious, are you just someone who thinks they generally suck or did the new album just let you down? I know a lot of people who were not digging it, and the reviews were pretty lukewarm at best, so I'm curious.

Personally, I think they're one of the only bands doing something interesting and originally and progressive, weird and ambitious. At least, one of the only bands doing that in a mainstream framework.

- James_Tanner



I generally think they suck. Arcade fire, death from above and bands of that sort are a dime a dozen to me. They all sound the same. And all their new albums have this synth rock sound. Which is the pop scene for rock right now. It's not interesting or progressive to me. I've always tried to stay well rounded in my musical taste. But lately the hard rock genre is the only one that I'm digging new music from. I could just be getting old too. I'm probably getting old and crusty.
HB77
Edmonton Oilers
Location: PC is a genius for drafting mcdavid
Joined: 02.20.2007

Aug 13 @ 2:18 PM ET
Thing with Eichel is he has to show it. And on both sides of the puck. Otherwise he's a Stamkos or Tavares and not a superstar. He has to look interested occasionally.
- walshyleafsfan

He does tend to have that disinterested look/effort level. Especially defensively. Maybe that's just his game though?
And yeah, still almost on a ppg pace in an injury shortened year. Not sure what sabres fans would say of his defensive game overall last year...

I think he'll firmly be mentioned among the games greats after this year
annoyed
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: ON
Joined: 10.28.2013

Aug 13 @ 2:26 PM ET
I generally think they suck. Arcade fire, death from above and bands of that sort are a dime a dozen to me. They all sound the same. And all their new albums have this synth rock sound. Which is the pop scene for rock right now. It's not interesting or progressive to me. I've always tried to stay well rounded in my musical taste. But lately the hard rock genre is the only one that I'm digging new music from. I could just be getting old too. I'm probably getting old and crusty.
- Trevrrrgavo



No, youre right. A lot of those bands suck unfortunately.
ChrisMS
Joined: 05.02.2012

Aug 13 @ 2:29 PM ET
"Playing with Nino will make Markus Foligno elite... I guarantee it. " - Bike Mabcock.
mr.sir
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Vancouver Island, BC
Joined: 01.18.2015

Aug 13 @ 2:42 PM ET
Album of the decade ? 👎🏻
ZechsMarquise
Boston Bruins
Location: near St. Louis, IL
Joined: 01.22.2016

Aug 13 @ 2:51 PM ET
Suicide Squad was entertaining but kind of trash imo. Movie about villians that had no actual kills. And the joker was kind of weak, but maybe that just bias based on how fuking good Ledger was. Whoever they casted to be Amanda Waller was spot on tho 👍🏽.
sbroads24
Buffalo Sabres
Location: We are in 30th place. It's 2017 , NY
Joined: 02.12.2012

Aug 13 @ 3:07 PM ET
Thing with Eichel is he has to show it. And on both sides of the puck. Otherwise he's a Stamkos or Tavares and not a superstar. He has to look interested occasionally.
- walshyleafsfan

Lol. He's already a superstar

He scored .93 PPG at 20 years old coming off an ankle injury
James Tanner
Joined: 12.21.2013

Aug 13 @ 3:17 PM ET
depends. if you you use a stat like GAR, it'll tell Z, rielly and gardiner were good while everyone else the leafs used last year sucked.

if you use a tanner's methodology of using a random collection of stats including corsi rel, you'll get fooled into thinking someone like marinicin is good.

- Tumbleweed


Gar is a good stat, but flawed in that it over-values PP and faceoffs, so you can find out who is effective, but players who get a lot of ice time tend to be over-valued, which isn't necessarily a bad thing, but one thing about stats is seeing who needs more ice time and who needs less.

But honestly I'm pretty much done with anyone who doesn't acknowledge that Marincin is good: when he is on the ice his team has consistently gotten more shot-attempts, shots, scoring chances and goals than the other team.

The fact is, people (including some NHL coaches and GMs) often underrate low-impact players. That is to say that if Marincin threw big hits and scored a bit more, but had worse overall stats, people would like him better.

But he has zero offense, and the only time you really notice him is when he makes a mistake, which you notice and overrated due to confirmation bias.

WAR and GAR are great stats, but just because their convenient doesn't make them any better if you're not going to go deep and try to put everything in context.
James Tanner
Joined: 12.21.2013

Aug 13 @ 3:22 PM ET
Mrbs71

No such thing as tough assignment in the world of analytics....until the guys in fantasy land realize they are the toughest mins and that these guys put up lesser stats because of it you will keep reading this same poop.

- Garnie



Man, you have one note and that's all you ever play. Instead of thinking that people who make their living crunching numbers got something wrong, why not listen to what they have to say?

I've listened to your argument about quality of competition and I've listened to Steve Burch, who is a math teacher and analytics expert. Your argument stinks compared to his.

Coaches deploy players so they are effective and if they are, this shouldn't be used to discredit a player. If you're effective against bad comp. there's a very high probability (its in the 90s) that you will be effective moving up the lineup.

Also, if you play weak comp. you have weaker linemates, and it balances out.

Finally, like Steve says, QOC really only moves the needle in very small sample sizes. Once you get into big samples, you end up with an average number and it's hard to move it either way.

LIke, take shot quality. IN a random game you could outshoot our opponent by 20 shots and have the vast majority of them come from centre ice. This could happen, in a single game.

