Disagree. Bollig ragdolled Tootoo and only lost 1 fight as a Hawk (to McGrattan).
- Murph76

When Toews came back from his concussion late in 2012 vs STL, Scott beat the living hell out of Reaves and Kane was whooping it up on the bench.

I loved the 80s and early 90s hockey when skill guys and heavy weights were both an attraction each game. Those days are long gone......and if a guy can't be a formidable player outside of fighting, he won't play in the NHL.

Curious what you Chicago baseball fans think about what the White Sox are doing.

As a Sox fan, I am both excited/scared. 5-6 prospects in the overall top 30 in baseball, 2-3 awesome power arms and lots of overall pitching quality depth.

But it's also all sunshine and roses with prospects, no guarantees of success.

As a HAWK fan, honestly, this is the kind of rebuild I would like to see the Hawks do in 3-5 years. Tear the whole thing down, stock up on HIGH quality prospects and high picks—not the best of the scratch and dent bin and a slow slide to mediocrity like Detroit has.

Really tank for 3 years or so, then come back like the team did from 07-10.

Thoughts?
- John Jaeckel

I think it's the right move. And Sox fans are excited about the future. Moncada has already been called up to Chicago and I suspect some more kids will get a look and then next year I think Rodon, Giolitto and Lopez may well be in the rotation next season.

The Sox are absolutely LOADED with pitchers in the system, I have no less than 10 with starting rotation potential, with 3 or 4 having elite status. A few of those guys won't pan out, a few others will be destined for the pen, but the amount of pitching depth is extensive.

The Sox have a terrific looking group of outfielders in the system, most in Higher A, with prospects like Rutherford, Eloys and Robert head line this group. The Sox have some depth too, Basabe (part of the Sale deal) has very high upside (though not as blue chip as Eloys). The Sox still have some decent depth behind those guys. So Pitcher and OF look great.

Corners look OK, maybe good. Burger, Sheets, DelMonico, even Davidson promise to compete at the corner. Collins, a top catching prospect is not a guarantee to make it in MLB as catcher, but he should hit, so I could see him at 1 or DH in 2 years.

Sox ONLY weakness is at C and MI depth. Moncada and Anderson are terrific up the middle, but after that nothing, though Hahn did grab former Rangers SS spec Yeyson Yrizarri. He has tons of tools, a + arm, but questions about his range at SS and the fact he swings at literally EVERYTHING may limit his potential upside. Though he's got talent.

I'd like to see Hahn bring in one more MI prospect and would love to see them land a defensive minded catcher who can handle pitchers well, especially as the Sox enter this era where they will have a full rotation of under 25 year old players.

They still have a couple guys they could trade and what likely will be a Top 3 draft pick next season to continue adding young talent.

Next year the team should pretty well stink again, but I think the 2nd half of the season you could see some signs. Then they should be competitive and fun by 2019 with 2020 being their ETA to really compete.

Curious what you Chicago baseball fans think about what the White Sox are doing.

As a Sox fan, I am both excited/scared. 5-6 prospects in the overall top 30 in baseball, 2-3 awesome power arms and lots of overall pitching quality depth.

But it's also all sunshine and roses with prospects, no guarantees of success.

As a HAWK fan, honestly, this is the kind of rebuild I would like to see the Hawks do in 3-5 years. Tear the whole thing down, stock up on HIGH quality prospects and high picks—not the best of the scratch and dent bin and a slow slide to mediocrity like Detroit has.

Really tank for 3 years or so, then come back like the team did from 07-10.

Thoughts?
- John Jaeckel

i'm really pleased in what the White Sox have gotten in return. They are 3 years away, probably, from being quite good.

Watch reruns of the '91 season - especially the opening of game one against the Stars.

Not. A. Slow. Game. At. All.
- Return of the Roar

Agreed far from it.....when the Devils rose up in the mid 90s to the lockout the game was garbage.

Before that, the game was fantastic.

Too many clones of Bernstein think the 80s and early 90s were just fights, and forget all the scoring........yes athletes got bigger, stronger, faster, and equipment got better......but we will never see guys put up those types of points again.

I think the Hawks are an injury away in almost any top 6 / top 4 (plus goalie) position from that: Toews, Kane, Anisimov, Saad, Seabrook - where is the even temporary back-up to plug anything more than a week's worth of injury?
- StLBravesFan

what top team isn't an injury away from being border line playoff team?

