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Forums :: Blog World :: Bill Meltzer: Meltzer's Musings: Couturier Still Capable of Higher Production
Author Message
jaws1955
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Blairstown, NJ
Joined: 12.30.2015

Jul 24 @ 7:34 AM ET
Sad, but true
No wonder so many good folks don't post here anymore

- BiggE


all I can chime in with is that if all some people see in Coots is lack of point total while being one of the top shut down centers in the league and if he is "overrated in some ones book" I am very happy that he does not have any say in how Coots is used.
(not you BiggE)
My be time for an additional moto.
We already have "see the clown, scroll down"

Best I can do on short notice. Maybe some thing like
"see that logo, bounce it out like a pogo"

If we don't take the bait, maybe they get bored and move on.
BiggE
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: SELL THE DAMN TEAM!
Joined: 04.17.2012

Jul 24 @ 7:46 AM ET
all I can chime in with is that if all some people see in Coots is lack of point total while being one of the top shut down centers in the league and if he is "overrated in some ones book" I am very happy that he does not have any say in how Coots is used.
(not you BiggE)
My be time for an additional moto.
We already have "see the clown, scroll down"

Best I can do on short notice. Maybe some thing like
"see that logo, bounce it out like a pogo"

If we don't take the bait, maybe they get bored and move on.

- jaws1955

Yup, there are a few who I don't even bother to read what they post and one who constantly tries to bait me that I just completely ignore.
joegreif17
Location: Hockeyville, BC
Joined: 05.10.2009

Jul 24 @ 11:35 PM ET
JULY 24 Couter better perform, I just traded D. Krejci for him I now have the flyers top six potentially. Got way younger and Krejci has always been an sick bay resident.
MountainHockey
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 07.21.2016

Jul 25 @ 12:56 PM ET
My takeaway from this article is that it strengthens my doubts about Hakstol's ability to quickly see chemistry between players and to make the most of that. The fact that he never seemed to notice the results-proven chemistry between Couturier and Schenn, and had Raffl bringing down Giroux for over half the season, and virtually never tried Konecny with Giroux (imo the only two players who can keep up with eachother mentally and physically), and that he keeps Amac with Provorov almost all the time (Amac is 2nd in ice time on the Flyers which is distressing; also Provorov's stats without Amac are night and day), the fact that he sat Konecny for 5 straight games and Ghost for multiple games when he was the best PP Dman and your team ONLY scored on the PP...all of these examples of Hakstol's personnel usage are really troubling to me. I hope he's learning, but I'm not confident at all. I think that's a skill you either have or you don't. A coach with this kind of vision should see these things pretty much instantly and act on them decisively. Look what Mike Sullivan did with a Pittsburgh team that was flailing early in 2015; he saw what he had and, with a nod to Andy Reid, he put them in the best position to succeed. Coaching matters. I don't dislike Hakstol and I'm not necessarily on the warpath for him, but I just hope Hextall is paying attention and acts on it if need be.
MJL
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Candyland, PA
Joined: 09.20.2007

Jul 25 @ 5:24 PM ET
My takeaway from this article is that it strengthens my doubts about Hakstol's ability to quickly see chemistry between players and to make the most of that. The fact that he never seemed to notice the results-proven chemistry between Couturier and Schenn, and had Raffl bringing down Giroux for over half the season, and virtually never tried Konecny with Giroux (imo the only two players who can keep up with eachother mentally and physically), and that he keeps Amac with Provorov almost all the time (Amac is 2nd in ice time on the Flyers which is distressing; also Provorov's stats without Amac are night and day), the fact that he sat Konecny for 5 straight games and Ghost for multiple games when he was the best PP Dman and your team ONLY scored on the PP...all of these examples of Hakstol's personnel usage are really troubling to me. I hope he's learning, but I'm not confident at all. I think that's a skill you either have or you don't. A coach with this kind of vision should see these things pretty much instantly and act on them decisively. Look what Mike Sullivan did with a Pittsburgh team that was flailing early in 2015; he saw what he had and, with a nod to Andy Reid, he put them in the best position to succeed. Coaching matters. I don't dislike Hakstol and I'm not necessarily on the warpath for him, but I just hope Hextall is paying attention and acts on it if need be.
- MountainHockey


I think you're assuming things here as facts and really showing a lack of insight. I'm not sure what you're basing Hakstol not being able to recognize things on. A coaches job is to not just get one player in the right spot, but to try find a chemistry for the entire team. That was a struggle last season, but not because of Hakstol's lack of insight but because of a combination of a lack of talent and players having poor seasons. Any coach in that situation would experiment with line combos a great deal to try and right that ship.

Giroux is not the greatest skater in the world so pretty much any player on the team can keep up with him. Giroux had an awful season last year at 5 on 5 and that's nobody's fault but Giroux's and the possibility that he was effected physically by the hip issues. Raffl is a player that can play anywhere in the lineup effectively, and it is false to state that Raffl brought Giroux down.

As far as benching Gostisbehere and Konecny, here is what Hakstol saw that you apparently didn't, Gostisbehere's defensive game and fundamentals completely broke down. Poor stick positioning, poor decision making, and poor positioning all led to him being a train wreck in how own end. It is far more important to correct those issues and sometimes a young player needs to be sat down and given a breather to get his game back together.

Same with Konecny. His puck management and decision making was also poor. Both need to correct those issues moving forward to become better players. Both have the talent and skill but they need to learn to play the right way. That is far more important to the Flyers moving forward than those 5 games are, and Hakstol was absolutely correct in sitting them down.

The Flyers, other than Provorov, don't have a legitimate top pair defenseman, nor do they have a legitimate top defense pair. So they had to use players such as MacDonald in spots that he doesn't belong in. They wanted to keep Gudas and Provorov apart to balance out the pairings. Since MacDOnald played with Provorov and also on the top defense pairing on the PK, that's why his ice time was as high as it was. MacDonald is a reliable veteran defender who is one of the better defensive defenseman on the team, so he was used in that role. This is the kind of stuff that happens whn you lack talent.

As far as stats when Provorov was away from MacDonald, what was the sample size, the game situations, and how were the teammates different? Of course they were better.

The Sullivan comparison is not a good one. Completely different teams and situations.

I'm not saying Hakstol is perfect or even a proven coach at this point, because the jury is still out. I just think the criticisms you alluded to hear are not well thought out. Not many coaches could have worked miracles with that lineup and how they played.
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