But if you've ever seen a hockey game, you'd know how rare it is, which is why, when you get a big sample size, you don't need to worry about shot quality. It's the beauty of sample size - get a big enough one, and anomalies can safely be ignored.
James Tanner
Joined: 12.21.2013

Aug 13 @ 3:23 PM ET
War on Drugs sounds like a cross between David Grey and Bruce Cockburn
- PensWin87


That's a really weird comparison. I personally do not agree with that at all, but everyone is gonna hear something different.

To me they sort of sound like if Don Henley fronted My Morning Jacket.
James Tanner
Joined: 12.21.2013

Aug 13 @ 3:25 PM ET
Suicide Squad was entertaining but kind of trash imo. Movie about villians that had no actual kills. And the joker was kind of weak, but maybe that just bias based on how fuking good Ledger was. Whoever they casted to be Amanda Waller was spot on tho 👍🏽.
- ZechsMarquise


I like it's trashiness. And I liked the Joker. The extended cut really makes it a better movie.

My only complaint is that it should have been R rated.
James Tanner
Joined: 12.21.2013

Aug 13 @ 3:27 PM ET
I generally think they suck. Arcade fire, death from above and bands of that sort are a dime a dozen to me. They all sound the same. And all their new albums have this synth rock sound. Which is the pop scene for rock right now. It's not interesting or progressive to me. I've always tried to stay well rounded in my musical taste. But lately the hard rock genre is the only one that I'm digging new music from. I could just be getting old too. I'm probably getting old and crusty.
- Trevrrrgavo



Death from Above is just bass and drums, no? They don't sound anything like Arcade Fire - it's like saying INXS and the Beatles sound alike.

I guess if you don't like synthy stuff, I see your point, but honestly for me, the only kind of music I don't like is hard rock or sounds like Pearl Jam or the Foo Fighters.

The more "rock" something is, the more it sucks is my take in 2017.

washedup20
Location: the little apple
Joined: 08.19.2014

Aug 13 @ 4:06 PM ET
Thing with Eichel is he has to show it. And on both sides of the puck. Otherwise he's a Stamkos or Tavares and not a superstar. He has to look interested occasionally.
- walshyleafsfan


Poor management and horrible coaching. Forcing a young, speedy player to hold back and play a slow system designed to protect small leads created that uninterested look.

Hoping/expecting Housley loosens the reigns and then we will see what we all expect Eichel to be.
ZechsMarquise
Boston Bruins
Location: near St. Louis, IL
Joined: 01.22.2016

Aug 13 @ 4:53 PM ET
I like it's trashiness. And I liked the Joker. The extended cut really makes it a better movie.

My only complaint is that it should have been R rated.

- James_Tanner


100% agree it should have been R rated. I just don't like the Joker and Harley Quinn's relationship portrayed in mainstream media because it romanticizes an abusive relationship . I will have to check out the extended cut sometime though and see if it sways my opinion on the movie.
off-topic but have you seen the movie Birdman starring Michael Keaton?
Larsson_fan
Edmonton Oilers
Joined: 10.08.2016

Aug 13 @ 5:12 PM ET
Death from Above is just bass and drums, no? They don't sound anything like Arcade Fire - it's like saying INXS and the Beatles sound alike.

I guess if you don't like synthy stuff, I see your point, but honestly for me, the only kind of music I don't like is hard rock or sounds like Pearl Jam or the Foo Fighters.

The more "rock" something is, the more it sucks is my take in 2017.

- James_Tanner

MAINSTREAM Rock is dead as roadkill.....but there are a tonne of excellent Rock Revival bands out there that have been around for 15 years or more. Scandinavian Rock in particular is so good, but nobody in North America pays any attention because the music industry isnt pushing rock music and the musicians arent 20 yr old marketable heart throbs. Great rock is out there, but you gotta look a little deeper than the college charts.


Giuda- Italy

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=d7Ib0KLtRP8

Hellacopters- Sweden

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hEUTJ5GwCaE



Cant find a link right now but check out the Canibales from Mexico if you get a chance.

EDIT: " ORiginal" or " Fresh" is an overrated concept. There a very few fresh ideas, its just a creative new spin on old sounds and song structures. Before you say that sucks, remember how much you applauded Guns n Roses. I love GnR but they werent doing anything but drawing from their influences.
BatFan88
Buffalo Sabres
Location: Buffalo, NY
Joined: 01.10.2016

Aug 13 @ 5:24 PM ET
100% agree it should have been R rated. I just don't like the Joker and Harley Quinn's relationship portrayed in mainstream media because it romanticizes an abusive relationship . I will have to check out the extended cut sometime though and see if it sways my opinion on the movie.
off-topic but have you seen the movie Birdman starring Michael Keaton?

- ZechsMarquise


Thats literally Joker and Harley Quinns relationship though..
fitz91
New York Islanders
Joined: 10.20.2014

Aug 13 @ 6:22 PM ET
MINUS: False equivalencies, cowards, racists.


But then you say


MINUS: Weird how everyone is talking about a Draisaitl contract, but not a William Nylander one.


Nylanders has one more year left on his ELC where as Draisaitl needs a contract this year. Its being talk about because of another one of your points

PLUS: Not even a month until training camp.
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