I can't name one..........

Let's not forget big AL Secord!!!
- FourOrr

AL was great but I thought very overstep as a fighter . His fights for the most part were boring. Seemed to mostly wrestle

what top team isn't an injury away from being border line playoff team?

I can't name one..........
- SteveRain

Pittsburgh

Curious what you Chicago baseball fans think about what the White Sox are doing.

As a Sox fan, I am both excited/scared. 5-6 prospects in the overall top 30 in baseball, 2-3 awesome power arms and lots of overall pitching quality depth.

But it's also all sunshine and roses with prospects, no guarantees of success.

As a HAWK fan, honestly, this is the kind of rebuild I would like to see the Hawks do in 3-5 years. Tear the whole thing down, stock up on HIGH quality prospects and high picks—not the best of the scratch and dent bin and a slow slide to mediocrity like Detroit has.

Really tank for 3 years or so, then come back like the team did from 07-10.

Thoughts?
- John Jaeckel

Boy, my thought is that this is an apples and oragnges situation. Sox had some really nice players with really great contracts to trade in essentially a non-capped league. They got huge future value for Sale, Eaton and now Quintana.

In a hard cap league, selling off your roster has little or no value. Compare what Sox got for Sale to what Hawks might get for Seabs in 3 years? Or Keith, Craw, Toews, etc, etc.

To me, the key is the MIDDLE of the roster. Hawks had 6-9 highly paid stars...the top. Then they had 2-5 interchangable rockford level rookies, role players, fill-ins...the bottom. But I claim what won them cups, especially the last two, were guys on $1-2.5m contracts that were way above fill-in quality players. Saad, Shaw, Krug, Leddy, Darling. I'm sure I'm missing a few.

The Hawks are going to be a top-heavy team for many years, especially as long as $21m of the cap is going to two players. Their key to success is to get 2-5 rookie level players to play like top 6 or 4D. Schmaltz or Hartman or whomever to take a big step up.

Curious what you Chicago baseball fans think about what the White Sox are doing.

As a Sox fan, I am both excited/scared. 5-6 prospects in the overall top 30 in baseball, 2-3 awesome power arms and lots of overall pitching quality depth.

But it's also all sunshine and roses with prospects, no guarantees of success.

As a HAWK fan, honestly, this is the kind of rebuild I would like to see the Hawks do in 3-5 years. Tear the whole thing down, stock up on HIGH quality prospects and high picks—not the best of the scratch and dent bin and a slow slide to mediocrity like Detroit has.

Really tank for 3 years or so, then come back like the team did from 07-10.

Thoughts?
- John Jaeckel

I'm a Cub fan but I think the Sox are doing it the right way. For the last few years Kenny Williams and the Sox always said they were going for it every season but in reality they really were never at that stage where they were one player away from being a legit contender. They always felt the fan base would not support a rebuild. I think they were wrong about that. Even being a Cub fan I can feel a Sox buzz among their fans.

Now with reference to the Hawks their day is coming where they have to decide if they are going to be that team that trys to go for it every year or go the tear down route. The question is will the fan base support that. Seeing what the Cubs did makes be more supportive of doing the tear down when the time is right instead of falling into perpetual mediocrity. Would Bowman be the guy able to do that sort of thing. I don't know. I don't consider him as hockey's version of Theo Epstein.

I think it's the right move. And Sox fans are excited about the future. Moncada has already been called up to Chicago and I suspect some more kids will get a look and then next year I think Rodon, Giolitto and Lopez may well be in the rotation next season.

The Sox are absolutely LOADED with pitchers in the system, I have no less than 10 with starting rotation potential, with 3 or 4 having elite status. A few of those guys won't pan out, a few others will be destined for the pen, but the amount of pitching depth is extensive.

The Sox have a terrific looking group of outfielders in the system, most in Higher A, but with prospects like Rutherford, Eloys and Robert head line this group. The Sox have some depth too, Basabe (part of the Sale deal) has very high upside (though not as blue chip as Eloys). The Sox still have some decent depth behind those guys. So Pitcher and OF look great.

Corners look OK, maybe good. Burger, Sheets, DelMonico, even Davidson promise to compete at the corner. Collins, a top catching prospect is not a guarantee to make it in MLB as catcher, but he should hit, so I could see him at 1 or DH in 2 years.

