This is 100% true. Sadly, the way that "possession" is defined by the stat heads is not by having the puck, it's by shot attempts for/against.
- jmatchett383

RW is still trying to use "possession stats" to show Beau Bennett is a top 6 player.

Theres no way to make the cap work. Vegas doesn't want dead cap unless we would give them a 1st and I don't think eakin is worth a 1st.
- sditulli

Exactly, which is why picks / prospects for Karlsson, Lindberg, or Haula makes perfect sense.

* The Pens would have the cap room to extend Dumo and Sheary and fit one of these three 3Cs under the cap

* The Pens don't have to trade a valuable roster player

* Vegas doesn't add a roster player which they have too many of already

* Vegas doesn't add salary

Right now, Vegas is a clearinghouse store of players for what other teams need. Most teams have their rosters pretty well set with the exception of one or two players. Trying to figure out equitable trades between two almost set teams that benefit both teams is fraught with difficulty.

You can bang your head against a wall trying to figure out a trade of player A for player B when a first round pick (+/-) for one of Karlsson, Lindberg, or Haula is done in an instant and both teams benefit.

I'm sure JR is just waiting for the price to come down.

you get lost and misguided going solely on your statistical numbers (as you did in your analysis).

Statistical breakdown forces you to ask questions, though you have to be careful in your interpretation. Did this young player loose ability to produce bigger scoring numbers. Can his skill translate to better scoring totals if used in a different role, with different players - Penguins play a different system. How might this player's mindset be while under Lindy Ruff's direction.. The North Stars were a bad team, defensively, with in experience and less than capable defensemen and goaltenders last season.

How would you expect Eakin to thrive, or produce good stat's in that scenario? The bottom line is, your GM and scouts recall the player Eakin recall his potential when he turned pro. Is there a reasonable expectation to find Eakin may tap into that lifeline? Is he aggressive, chippy, good on draws or anything else that endears him . towards ....yes, earning a spot in training camp.

Timing is critical vis -a-vis value attached to a player in some situations right now as compared to the end of training camp or beyond. What ptice do you pay. What is the opportunity cost. Is EAKIN EVER TO BE CONSIDERED A POTENTIAL GEM IN A PENGUINS UNIFORM, IN A THIRD LINE ROLE a la J Staahl history showed. Just presenting a point- or- view. The GM HAS TO DECIDE IF HE REALLY LIKS EAKIN OR IS INTEREST LUKEWARM
- jhawk59

INB4 Guentzel, Sheary, Rust, and Dumo are dumped to clear up room for Crosby and Malkins 14M/yr contract extensions.

Im pretty sure before Schenn got traded you would have said he wasnt available either... Because the "insiders" sure didnt sound like they seen it coming or knew about it and nobody reported about it early until it was almost confirmed... He also didnt go for much at all considering it was Lehtera and a 1st... and Sprong, Maatta and a 1st for a 32year old eric Staal but it only takes a very bad year from Lehtera and a 1st to get a 25 year old 55-60 point scorer in Brayden Schenn??? That doesnt near add up....
- pens4life-66

They got 2 1st round picks for schenn (though took on lehtera whose an awful contract). A little thing happened that made schenn available. The top center in the draft fell to their pick maybe schenn expendable.

They got 2 1st round picks for schenn (though took on lehtera whose an awful contract). A little thing happened that made schenn available. The top center in the draft fell to their pick maybe schenn expendable.
- sditulli

My bad about the 2nd 1st. And yes lehteras contract is brutal. My point is even bobby Mac said "I did not see schenn being moved this offseason." So unless you knew it was coming before him congrats! Good work. Report it here next time. Id also like a list of the centres that are available at the moment....

Exactly, which is why picks / prospects for Karlsson, Lindberg, or Haula makes perfect sense.