Sox ONLY weakness is at C and MI depth. Moncada and Anderson are terrific up the middle, but after that nothing, though Hahn did grab former Rangers SS spec Yeyson Yrizarri. He has tons of tools, a + arm, but questions about his range at SS and the fact he swings at literally EVERYTHING may limit his potential upside. Though he's got talent.

I'd like to see Hahn bring in one more MI prospect and would love to see them land a defensive minded catcher who can handle pitchers well, especially as the Sox enter this era where they will have a full rotation of under 25 year old players.

They still have a couple guys they could trade and what likely will be a Top 3 draft pick next season to continue adding young talent.

Next year the team should pretty well stink again, but I think the 2nd half of the season you could see some signs. Then they should be competitive and fun by 2019 with 2020 being their ETA to really compete.
- kwolf68

I think the Sox are in good shape. Will all the guys live up to their ranking? Doesn't matter.....they are in good shape with as many guys as they have.

What will be interesting to watch is they will be bad.....very bad next year and possibly the year after. The huge thing is can Reinsdorf stomach that type of financial loss when you are looking at sparsely filled crowds and a plumment in season ticket renewals? Cubs survived because Wrigley is/was/still is an event......Comiskey isn't.

I think in 2021 they are knocking on the door of being a contender assuming Hahn stays the course and spends where he needs to.

Curious what you Chicago baseball fans think about what the White Sox are doing.

As a Sox fan, I am both excited/scared. 5-6 prospects in the overall top 30 in baseball, 2-3 awesome power arms and lots of overall pitching quality depth.

But it's also all sunshine and roses with prospects, no guarantees of success.

As a HAWK fan, honestly, this is the kind of rebuild I would like to see the Hawks do in 3-5 years. Tear the whole thing down, stock up on HIGH quality prospects and high picks—not the best of the scratch and dent bin and a slow slide to mediocrity like Detroit has.

Really tank for 3 years or so, then come back like the team did from 07-10.

Thoughts?
- John Jaeckel

What the Sox are doing (now) is commendable, and I have some guarded enthusiasm going forward (for the first time in about 3-4 seasons).

My biggest concern with the Hawks is that they will get stuck in the same mindset as Van did in having 2-3 aging high end talents. They will think they still have a chance, or that they "owe it" to either the players or the fans to go for it every year until they are done.

I'm with you on the plan though. In 3-5 years, ship off the big contracts for high picks, prospects and a couple ham sandwiches and start from scratch. My fear is that they start (or continue) to give out big(ger) money contracts to "second" tier players to keep up the cup chase and this forces them to keep thinking they have a better shot than they actually do.

Curious what you Chicago baseball fans think about what the White Sox are doing.

As a Sox fan, I am both excited/scared. 5-6 prospects in the overall top 30 in baseball, 2-3 awesome power arms and lots of overall pitching quality depth.

But it's also all sunshine and roses with prospects, no guarantees of success.

As a HAWK fan, honestly, this is the kind of rebuild I would like to see the Hawks do in 3-5 years. Tear the whole thing down, stock up on HIGH quality prospects and high picks—not the best of the scratch and dent bin and a slow slide to mediocrity like Detroit has.

Really tank for 3 years or so, then come back like the team did from 07-10.

Thoughts?
- John Jaeckel

I think the rebuild model is what the plan should be as well. Seems similar or even identical to how the Leafs have grown and are poised for some big years with the likes of Matthew, Marner, Nylander, etc. leading the way.

In addition to stockpiling top-shelf prospects and high draft picks, the Hawks need to identify a new younger core to go along with the older core so there's veteran leadership for the youngsters. Who would that include? I would imagine at least Saad then you have possible candidates in Hartman, Schmaltz, and Murphy.

One thing that bothered me about the Quintana trade was that it was similar to the Sharp trade: Hahn should have made the trade during the off season and waited too long. The return was great, but I feel he could have gotten an even better deal during the off season or even at last year's TDL. I know, hindsight is always 20/20. Anyway, just feels kind of a similar situation as how Bowman handled the Sharp trade with Dallas.

Curious what you Chicago baseball fans think about what the White Sox are doing.

As a Sox fan, I am both excited/scared. 5-6 prospects in the overall top 30 in baseball, 2-3 awesome power arms and lots of overall pitching quality depth.

But it's also all sunshine and roses with prospects, no guarantees of success.