* The Pens would have the cap room to extend Dumo and Sheary and fit one of these three 3Cs under the cap

* The Pens don't have to trade a valuable roster player

* Vegas doesn't add a roster player which they have too many of already

* Vegas doesn't add salary

Right now, Vegas is a clearinghouse store of players for what other teams need. Most teams have their rosters pretty well set with the exception of one or two players. Trying to figure out equitable trades between two almost set teams that benefit both teams is fraught with difficulty.

You can bang your head against a wall trying to figure out a trade of player A for player B when a first round pick (+/-) for one of Karlsson, Lindberg, or Haula is done in an instant and both teams benefit.

I'm sure JR is just waiting for the price to come down.
- T-Train

Those guys aren't worth a 1st...maybe a 2nd. We could have just signed jokinen for a similar player. They are something between good 4c to average 3c. Rutherford maybe just blew the 4c position this year. We had equal options to what we are discussing in free agency which didn't include giving up draft capital. I always thought trading a wing for a center was the way to go in order to get a really good 3c (low end 2c to above average 3c) but nothing materialized and the best buy cheap deals/signings are gone. Have to wait for mid-season retooling now.

Eakin would be more than sufficient to the play third line,Hell you could of signed Moore or Boyle? those guys are obviously suited for the fourth line! But point being imho,with Crosby and Geno,as your one and two up the middle, and the good quality wingers the pens have they should be able to three peat rather easily! (baring major injuries! ) A side from Tampa their's no one really in their way! Why should the gm trade any picks/prospects or players? Why not just sign Winnik or?? He's big!,and can still skate, not sure of his faceoff or percentages? I know he doesn't score much but scoring isn't a huge issue for this club,but he is a responsible player and great veteran guy! Anyhow good luck with the rest of the offseason!

Eakin's 16' was very similar to Bonino's 17' stat wise....I dont know much about Eakin, but its not like Bonino was this great 3C they need to duplicate.

Eakin's 16' was very similar to Bonino's 17' stat wise....I dont know much about Eakin, but its not like Bonino was this great 3C they need to duplicate.
- sammy87

Eakin plays the game hard and can skate fairly quick. I'd be willing to take on him if LV can eat at least $1.35M of his salary. He can be successful with the Penguins, no doubt. That would leave us with a $2.5M 3rd line C for the next 3 years.

Those guys aren't worth a 1st...maybe a 2nd. We could have just signed jokinen for a similar player. They are something between good 4c to average 3c. Rutherford maybe just blew the 4c position this year. We had equal options to what we are discussing in free agency which didn't include giving up draft capital. I always thought trading a wing for a center was the way to go in order to get a really good 3c (low end 2c to above average 3c) but nothing materialized and the best buy cheap deals/signings are gone. Have to wait for mid-season retooling now.
- sditulli

Which is "+/-". I'm not sure how they have been scouted, but maybe one of them turns into a good 3C. People said the same about Bones before he came to the Pens. With Jussi, he is what he is and there is no more potential, only decline. But I would have taken him as the 4C for $1.1 mil in a heartbeat.

I am an Eakin fan. Have been for a while. With the right players he will only get better.

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-40636746

Interesting for my sport rugby league. Are they using this in the NHL to track the players - obviously won't give a physical total due to hits although if both teams are using it it could. Nothing points to score relatapivity but I believe it can be adapted using simple stats along with it.

It's better than Corsi!

The Dead Things need to shed salary big time. I could see a trade there. Unless Holland is pissy toward the Pens, like their fans, and still can't get over 2009.

Which is "+/-". I'm not sure how they have been scouted, but maybe one of them turns into a good 3C. People said the same about Bones before he came to the Pens. With Jussi, he is what he is and there is no more potential, only decline. But I would have taken him as the 4C for $1.1 mil in a heartbeat.
- T-Train

Bones averaged 44.5 points per season his prior 2 seasons. He was already a 3c with some offense that was good on the pk. You are essentially talking about stop-gap 3c who are good 4c. Not worth a 1st round pick. And vegas might sell low one of them to clear a roster spot at some point. If we don't add a 3c and they are looking to dump I'd grab one for a 4th round pick if we don't find a 3c before the season. Save the 1st for a in-season trade. We need the currency if we suffer an injury and really need to add; like a david perron type trade. A 1st gets you a guy of his skilll level at a minimum (when we acquired him he was of higher value).

The Dead Things need to shed salary big time. I could see a trade there. Unless Holland is pissy toward the Pens, like their fans, and still can't get over 2009.
- T-Train

LMAO nobody cares about 2009 buddy.

You can have Helm.

Eakin plays the game hard and can skate fairly quick. I'd be willing to take on him if LV can eat at least $1.35M of his salary. He can be successful with the Penguins, no doubt. That would leave us with a $2.5M 3rd line C for the next 3 years.
- Barnaby36

I am an Eakin fan. Have been for a while. With the right players he will only get better.
- powerhouse

LMAO nobody cares about 2009 buddy.

You can have Helm.
- Feds91Stammer

Good one x2

LMAO nobody cares about 2009 buddy.

You can have Helm.
- Feds91Stammer

Hey Feds is Helm that bad right now? I know his salary sucks but he used to be a good player.

Bones averaged 44.5 points per season his prior 2 seasons. He was already a 3c with some offense that was good on the pk. You are essentially talking about stop-gap 3c who are good 4c. Not worth a 1st round pick. And vegas might sell low one of them to clear a roster spot at some point. If we don't add a 3c and they are looking to dump I'd grab one for a 4th round pick if we don't find a 3c before the season. Save the 1st for a in-season trade. We need the currency if we suffer an injury and really need to add; like a david perron type trade. A 1st gets you a guy of his skilll level at a minimum (when we acquired him he was of higher value).
- sditulli

That's when Bones was 26+ years old and getting a lot of minutes. Before that, not much. These guys are 24-26 years old and haven't had an elevated role yet. So fine, offer a 2nd round or later pick and see if they bite if one of these guys is on their radar as someone with potential and a fit.

There's also Marchessault. He'd cost a bit more to acquire - I'd give up a 1st for him. But he has one year before UFA whereas the other guys have multiple years or control after this year.

Center seems like a position that you wouldn't want a TDL rental. I would rather they developed some chemistry with their wingers over the course of a season and get used to the system.

Hey Feds is Helm that bad right now? I know his salary sucks but he used to be a good player.
- Barnaby36

He sucks and he's injured all the time. I wouldn't want him as a 4C, let alone a 3C. $3.85 mil for the next 4 years - good luck with that.

He sucks and he's injured all the time. I wouldn't want him as a 4C, let alone a 3C. $3.85 mil for the next 4 years - good luck with that.
- T-Train

LAICH is out there and he probably brings the same as Helm right now.

Aston-Reese, Simon and Sprong will give us some options moving forward.

Would you guys be interested in MIKE FISHER ($2-2.5M) and MATT CULLEN ($1M)?

They are both free right now and I certainly would love to give a 1 year deal for each.

ThreePeat and DEPTH at center.

Crosby.. Sheary Guentzel
Malkin.. Rust Kessel
Fisher.. Hagelin Hörnqvist
Cullen.. Wilson Rowney (Reaves)

Totally fine with this.

LAICH is out there and he probably brings the same as Helm right now.

Aston-Reese, Simon and Sprong will give us some options moving forward.
- Barnaby36

Brooks Laich has sucked for years. None of the guys you just mentioned play center. Helm is also horrendous.

Would you guys be interested in MIKE FISHER ($2-2.5M) and MATT CULLEN ($1M)?

They are both free right now and I certainly would love to give a 1 year deal for each.

ThreePeat and DEPTH at center.

Crosby.. Sheary Guentzel
Malkin.. Rust Kessel
Fisher.. Hagelin Hörnqvist
Cullen.. Wilson Rowney (Reaves)

Totally fine with this.
- Barnaby36

I like Mike Fisher as a 3C but I also think he's a stay in Nashville or retire guy. He's like Tom Brady in the sense that his wife makes way more than he does, and her livelihood is tied to Nashville.