As a HAWK fan, honestly, this is the kind of rebuild I would like to see the Hawks do in 3-5 years. Tear the whole thing down, stock up on HIGH quality prospects and high picks—not the best of the scratch and dent bin and a slow slide to mediocrity like Detroit has.

Really tank for 3 years or so, then come back like the team did from 07-10.

Thoughts?
- John Jaeckel

PPPPPP

They need to start now. Need to start stockpiling draft picks and very young players that will be key 2-3rd line guys as they come out of the tankathon. And selfishly, my season tickets will improve during a down period!

When Toews came back from his concussion late in 2012 vs STL, Scott beat the living hell out of Reaves and Kane was whooping it up on the bench.

I loved the 80s and early 90s hockey when skill guys and heavy weights were both an attraction each game. Those days are long gone......and if a guy can't be a formidable player outside of fighting, he won't play in the NHL.
- SteveRain

Watch some of reeves fights, my takaways:
1. wins against much shorter opponents
2. falls to the ice fast if outmatched
3. avoids fights with tougher opponents
4. looks for the highlight reel punch or gets out of the confrontation

Curious what you Chicago baseball fans think about what the White Sox are doing.

As a Sox fan, I am both excited/scared. 5-6 prospects in the overall top 30 in baseball, 2-3 awesome power arms and lots of overall pitching quality depth.

But it's also all sunshine and roses with prospects, no guarantees of success.

As a HAWK fan, honestly, this is the kind of rebuild I would like to see the Hawks do in 3-5 years. Tear the whole thing down, stock up on HIGH quality prospects and high picks—not the best of the scratch and dent bin and a slow slide to mediocrity like Detroit has.

Really tank for 3 years or so, then come back like the team did from 07-10.



Thoughts?
- John Jaeckel

I think the other important point is the Sox basically have zero issues with contracts moving forward. At some point they should be able to supplement the kids with free agents. It almost is like they are an expansion franchise at this point with all options on the table.

Curious what you Chicago baseball fans think about what the White Sox are doing.

As a Sox fan, I am both excited/scared. 5-6 prospects in the overall top 30 in baseball, 2-3 awesome power arms and lots of overall pitching quality depth.

But it's also all sunshine and roses with prospects, no guarantees of success.

As a HAWK fan, honestly, this is the kind of rebuild I would like to see the Hawks do in 3-5 years. Tear the whole thing down, stock up on HIGH quality prospects and high picks—not the best of the scratch and dent bin and a slow slide to mediocrity like Detroit has.

Really tank for 3 years or so, then come back like the team did from 07-10.

Thoughts?
- John Jaeckel

Like what they have been doing. Still think they have another card or two up their sleeve. Trade and rebuild with what you get back.

PPPPPP

They need to start now. Need to start stockpiling draft picks and very young players that will be key 2-3rd line guys as they come out of the tankathon. And selfishly, my season tickets will improve during a down period!
- riozzo

You read that poop about Mike Trout and Bryce Harper (not a fan)... anyway, the usual sports writers were "speculating" a Mike Trout to Cubs trade... of course in that trade, you are losing Schwarber, Baez, Hayward, and about 3-4 prospects.

Although you are losing a ton of valuables...

Trout
Bryant
Rizzo
Russell
Zobrist

Wow... Not a Cubs fan, but another starter will do them a solid in the postseason

No that doesn't seem like an agent's argument. I think it's a really good, fair assessment of hs strengths (and areas where he's not going to be as good).

I haven't seen him nearly as much as you have Wiz. But just going by what I have seen and heard and going by what I know of the game, I think he can potentially be really effective as you describe—sort of an opportunistic pest and a guy who can be productive—with the right linemates.

I also think he is going to have to adjust his game to the pros, where he will have to be smarter and play within himself because he WILL NOT be superman in the pros as he was in the O. put another way, pro speed and defenders are going to take things away from him which were relatively easy in junior. He will need to adjust and find his "productivity" in the pros.
- John Jaeckel

JJ if you have some time take a listen to the first six minutes or so of Powers and Hedgers podcast, they had some great insight into DeBrincat.

https://soundcloud.com/th...podcast-prospects-edition

Hedger:

Just one point mentioned was that one of his biggest strength's that was a common theme among the three guys I talk to with, is that he is able to adjust his game to other great players.

Definitely worth a listen.

Watch some of reeves fights, my takaways:
1. wins against much shorter opponents
2. falls to the ice fast if outmatched
3. avoids fights with tougher opponents
4. looks for the highlight reel punch or gets out of the confrontation
- riozzo

The David Backes school of hockey confrontation... Reaves is a disciple. He picks his spots very carefully. Would have loved to see Reaves have to deal with a Kocur or Grimson. He would have been a red stain on the ice. Basil McRae may be a comp in that era but even Basil stepped up once in a while to fight a Kocur or Probert straight up.

Curious what you Chicago baseball fans think about what the White Sox are doing.

As a Sox fan, I am both excited/scared. 5-6 prospects in the overall top 30 in baseball, 2-3 awesome power arms and lots of overall pitching quality depth.

But it's also all sunshine and roses with prospects, no guarantees of success.

As a HAWK fan, honestly, this is the kind of rebuild I would like to see the Hawks do in 3-5 years. Tear the whole thing down, stock up on HIGH quality prospects and high picks—not the best of the scratch and dent bin and a slow slide to mediocrity like Detroit has.

Really tank for 3 years or so, then come back like the team did from 07-10.

Thoughts?
- John Jaeckel

See, this is what the cap does. It causes good teams to be bad.
How far would the 2010 hocks have gone if THEY could pay their players and not have to trade them so the players could get the money they earned? Nobody knows. So now it's this. Draft or find diamonds in the rough and hope to build a team with a "core " of highly skilled players.

There needs to be cap relief for players you draft and bring up through your system. Some way to keep the talent that you helped to nurture.

The fact that you have to ask the question, stinks.

....

I certainly wouldn't worry about Debrincat if I were a Hawks fan. Some guys light up the OHL and are ready for the NHL immediately. Most of them need more time to develop into NHL players. A player like Debrincat definitely isn't ready to be a star in the NHL yet, but he's got a lot of the things that you can't teach in his toolbox.

I fully expect him to be a big difference maker in the league once he's ready to play in it.

Curious what you Chicago baseball fans think about what the White Sox are doing.

As a Sox fan, I am both excited/scared. 5-6 prospects in the overall top 30 in baseball, 2-3 awesome power arms and lots of overall pitching quality depth.

But it's also all sunshine and roses with prospects, no guarantees of success.

As a HAWK fan, honestly, this is the kind of rebuild I would like to see the Hawks do in 3-5 years. Tear the whole thing down, stock up on HIGH quality prospects and high picks—not the best of the scratch and dent bin and a slow slide to mediocrity like Detroit has.

Really tank for 3 years or so, then come back like the team did from 07-10.

Thoughts?
- John Jaeckel

As a casual baseball fan I can't say I'm too terribly interested, but I will say that, IMO, the Sox are taking the right approach for doing a rebuild - no pu$$yfooting around - tear it down and rebuild from the ground up. The last thing a team that needs a rebuild should do is tinker around the edges.

As a casual baseball fan I can't say I'm too terribly interested, but I will say that, IMO, the Sox are taking the right approach for doing a rebuild - no pu$$yfooting around - tear it down and rebuild from the ground up. The last thing a team that needs a rebuild should do is tinker around the edges.
- EbonyRaptor

You and Chunk summarized it best. If you're going to rebuild, tear it down completely and work your way up again with strong drafting and prospect development.

A younger core to provide the leadership and veteran presence is still needed, so that's another thing the Hawks need to bite the bullet with: a new identified core will not be as strong (likely not even close) as the current or recent core.

This is the concern, This kind of deal. They are not gonna stop.
I guess I will be very happy because as they continue these signings, these deals will they will break the current agreement with the Cap as it is...
Colton Parayko
They drafted the kid out of the AJHL he goes to college, signs his first entry level deal and after two NHL seasons he gets a THIRD yr deal at 5.5 million.
He always had the shot, but now has scored 13 nhl goals and 4 post season goals.

again no bridge deal,

More than Hammer, almost as much as Keith's deal.

I am not trying to downplay the position he will be asked to play, just the fact that his third NHl is a 5.5 mil figure.
- wiz1901

This does seem to be becoming the trend skip the bridge. Although it's actually not new, it's the same thing the Blackhawks did with Toews and Kane when they were signed for five years at $6,300,000 back in 2010/11. It was the same thing Saad was looking for at the end of his ELC. The problem is there's a limited number of these a team can afford to do.

Red Wings and reps for Tomas Tatar in arbitration.

http://www.freep.com/stor...ar-arbitration/494995001/